Renly takes royal kids hostage

[Mrstrategy]

What would happen if Ned and Renly had taken the royal kids hostages as Renly suggested ?

[James Steller]

39 minutes ago, Mrstrategy said:

What would happen if Ned and Renly had taken the royal kids hostages as Renly suggested ?

This is a false premise. Renly wouldn’t work with Ned to put Stannis on the throne. Ned would be trying to do that.

If this did happen, though, I’m curious as to whether Mel would have foreseen it or not. Assuming she still makes the same prediction and is proven wrong, then Stannis never becomes her thrall and sails to King’s Landing to take power. Or maybe Mel would predict it accurately and she accompanies him to the city.

Assuming that Renly is loyal to Stannis, then he brings the power of the Stormlands to the cause, and Ned would provide the North and Riverlands. Lysa Arryn and the Martells would still stay neutral, the Iron Islands are still a wild card, and the Westerlands would be in big trouble.

The big question is what the Reach will do. Loras Tyrell would stand by Renly regardless, but the Tyrells would hate having to acknowledge a Florent as queen. They might throw their lot in with Tywin, but I find it hard to believe that Mace (or Olenna) would ever make war if Loras is on the other side. They might stay neutral too, or if they’re smart, they’d prove their loyalty to Stannis (maybe if some ill fortune befalls Selyse, Margaery would be on standby to replace her).

[Lord Lannister]

1 hour ago, James Steller said:

They might stay neutral too, or if they’re smart, they’d prove their loyalty to Stannis (maybe if some ill fortune befalls Selyse, Margaery would be on standby to replace her).

Stannis marrying Mace Tyrell's daughter? I can't see that.

[Floki of the Ironborn]

3 minutes ago, Lord Lannister said:

Stannis marrying Mace Tyrell's daughter? I can't see that.

I agree. What's more likely is that Margaery still marries Renly. He would be Stannis' heir, and Stannis isn't going to make any more babies with Selyse, let's be honest. And given Stannis isn't going to fight for her to replace him since she's a girl. We all know how uncomfortable he is to even talk to a woman, let alone grooming one to be his heir.

[James Steller]

2 minutes ago, Floki of the Ironborn said:

Stannis isn't going to fight for her to replace him since she's a girl. We all know how uncomfortable he is to even talk to a woman, let alone grooming one to be his heir.

You clearly haven’t read that Theon sample chapter, have you?

[Floki of the Ironborn]

10 minutes ago, James Steller said:

You clearly haven’t read that Theon sample chapter, have you?

I have, actually. And frankly, I don't buy that Stannis would want Shireen to become another Rhaenyra. He's got no other options and he wants someone else to take up his fight if he dies, because Stannis is just that stubborn and unyielding. He's not a feminist; he thinks little of women, he's uncomfortable around them, and he would never actually want a female heir unless he was truly desperate.

[Trigger Warning]

4 hours ago, James Steller said:

This is a false premise. Renly wouldn’t work with Ned to put Stannis on the throne. Ned would be trying to do that.

If this did happen, though, I’m curious as to whether Mel would have foreseen it or not. Assuming she still makes the same prediction and is proven wrong, then Stannis never becomes her thrall and sails to King’s Landing to take power. Or maybe Mel would predict it accurately and she accompanies him to the city.

Assuming that Renly is loyal to Stannis, then he brings the power of the Stormlands to the cause, and Ned would provide the North and Riverlands. Lysa Arryn and the Martells would still stay neutral, the Iron Islands are still a wild card, and the Westerlands would be in big trouble.

The big question is what the Reach will do. Loras Tyrell would stand by Renly regardless, but the Tyrells would hate having to acknowledge a Florent as queen. They might throw their lot in with Tywin, but I find it hard to believe that Mace (or Olenna) would ever make war if Loras is on the other side. They might stay neutral too, or if they’re smart, they’d prove their loyalty to Stannis (maybe if some ill fortune befalls Selyse, Margaery would be on standby to replace her).

 

I don't think the Tyrells would rebel over a Florent queen if Stannis has the backing of Renly and Ned who have already secured Joffrey, it's too much risk for too little reward, when they rebel for Renly the realm is already split by war and they have the promise of a half Tyrell king in the next generation. They'd likely begrudgingly accept it or remain neutral rather than risk destruction for the sake of a potential threat.

[Curled Finger]

It wasn't in Ned to do this sort of thing.   Renly should have simply done it on his own.  He had nearly as much power and influence, didn't he?  Without Loras whispering greatness and treason in Renly's ears, who says he wouldn't have supported his brother 100% behind Ned?  

[James Steller]

1 hour ago, Curled Finger said:

It wasn't in Ned to do this sort of thing.   Renly should have simply done it on his own.  He had nearly as much power and influence, didn't he?  Without Loras whispering greatness and treason in Renly's ears, who says he wouldn't have supported his brother 100% behind Ned?  

I’m pretty sure Renly wasn’t Loras’s pawn. He had his own ambitions, and he worshipped his oldest brother’s example. Since Robert and Stannis never got along, it stands to reason that Renly would dislike him too. 

[Curled Finger]

1 hour ago, James Steller said:

I’m pretty sure Renly wasn’t Loras’s pawn. He had his own ambitions, and he worshipped his oldest brother’s example. Since Robert and Stannis never got along, it stands to reason that Renly would dislike him too. 

As you will.  

[Trigger Warning]

1 hour ago, James Steller said:

I’m pretty sure Renly wasn’t Loras’s pawn. He had his own ambitions, and he worshipped his oldest brother’s example. Since Robert and Stannis never got along, it stands to reason that Renly would dislike him too. 

Stannis has an extremely abrasive personality, even if Renly took after Robert I don't think it takes anything more than Stannis to make someone not like Stannis.