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RedEyedGhost

Watch, Watched, Watching: I missed the last thread?

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3 hours ago, Caligula_K3 said:

After the premiere, the island action is pretty bad too.

I agree that up to Richard's episode the island action is pretty boring and even ridiculous - 

Spoiler

Like, oh here's the Lighthouse somehow no one ever noticed before.  I agree that The Substitute is a good episode though - Ben's redemption is one of my favorite parts of the season.  Also - John's funeral is great - Lepidus:  "Craziest damn funeral I've ever been to."

The island action post-Richard episode is pretty solid though.

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Posted (edited)

Been tearing through Better Call Saul over the past couple weeks with my wife. We both love Breaking Bad and enjoyed El Camino so it's a wonder it took both of us so long to start BCS. I remember always wondering if a show centered on Saul (Jimmy) would work , and how the comedic relief shady lawyer in BB could lead the show, but damn, all concerns were expelled a couple episodes in. Maybe even by the end of the first ep. Odenkirk kills it. They really keep spirit of BB alive in this show, too. From the cold opens to the writing and action, it feels like BB. Really fun to see how the origins of some of the BB characters come to life in BCS.

We're finishing the fourth season tonight or tomorrow. That's all Netflix has up right now. Is S5 on tv right now? or will be? I've been afraid to google it cause I figure I'll see a spoiler. 

Edited by l2 0 5 5

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On 8/22/2020 at 6:16 PM, DMC said:

Oh c'mon.  The door-shutting does not mean it's basically over.  He still had the opportunity for redemption after that.  That's why Kay says this near the beginning of two, which is a callback to one:

Michael's story isn't over until the final scene in Two where half of his face is shadowed.

I mean almost any character has the potential for redemption. But is he still conflicted in II? Does he change at all? That's not how I remember it. I've seen it three or four times, but not for years so maybe Is should watch both of them again. 

I want to be clear though I'm not saying "The Godfather Part II is bad." It's still very good and I'm glad it exists. I just don't think it's on the same level as the first. When people cite it as "the sequel that's better than the original" I roll my eyes a little. (Like in scream 2 when the kid from Dawson's Creek says it and the whole film class agrees.) 

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2 minutes ago, Triskele said:

BCS never ceasing to amaze me.  It is so good and so surprisingly good in that it's good in all of these ways that I never imagined when I first heard about the plan for the spinoff.  

Don't question Vince Gillighan is the lesson, I guess.  

Agreed. I forgot how much I love Mike Ehrmantraut, too. Can never have enough Mike in your life. What a boss.

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1 minute ago, RumHam said:

I mean almost any character has the potential for redemption. But is he still conflicted in II? Does he change at all? That's not how I remember it. I've seen it three or four times, but not for years so maybe Is should watch both of them again. 

He's still trying to go legitimate throughout most of the second one.  He's lying to himself, sure, but that's kinda the point.  By the end, he's no longer even pretending to try and redeem himself.

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4 minutes ago, l2 0 5 5 said:

Been tearing through Better Call Saul over the past couple weeks with my wife. We both love Breaking Bad and enjoyed El Camino so it's a wonder it took both of us so long to start BCS. I remember always wondering if a show centered on Saul (Jimmy) would work , and how the comedic relief shady lawyer in BB could lead the show, but damn, all concerns were expelled a couple episodes in. Maybe even by the end of the first ep. Odenkirk kills it. They really keep spirit of BB alive in this show, too. From the cold opens to the writing and action, it feels like BB. Really fun to see how the origins of some of the BB characters come to life in BCS.

We're finishing the fourth season tonight or tomorrow. That's all Netflix has up right now. Is S5 on tv right now? or will be? I've been afraid to google it cause I figure I'll see a spoiler. 

Season five ended back in April. AMC has already taken the episodes off their website but netflix should have them by next spring. Great show, possibly better than breaking bad. 

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1 minute ago, RumHam said:

Season five ended back in April. AMC has already taken the episodes off their website but netflix should have them by next spring. Great show, possibly better than breaking bad. 

Damn that's so long away. 

