Darth Sidious Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 On 8/16/2020 at 4:46 PM, James Steller said: I like that a lot but if that’s going to happen, it must mean that either (a) the two unspeakables deviated completely from GRRM’s ending, or (b), GRRM gave them an ending that he has since changed It is (a), in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven’s Spider Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 “Great houses” Targaryen/Lannister/Frey/Tully/Martell/Bolton/Greyjoy will all be gone when shes all written Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Sidious Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 1 minute ago, Bloodraven’s Spider said: “Great houses” Targaryen/Lannister/Frey/Tully/Martell/Bolton/Greyjoy will all be gone when shes all written House Stark will be a den of direwolves. Jon, Arya, Rickon will all die and earn second lives as direwolves. So yeah, they get to live a second time. A bit unfair but the plot has been carefully set up to go in that direction. Sansa will just die. Bran will be part wood. House Targaryen has to continue because Azor Ahai comes from that line. Dany is Azor Ahai. There is an Azor Ahai at the end of each cycle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Yup. Her name Their blood. 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: That remains to be seen. Arryn, Stark, Lannister, Tully have not changed name in thousands of years. Do you think Harry is the first person to be heir of a Great House though a female relative? Or is it likely that there have been others and they have simply adopted the family name? I think the most likely is they found some kid with matching hair, like Alayne, and just ran with it. Legitimizing bastards in the age of kings can always work too. Especially since bastards like Alayne have virtually no back story so theres no one to disagree. 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Last names can be changed when it comes to inheritance, we have multiple examples of this, do we not? We do not. We have one example of Luwin suggesting a change of names for Hornwood. Its something, Ill give ya that. Lollys though, while her fathers name has me confused, we can't be sure if that's her biological dad. The other ladies in question id like some quotes on 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Yes, it is. That is my point. That is why it more likely, not less, that he should he inherit he would adopt the Arryn surname. Lineage is important. It will be far easier to command the Vale vassals as an Arryn rather than a Hardyng. The Tully did fine, so does Bailish. And soon itll be Stark. 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: I concede it is possible that all three of these women may have married cousins from weaker branches of the family and that is why their children carry their last name, but that seems like a weird coincidence. Second husbands is a possibility too 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: No, you are thinking of Lady Mormont's daughter Alysane, whose children are also Mormonts. Who are you thinking of? 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: I expect she was being facetious with her story to Asha, an enemy, rather than sincerely revealing that her children are bastard bear spawn Oh, you think so? Lol 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: But even if she was telling the truth, and her children were bastards, they'd be Snows instead of Mormonts Maybe they got married too? Its a bear right, so, like the other ladies, hes a cousin from a weaker branch of the family lol 17 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Granted. What is your point? Sansa Stark is the future 18 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Yes, we are expressly told that in the books. We have been told no such thing about Winterfell now being sworn to the Dreadfort in the books. The Starks are still regarded as the rulers of the North. Roose being Warden does not change that. Ramsay being married to the Stark heir does not change that. Roose needs the Northern lords to believe that Jeyne is a Stark By whom? Who regards the Starks as the rulers? Not the IT, not Bolton . Even ruined and broken, Winterfell remains Lady Arya's home. What better place to wed her, bed her, and stake your claim? That is only half of it, however. We would be fools to march on Stannis. Let Stannis march on us. He is too cautious to come to Barrowton … but he must come to Winterfell. His clansmen will not abandon the daughter of their precious Ned to such as you . Stake Ramsays claim. Why would Roose elevate his unhinged son above him like that? Can you say kinslay? Domeric could. Like, I see your evidence for Lady Arya of Winterfell, I pretty much agree. (Shes not the trueborn heir of Winterfell however, while Ramsay apparently is) but a Great Lord, as we defined, run kingdoms. The flayed fellas flying. Not a wolf. Stark soldiers are absent, while Boltons are plenty. So, lets say Ramsay wins and slays the great other and all his ice spiders or whatever; Wheres the heir of the Dreadfort gonna rest his head and rule? Where will Pooles son want to rule from? Hornwood? (Whats that kids name?) 18 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: (f)Arya is hardly the first woman in such a position, Mary Queen of Scots was less powerful than some of her Lords and made to do their bidding. But she was still higher in the food chain. Right, I mean thats just feudalism. Lords got all the real power 18 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: It shows that he aspires to be seen as an Arryn. He may even aspire to be a Waynwood. Lol. Wait, what? You think hes going to change his name to Waynwood too? 