rotting sea cow Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 35 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said: Was just reading that. It's not so much worrying that an occasional person may be susceptible to reinfection, I'm more concerned that the 2nd one was significantly worse. There is the obvious bias that it's easier to catch the second reinfection if this is relatively severe. Hopefully for most is the other way around, otherwise many vaccine efforts might go down the toilet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotting sea cow Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 I leave this here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 1 hour ago, rotting sea cow said: I leave this here Thats good but actually a better diagram would demonstrate the scale of each bit of cheese in terms of effectiveness. For instance, social distancing might be a massive block of cheese and masks being about enough to fit on a nice biscuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 This makes no sense whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williamjm Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 10 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said: An apparent reinfection case in thr US https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54512034 Worrying. I caught chicken pox twice as a kid; thr first was mild, only a few spots. The second was a hellish two weeks. It's a pity he wasn't tested for antibodies after the first infection. In the ECDC document linked from that article it mentions that most but not all patients develop antibodies, so we don't know if he was one of those who did not develop them or if he did and they were ineffective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 I know three people who got sick again. Two of them are the college age daughters of friends. One of those two got sick right before her university shut down last winter. She was sick at home for weeks. She went back to that same university this fall and sure enough, within two days, she was sick again, and home again. ~~~~~~~~~ The story is datelined from yesterday. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/12/health/coronavirus-pandemic-vaccine-optimism.html Quote ....Today, and despite the president’s own resistance, masks are widely accepted. Various polls show that the number of Americans who wear them, at least when entering stores, went from near zero in March to about 65 percent in early summer to 85 percent or even 90 percent in October. Seeing the president and many White House staffers stricken by the virus may convince yet more Americans to wear masks. The slow but relentless acceptance of what epidemiologists call “non-pharmaceutical interventions” has made a huge difference in lives saved. The next step is pharmaceutical interventions.... This guy is cautiously optimistic ... my own sense not cautious enough, re medical cavalry arriving, due to this story from today. https://www.nytimes.com/live/2020/10/13/world/coronavirus-covid? Quote A government-sponsored clinical trial testing an antibody treatment made by the drug company Eli Lilly has been paused because of a “potential safety concern,” according to emails that government officials sent on Tuesday to researchers at testing sites, and confirmed by the company. ....The news comes just a day after Johnson & Johnson announced the pause of its coronavirus vaccine trial because of a sick volunteer, and a month after AstraZeneca’s vaccine trial was halted over concerns about two participants who had fallen ill after getting the company’s vaccine.... The most important thing he says, it seems to me, is that without masks and intelligent distancing the death toll would be immensely higher right now. So keep wearing them, keep contacts with other people to the minimum that is possible and wash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippa Eilhart Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Were all three people tested both times? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Everyone in my house is a furnace right now. I hate that I run so cold because it leaves me in the dark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 3 hours ago, Tywin et al. said: Everyone in my house is a furnace right now. I hate that I run so cold because it leaves me in the dark. ??????? ~~~~~~~ Again, re reinfection, which has happened as far as we know all along, but reasons. https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2020/8/24/21399041/covid-19-reinfection-nevada-hong-kong-case-immunity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 26 minutes ago, Chataya de Fleury said: I’m going to guess that Tywin, like me, has a normal body temperature below 98.6 degrees. Mine is usually 97.something. Tywin - the CDC definition of a fever is that you feel like you have one. Seriously. It is NOT “100.3 or above”. I was in the high 95's/low 96's most of the day. I run very cold in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filippa Eilhart Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 8 hours ago, Zorral said: Yes. that’s too bad. The news articles make it seem like reinfections are really rare (only a handful reported cases?) but unless you’re really unlucky in who you know, it seems like they’re actually extremely common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 Quote Proposal to hasten herd immunity to the coronavirus grabs White House attention but appalls top scientists ....They have codified their argument in the form of a document posted online that called itself the Great Barrington Declaration, named after the town in Massachusetts where it was unveiled on Oct. 4 in a ceremony at a libertarian think tank.... Who needs Karl Marx when you can have Ayn Rand -- except as posted about Grafton, New Hampshire, totally taken over by libertarians, they can't even handle garbage and Black Bears and have destroyed the town (posted over in the Politics thread, btw!) Quote ....The plan is endorsing what the president’s policy has been for months. The president’s policy — protect the vulnerable, prevent hospital overcrowding, and open schools and businesses — Ya, look how well that protection and non-overcrowding is working right now in Wisconsin and North Dakota. https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/covid-herd-immunity/2020/10/10/3910251c-0a60-11eb-859b-f9c27abe638d_story.html Quote The Great Barrington Declaration is not a scientific document. As critics readily point out, it presents no data. It has no footnotes, few specific suggestions for how to implement the societal segregation and, unlike most scientific arguments, does not discuss potential objections to the proposal. They've been rolling with this in the