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Posted (edited)

Just starting Teenage Bounty Hunters on Netflix.   :dunno:

Edited by SpaceChampion

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38 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

Just starting Teenage Bounty Hunters on Netflix.   :dunno:

I enjoyed it :dunno:

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On 8/20/2020 at 8:36 PM, Veltigar said:

What has James Cordon done? I don't  really follow that kind of stuff, I thought he was popular among the hoi polloi for doing karaoke in cars?

He was in a popular sitcom called Gavin and Stacey (which I didn't watch) and then he always seemed to be on chat shows/at award ceremonies, just being incredibly obnoxious.

A little while back we watched Cold Case Files on Netflix, which is kind of absorbing and horrifying at the same time. It's actually really uncomfortable viewing for the most part, witnessing the horror that those left behind have experienced. I must also say that the American expression - describing young impressionable girls who are invited somewhere to be abused/taken advantage of/raped/murdered etc as 'coming over to party' is just grossly offensive and nauseating. 

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39 minutes ago, Isis said:

He was in a popular sitcom called Gavin and Stacey (which I didn't watch) and then he always seemed to be on chat shows/at award ceremonies, just being incredibly obnoxious.

I think he at least helped write Gavin and Stacey which drew a lot of plaudits and was reasonably popular, even if it was never especially good IMO. You're right he was on everything after that.. and was never funny. Despite that his career has gone on leaps and bounds and seems to have made it in hollywood without ever having a ton of talent, but by being chirpy and chubby. He is a bit of an irritant. 

 

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On 8/22/2020 at 3:02 PM, Jaime L said:

I coincidentally recently rewatched this too. Found myself still getting swept up in it even on the second viewing. What can I say, I'm a sucker for the killer intros in this film as Creed walks to the ring. And the boxing scenes were excellent. Couldn't get over how little Michael B Jordan is. They built up Drago Jr so well that I still wasn't convinced he lost by film's end.

It was fairly ridiculous that he could possibly outbox a guy who has like 6 inches and 100 pounds on him. 

Quote

1) That they made Drago Ukrainian was a really fascinating touch! One they didn't do anything with. Coulda had a really fascinating angle where you realize Drago's "I fight for me!" line in Rocky IV is because he's a proud Ukrainian who was unwillingly conscripted into the Russian evil empire and pumped full of steroids for the glory of his country's occupiers. But instead they just ignored all that and only focused on how elite society (and Brigitte Nielsen) turned their back on Drago because he lost which is infinitely less interesting. But they did it because:

Some Ukrainians consider themselves Russian and lament the splitup of USSR.  Some hate Russia+Putin. Some feel some kinship from shared history+suffering (particularly in the two world wars), but want independence now.  There are a lot of ways to spin it, and  and they chose none of them.  Disappointing.

Quote

2) Drago can't be redeemed. Agree the moment you refer to is the finest in the film and one that humanizes him a bit. But he's still overall a massive villain and he has to stay that way because he murdered Apollo Creed. He can't have a Johnny Lawrence redemption arc for that reason. He went too far. So there's moments where the films forces you to empathize with his hardscrabble existence (not so unlike Rocky prior to fame) and as a father but it only goes so far. Despite his comeuppance he's still obsessed with avenging humiliations and "breaking" his enemies. He hasn't grown as a man. It's a shame though. There's a more interesting, more nuanced arc for Drago they could've pursued but then retreated to the simpler black and white Rocky world.

That raises an important question of just how culpable Drago is for Apollo's death.  IMO, not very.  There is no mercy in the boxing ring.  If your opponent is still standing, until the round is over you are going to keep hitting him.  The people responsible for "protecting" a boxer are the boxer himself, his corner and the ref.  All three of those failed.  Creed was over-the-hill and outclassed - he should have known better.  Rocky should have thrown in the towel at the end of the first round, or failing that, very early in the second.  And the ref definitely should have stopped the fight well before the final punches because Creed could not protect himself and wasn't really boxing by the end*. 

Now, Drago's complete lack of remorse after killing Apollo does make him a horrible man.  Most boxers share some sense of kinship with fellow boxers once the match is over, because they know that next time it might be them laying on the mat.  But Drago really embraced the "Heel" role that his handlers were pushing for him.  He was probably coached to never break character, and they had planned out how to act after the Creed win to ensure that they could get the desired match with Rocky.  So yeah, he was a douchebag back in the day, but I don't see why that means he can't be redeemed 25 years later.  I think a more complete redemption (rather than the partial redemption of Creed II) could have worked and indeed been more interesting.  Hell, people love nonsense redemption arcs - Hobbes and Shaw are best friends even though Shaw murdered Han a few movies ago (not to mention dozens of other people). 