18 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Because, as has been pointed out, lineage is important and House Lannister is an old and prestigious House. He's also a child whose mother has drilled it into him the greatness of House Lannister, while he currently faces a civil war where his Baratheon uncles plus the army of Storm's End want him dead while the Lannister army is fighting to keep him alive. It makes perfect sense why he'd fly their colours in the context of the story. Oh, I meant in one of the first couple chapters of agot. Jon and Arya talk about it when they're all at Winterfell 18 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Nope. Start from the beginning The last person who cares about the seats of great lords is KL, as we see with the Declerant in the Vale. As long as they mostly pay their taxes and keep raiding to a reasonable minimum, theres no reason to care 18 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: That is pretty much how they do it in the Green. The Great Lords of Westeros, Tuly apart, sit on seats that won control of their respective regions True. In actuality the differences between the Green and the Islands are miniscule and mainly semantics. But in a legality sense the Ironborn are more likely to shrug off a usurpation of power Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenGail3 Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 4 hours ago, Bloodraven’s Spider said: “Great houses” Targaryen/Lannister/Frey/Tully/Martell/Bolton/Greyjoy will all be gone when shes all written House Frey? Extinct? I doubt that it. I doubt that House Lannister or Tyrell will be extinct... they are both fertile big houses. Why would the Martell’s go extinct? What’s the purpose of that? And isn’t Edmure’s wife pregnant? I don’t think House Tully will go extinct. I think that Ramsey will be killed by Roose and that the house will continue through Roose and his Frey wife. The GJ’s have Asha. But alas I think the Targies are doomed to die though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven’s Spider Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 14 hours ago, Prince Rhaego's Soul said: House Stark will be a den of direwolves. Jon, Arya, Rickon will all die and earn second lives as direwolves. So yeah, they get to live a second time. A bit unfair but the plot has been carefully set up to go in that direction. Sansa will just die. Bran will be part wood. House Targaryen has to continue because Azor Ahai comes from that line. Dany is Azor Ahai. There is an Azor Ahai at the end of each cycle. Why does there have to be another Azor Ahai? And just because the house no longer exist that doesnt mean people wont have Valyrian blood in them. Brandon of the bloody blade was the first Azor Ahai imo and he wasn’t Targaryen- He had Valyrian blood though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernie Mac Posted August 20, 2020 Share Posted August 20, 2020 12 hours ago, Hugorfonics said: Their blood. Yup, name and blood. Do you know how most people know that someone is of the Arryn 'blood'? By their name. Quote I think the most likely is they found some kid with matching hair, like Alayne, and just ran with it. eh? You ignored my question. Please reread it and try again. Quote Legitimizing bastards in the age of kings can always work too. Especially since bastards like Alayne have virtually no back story so theres no one to disagree. So you are saying Harry will be the first such example in thousands of years of Lannister, Arryn, Stark etc. rule that a child from a Lord's daughter or sister or niece has inherited? Just so I know were you are at in this conversation. You think no noble has ever changed their name before to rule a House? That when this was suggested to Bran regarding the Hornwood inheritance it was a brand new idea, with no history of it ever having happened before? Just so I know your positon. Quote We do not. We have one example of Luwin suggesting a change of names for Hornwood. Its something, Ill give ya that. We also have another example. In time, Lannister kings wed their children to Andals as well; indeed, when Gerold III died without male issues, a council crowned his only daughter's husband, Ser Joffery Lydden, who took the Lannister name and became the first Andal to rule the Rock. We also have the children of Lady Mormont and her daughter, the children of Lady Waynwood, the children of Lady Stokeworth, the children of Lady Oakheart, the children of the many Dornish rulers. Westeros does not have an issue with taking a mother's name if it means inheriting the land of her people. Quote Lollys though, while her fathers name has me confused, we can't be sure if that's her biological dad. But we know her mother is a Stoekworth. Lolly and her sister have taken their mother's name. Quote The other ladies in question id like some quotes on What quotes? You don't believe that they are the rulers of their Houses? You don't believe that they have adult sons? Ned and Cat have an (almost) adult son. When Ned died, Robb became the Lord of their House. Lady Waywnwood's oldest son, Morton, is a man grown, as is his oldest son Roland. Morton remains a knight. His mother remains the ruler of their House Lady Arwyen is the ruler of her House. Her youngest son is at least 26. Her children have all taken their mother's name.. Quote The Tully did fine, The Tullys did not rule the Vale. Robin Arryn ruled the Vale. Quote so does Bailish. Does he? He literally had a 6,000 army on his doorstep ready to take Robin off him. Quote And soon itll be Stark. How so? Stark will not become the ruling House of the Vale. Quote Second husbands is a possibility too Please explain? How does that effect the children's name? Quote Who are you thinking