UK and it sure is working well there, hey nonny nonny! This is what They have been doing here too, all along, due to depravity, corruption and utter failure to competently think of and implement anything else. Also to please the real estate-rentier classes. So uncouple the virus discussions from politics cum the economy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 Surprised anyone has heard of the Great Barrington Declaration, considering it has been wiped from Google results and banned from Reddit forums.. which surely only gives it a bit more authority! I do find it rather dangerous that what is actually not that controversial an opinion is deemed dangerous by tech giants, and at a time when it doesn't really appear than anyone knows what they are doing, a different viewpoint should be available to listen to. Anyway before blindly ranting on about libertarian think tanks I do think it is at least worth listening to what is being said. as well as...https://unherd.com/2020/10/matt-hancock-is-wrong-about-herd-immunity/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 Per usual an argument in favor of herd immunity presented under the pretense of being more reasonable than thou is -- preposterous. See how great that's rockin' in the UK -- just as great as it's been rockin' in the midwest -- we are Sturgis! We are Number 1! We don't wear masks! We go to college to make memories not study so lets party and beer bong in eachothers' faces all night long! -- they too are past ICU and other medical capacity. Quote Just eight hours after pubs and bars in Liverpool were closed and all socialising banned, Paul Brant, cabinet member for adult health and social care at Liverpool city council, said intensive care capacity in the city was over 90% full, with Covid-19 patients making up an increasing proportion of patients. He told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme: “At the current rate of increase, we would expect Liverpool to surpass the peak of the first wave probably within the next seven to 10 days.” https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/14/england-lockdown-areas-demand-more-help-amid-calls-for-circuit-breaker Liverpool, man -- they are so concerned with protecting the vulnerable aren't they in their herd immunity and keep the economy open man -- https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/14/covid-liverpool-mayor-says-partying-crowds-shame-city If the nations all had worked together, did a real quarantine, shut-down, test, trace and track through the winter, spring and summer -- we'd not be going through all this AGAIN, and worse this time around, for we've been consuming our 'fat' stock of resources as the surges happen over and over and over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 38 minutes ago, Heartofice said: Anyway before blindly ranting on about libertarian think tanks I do think it is at least worth listening to what is being said. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! Sorry I can't agree. The internet is now full of extremely plausible and well thought out nonsense deliberately intended to sow confusion and to influence what people and governments do. In many cases lay people cannot judge just how nonsensical some of this stuff really is. So it is important to know where it comes from, so you can know how sceptically you should view it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartofice Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 5 minutes ago, A wilding said: Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! Sorry I can't agree. The internet is now full of extremely plausible and well thought out nonsense deliberately intended to sow confusion and to influence what people and governments do. In many cases lay people cannot judge just how nonsensical some of this stuff really is. So it is important to know where it comes from, so you can know how sceptically you should view it. While that is true, it doesn't mean that is what is happening here. One of the interesting developments on something like Twitter is that it is providing warnings or extra information on posts about Covid, labelling them as misleading or disputedhttps://blog.twitter.com/en_us/topics/product/2020/updating-our-approach-to-misleading-information.html What will be very interesting will be exactly what it labels as 'disputed'. For instance, local lockdowns in the UK have been completely ineffective, if someone says something in support of them will that be regarded as 'disputed'? It opens a whole can of worms. The whole point is that there isn't a complete consensus on the way forward here, and if a tech giant is going to take the position that it is going to police content on its platform then it will need to try not to take sides. So then pretty everything will need to be labelled as disputed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A wilding Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 Agreed that the world has a difficult problem that nobody appears to have any solution to at present. However there are plenty of unquestionably factually wrong things being put online these days, so I am inclined to think that, as long as the tech giants do stick to flagging only them, it is the least worst solution for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 I just heard in the business news that the Eli Lilly vaccine is being tried on patients in hospitals, and a “marked difference” has been seen in the reactions of some patients receiving the vaccine versus the patients receiving the placebo. There hasn’t been a huge reaction to this news, and the company President in an interview said they are not sure what this means yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Posted October 14, 2020 Share Posted October 14, 2020 5 hours ago, A wilding said: Agreed that the world has a difficult problem that nobody appears to have any solution to at present. Yes, if we ignore the *many* countries that are showing the way out of this or at least allowing their populations to function without the fiasco that is currently unfolding in both the US and the UK - and doing so by using basic public health interventions. ( Also, the stuff being proposed there is nothing new - it's scant on details and allowing the virus to run it's course among the young is a bunch of unethical nonsense. I agree with having equitable solutions proposed by those scientists but allowing the virus to run it's course among the 'young' population will end up with thousands of more hospitalizations. People proposing this as a viable strategy have no clue about the situation on the ground and as Tedros mentioned today, it is grossly unethical.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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