* Yes, virtually every fight in every Rocky movie would have been stopped by the refs in reality.  Definitely Drago vs Creed, Drago vs Balboa, Drago vs Creed II and Drago vs Creed III.  The refs have cost the Drago family three championships!

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, DMC said:

I agree that up to Richard's episode the island action is pretty boring and even ridiculous - 

  Hide contents

Like, oh here's the Lighthouse somehow no one ever noticed before.  I agree that The Substitute is a good episode though - Ben's redemption is one of my favorite parts of the season.  Also - John's funeral is great - Lepidus:  "Craziest damn funeral I've ever been to."

The island action post-Richard episode is pretty solid though.

Agreed that Ben is a highlight of the last season. And that things really do pick up after the Richard episode on the island, a few dumb plot twists aside.

Spoiler

Like Sun forgetting how to speak English. Ugh.

Things do technically pick up in the flash sideways too once we get to Desmond's episode, but knowing what the ultimate destination is here really makes Desmond's plotline less enjoyable. Who cares if and when these characters "wake up" in Purgatory, or find their one true loves (aka a person they sometimes knew for one to two weeks four seasons ago)?

Better Call Saul is such a great show. My only reservation about it was that starting in season 2, and especially in seasons 3-4, the Mike and Saul parts of the show felt completely divorced, and too many of the Mike plotlines felt like Breaking Bad fan-service. But season 5 fixed that in a huge way. Fantastic season.

Edited by Caligula_K3

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53 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

Hell, people love nonsense redemption arcs - Hobbes and Shaw are best friends even though Shaw murdered Han a few movies ago (not to mention dozens of other people). 

Didn't Han magically appear at the end of one of those movies? Might have been Hobbs & Shaw.

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

Didn't Han magically appear at the end of one of those movies? Might have been Hobbs & Shaw.

I haven't seen Hobbs and Shaw.  If he did, that would be completely bullshit and totally in line with that series. 

EDIT, I looked it up:

Spoiler

Apparently Han being alive isn't revealed until F9, which isn't released yet.  Glad that we know major plot twists already though. 

 

Edited by Maithanet

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4 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

I haven't seen Hobbs and Shaw.  If he did, that would be completely bullshit and totally in line with that series. 

EDIT, I looked it up:

  Hide contents

Apparently Han being alive isn't revealed until F9, which isn't released yet.  Glad that we know major plot twists already though. 

 

Haha, just looked it up, too. Must have seen him in a trailer for the movie, since F9 was originally slated for this April, and they had already shown at least one trailer.

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44 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

Haha, just looked it up, too. Must have seen him in a trailer for the movie, since F9 was originally slated for this April, and they had already shown at least one trailer.

Yeah, it's in the trailer.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Caligula_K3 said:
Spoiler

Who cares if and when these characters "wake up" in Purgatory, or find their one true loves (aka a person they sometimes knew for one to two weeks four seasons ago)?

 

Spoiler

What really bugs me about this is Sayid and Shannon.  It's like, dude, you went on what? three dates with her.  What about the women that was your childhood love and you were searching for over much of your adult life.  Not to mention all the effort the show apparently made in trying to get Maggie Grace to show up.

 

Edited by DMC

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Maithanet said:

Hell, people love nonsense redemption arcs - Hobbes and Shaw are best friends even though Shaw murdered Han a few movies ago (not to mention dozens of other people). 

In fairness, F&F carefully and meticulously explained this one. You see Dom Toretto suffered multiple severe concussions from repeatedly ramming his car into Shaw's in Fast 7 and as a result completely forgot he murdered Han. And everyone else on his team just assumed any bald guy gets immediate and automatic admittance onto the team which, let's face it, is not unreasaonable. There's a kind of beauty in the simple elegance of the storytelling.

But yes I agree it would've been way cooler if Drago got a redemption arc. I mean Rocky reached mutual understanding with the whole of the Soviet Union despite near mutual annihilation, you think he could forgive Drago had he apologized.

Edited by Jaime L

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