of? Don't be a dick. You claimed that Lady Mormont married a Bear. You were thinking of her daughter, not the current Lady Mormont. It is okay to admit you made a tiny mistake. Quote Oh, you think so? Lol It makes more sense than actually marrying a bear and giving birth to its litter on two different occasions. Quote Maybe they got married too? Its a bear right, so, like the other ladies, hes a cousin from a weaker branch of the family lol Sure. As I said, it is possible that Lady Mormont and her daughter, while Jorah was Lord, both chose to marry other Mormonts. Unlikely, but possible. Quote Sansa Stark is the future And what will be the surnames of Sansa's children? Quote By whom? Who regards the Starks as the rulers? Not the IT, not Bolton The Iron Throne does. Tywin's entire plan is on the idea that the Starks are the rulers, that is why he gave the Boltons the fake younger sister so he can one day return with the older sister and have her claim the North. His plan does not work if the Boltons are now the ruling House of the North. Quote . Even ruined and broken, Winterfell remains Lady Arya's home. What better place to wed her, bed her, and stake your claim? That is only half of it, however. We would be fools to march on Stannis. Let Stannis march on us. He is too cautious to come to Barrowton … but he must come to Winterfell. His clansmen will not abandon the daughter of their precious Ned to such as you Boom. That quote backs up what I'm saying. Quote . Stake Ramsays claim. Why would Roose elevate his unhinged son above him like that? Can you say kinslay? Domeric could. Roose is already married. He's not got much choice in the matter. He can't afford, at the time being, to rid himself of his Frey bride. All he needs is a child from Ramsay & (F)Arya to stake his claim. Quote Like, I see your evidence for Lady Arya of Winterfell, I pretty much agree. (Shes not the trueborn heir of Winterfell however, while Ramsay apparently is) but a Great Lord, as we defined, run kingdoms. The flayed fellas flying. Not a wolf. Stark soldiers are absent, while Boltons are plenty. What does that matter? It does not change what is happening. Quote So, lets say Ramsay wins and slays the great other and all his ice spiders or whatever; Wheres the heir of the Dreadfort gonna rest his head and rule? Where will Pooles son want to rule from? Hornwood? (Whats that kids name?) Winterfell. But, they'd be Starks for an easier transition of power. If the Boltons ruled they'd not be going through this entire charade. They'd not need a fake Arya, they'd not be challenging Jon and the Nightwatch when she escaped. The Boltons need a Stark bride for legitimacy. Quote Right, I mean thats just feudalism. Lords got all the real power True. Quote Lol. Wait, what? You think hes going to change his name to Waynwood too? No, reread what I said. He is probably more proud of both his Arryn and Waynwood heritage than he is his Hardyng heritage, given both of those two Houses are more prestigious. House Waynwood raised him, House Arryn potentially makes him the most powerful man in the Vale. House Hardng makes him another, at best, knight in service. Quote Oh, I meant in one of the first couple chapters of agot. Jon and Arya talk about it when they're all at Winterfell Talked about what? Quote The last person who cares about the seats of great lords is KL, as we see with the Declerant in the Vale. Kings Landing? Kings Landing is a city, not a person. I'm not sure what you are trying to say. And where do youu get the idea that Kings Landing does not care abour the Lords Declarant? Quote As long as they mostly pay their taxes and keep raiding to a reasonable minimum, theres no reason to care There is every reason to care. There are laws that govern the land, and one of them is the prestige of names. If such names no longer hold power then that affects all the Lords and Ladies of the land. Quote True. In actuality the differences between the Green and the Islands are miniscule and mainly semantics. But in a legality sense the Ironborn are more likely to shrug off a usurpation of power Yes, more likely. But that does not mean it a guarantee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugorfonics Posted August 21, 2020 Share Posted August 21, 2020 9 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Yup, name and blood. Do you know how most people know that someone is of the Arryn 'blood'? By their name. The Vale lords know what the heir stands for in Harry the heir. 9 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: eh? You ignored my question. Please reread it and try again. So you are saying Harry will be the first such example in thousands of years of Lannister, Arryn, Stark etc. rule that a child from a Lord's daughter or sister or niece has inherited? Just so I know were you are at in this conversation. You think no noble has ever changed their name before to rule a House? That when this was suggested to Bran regarding the Hornwood inheritance it was a brand new idea, with no history of it ever having happened before? Just so I know your positon. We also have another example. In time, Lannister kings wed their children to Andals as well; indeed, when Gerold III died without male issues, a council crowned his only daughter's husband, Ser Joffery Lydden, who took the Lannister name and became the first Andal to rule the Rock. (Grand nephew) No its not a brand new idea but its a rarity and seems to conflict with basic westeros edict . "Ser. One thing more. You are not of Ser Arlan's blood?" "Yes, m'lord. I mean, no. I'm not." The prince nodded at the battered shield Dunk carried, and the winged chalice upon its face. "By law, only a trueborn son is entitled to inherit a knight's arms. You must needs find a new device, ser, a sigil of your own." . 9 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: But we know her mother is a Stoekworth. How do we know that dude? 9 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: What quotes? The Ladies childrens surnames. 9 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: The Tullys did not rule the Vale. Robin Arryn ruled the Vale. Does he? He literally had a 6,000 army on his doorstep ready to take Robin off him. How so? Stark will not become the ruling House of the Vale. Tully trout never flew above the Eyrie, sure, but she certainly commanded the Vale vassals. I mean the Vale lords practically played the Brienne game with her, on hopes of ruling the Vale. Tully had supreme control over her subjects. The doorsteps not inside. As Petyr says, "what a good spot for them." Nah, LFs killin it. (Unless you count all those dead and earless smallfolk that Shagga and them are enjoying) Petes plan is to have a bunch of knights show up to see Neds cloak on Lysas niece and go wild. Its not a bad plan, and hes usually good at these type of things. The Stark war is at halftime and knights are not born to sit on the bench. The sorrow of Eddard, the revulsion of Frey, the bastard on the IT, and Cersei the mad queen with a bounty on their top prospect will not go unnoticed. The flags will fly whatever, but the affairs of the Vale is the affairs of house Stark. 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Please explain? How does that effect the children's name? Tanda was married to a Stokeworth and had two kids, then he died and she married that knight who Bronn killed 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Don't be a dick. You claimed that Lady Mormont married a Bear. You were thinking of her daughter, not the current Lady Mormont. Thats never my intention, but if you saw it that way I apologize. I tried to make a joke, im just not that funny. (She obviously didnt fuck a bear) No im really asking. The Old Bears wife? Jorahs mom? Shes actively the lord? 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: And what will be the surnames of Sansa's children? Lmao. . Thread/killed (So hopefully itll be Snow, cuz of Jonsa and everything lol, really though Lannister doesnt have a good to ring to it either, speaking of which this whole weddings sus and probably not legally binding in the mismatched eyes of the law/Imp) Yea, fuck it. Lol Hardying. Now that's a fun story, landed knights kid, heir to North Riverlands and the Vale. It can have an assortment for a sigil 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: The Iron Throne does. Tywin's entire plan is on the idea that the Starks are the rulers, that is why he gave the Boltons the fake younger sister so he can one day return with the older sister and have her claim the North. His plan does not work if the Boltons are now the ruling House of the North. Tywins dead though, so hes no longer the IT plus he didnt know the power of Ramsay or the inclination of Euron sending the ironborn out the north 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Boom. That quote backs up what I'm saying. How so? 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: What does that matter? It does not change what is happening But Bolton is whats happening, the facade of the lord wolf is losing its substance 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Winterfell. But, they'd be Starks for an easier transition of power. Hell no bro. Ramsay has no interest being a Stark nor flaunting his much beloved inheritance to the Dreadfort 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: If the Boltons ruled they'd not be going through this entire charade. They'd not need a fake Arya, they'd not be challenging Jon and the Nightwatch when she escaped Ramsay allegedly wrote the PL so thats interesting that it wasnt Roose. Bolton is pretending to rule through Jeyne but the reason for the summons to Winterfell was Stannis, like that quote from last post said. Ramsays of a different breed. And eliminates all competition 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: House Hardng makes him another, at best, knight in service. None of that matters. He will inherit the Eyrie, thats what heir means. 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Talked about what? When Jon and Arya were watching the non bastard male kids having fun sparring . "Look at the arms on his surcoat," Jon suggested. Arya looked. An ornate shield had been embroidered on the prince's padded surcoat. No doubt the needlework was exquisite. The arms were divided down the middle; on one side was the crowned stag of the royal House, on the other the lion of Lannister. "The Lannisters are proud," Jon observed. "You'd think the royal sigil would be sufficient, but no. He makes his mother's House equal in honor to the king's." "The woman is important too!" Arya protested. Jon chuckled. "Perhaps you should do the same thing, little sister. Wed Tully to Stark in your arms." "A wolf with a fish in its mouth?" It made her laugh. "That would look silly. Besides, if a girl can't fight, why should she have a coat of arms?" Jon shrugged. "Girls get the arms but not the swords. Bastards get the swords but not the arms. I did not make the rules, little sister." . Rules of course, are meant to be brokena 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Kings Landing? Kings Landing is a city, not a person. I'm not sure what you are trying to say. And where do youu get the idea that Kings Landing does not care abour the Lords Declarant? KL, IT, house Cersei Lannister, call it what you will. It had no interest in fighting Petyrs war 10 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: There is every reason to care. There are laws that govern the land, and one of them is the prestige of names. If such names no longer hold power then that affects all the Lords and Ladies of the land Which should appeal to KL. After all, feudalism is just living at the whim of your lordly subjects. A change of scenery could do good 11 hours ago, Bernie Mac said: Yes, more likely. But that does not mean it a guarantee Sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastWolf Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 For all the Houses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrettyLittlePsycho Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 Well, pretty much any house could survive if some rules are bent. You could always have some nephew/niece (or bastard) take up the name. So, IMO the most endangered house is Targaryen, with Aegon commonly believed to be a fake and Dany possibly infertile. And in the long run Arryn and Tully, you don´t want the likes of Sweetrobin and Edmure as the only heirs. Baratheon might well continue through one of Roberts bastards, but Stannis and Shireen are most certainly goners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anck Su Namun Posted August 24, 2020 Share Posted August 24, 2020 The class system is not going to survive intact. A new upper class will rise at the end of the long night. The race and ethnicity of Westeros is not going to be the same. Migration from the east will bring dark skinned Dothraki, pale Qartheen, and Ghiscari to resettle the newly defrosted west. Savage wildlings and giants will come down from the north to settle in the lands once ruled by the Starks. Sailors from Sothoryos may lay claim to the lands that were the Martell's. The continent will begin anew as spring comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Man Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 On 8/18/2020 at 9:09 AM, Hodor the Articulate said: There's even a bit of Frey in her niece/nephew. Walder Frey gets the last laugh. He is the true master in the game of thrones. There is something positive to be said of fecundity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Man Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 On 8/17/2020 at 11:04 PM, Wholala17 said: I just cannot fathom why people think this series is about the Targaryens. Lmao if there's one totally toast house it's them. Think about it. The World of Ice and Fire, Fire and Blood, all those extra volumes mostly devoted to one family. They are the first and most important family in the series. They are the most interesting family to me. I would not invest the time that I have in this series to read about the Starks and their dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Man Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 12:00 PM, Floki of the Ironborn said: I disagree. I think the books will end with the death of House Targaryen once and for all. It's the only logical conclusion to this epic saga. As you say, it's all been about House Targaryen, so ASOIAF can only end with them dying out. After all, the War of the Roses ended with the death of the Plantagenet dynasty. As for the other Great Houses, I don't think any of them will die out, nor will they lose their power. The only thing that will change is that House Targaryen is out of the picture. And I disagree with you. Sure it's possible for House Targaryen to end but then it is just as possible for the Starks and the others to end. I would very much prefer for the Targaryens to survive and the Starks and the Lannisters to die out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastWolf Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 10 minutes ago, Son of Man said: There is something positive to be said of fecundity. Wait for Red Wedding 2.0 courtesy AryaNymeria&pack, BwB, UnCat, North Loyalists, crannogmen etc etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Man Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 Just now, TheLastWolf said: Wait for Red Wedding 2.0 courtesy AryaNymeria&pack, BwB, UnCat, North Loyalists, crannogmen etc etc... That could happen. I hope not. But it might. I just hope if it does happen, it ends in the deaths of Arya and Nymeria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hodor the Articulate Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 1 hour ago, TheLastWolf said: Wait for Red Wedding 2.0 courtesy AryaNymeria&pack, BwB, UnCat, North Loyalists, crannogmen etc etc... Pfft! What does death even mean this series? I'm sure the Freys will find a way to multiply, even in death. Even if you exterminate everyone with the Frey name, there's all the weak chinned bastards and those born of the female line, like the new Tully heir. Freys are like cockroaches and rats. For every one you kill, a dozen more Walders and Waldas pop out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hoare Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 3 hours ago, TheLastWolf said: Wait for Red Wedding 2.0 courtesy AryaNymeria&pack, BwB, UnCat, North Loyalists, crannogmen etc etc... I don't think any of them has enough power to destroy the Freys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastWolf Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 13 hours ago, Son of Man said: I just hope if it does happen, it ends in the deaths of Arya and Nymeria. Wishful haters' fanfic. That's not saying it's impossible. I'm no blind biased stark lover. Stark lover is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastWolf Posted August 26, 2020 Share Posted August 26, 2020 10 hours ago, The Hoare said: I don't think any of them has enough power to destroy the Freys. Any, not enough. But ALL.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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