Watch, Watched, Watching: The cancellations continue

[SpaceChampion]

5 minutes ago, Fez said:

Right now, absolutely. But it seems like things should be mostly back to normal by late summer/early fall, if not sooner. A movie that would be released next fall would probably fine in theaters-only.

Eh, I think that's too soon to expect normality.  I read that here in Canada the government isn't expecting more than 50% immunized by September.  And that's their optimistic goal.  It's more than optimistic to expect sooner.  Bordering on utopian.  Did 2020 not teach you we can't have nice things?

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

15 minutes ago, Fez said:

Right now, absolutely. But it seems like things should be mostly back to normal by late summer/early fall, if not sooner. A movie that would be released next fall would probably fine in theaters-only.

"Should", "mostly", "Probably". And if it isn't?

Where I am, we only just put restrictions on movie theaters a few weeks ago.  Now I'm reading that our glorious Premiere has requested the feds work with the red cross to set up field hospitals because the province's medical infrastructure is about to be overwhelmed.

It seems to me that the optimists have been consistently wrong about this thing.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

6 hours ago, TheLastWolf said:

Watched Sean Connery in Entrapment 

No comments 

Not a great movie, but it does have an all-time great scene. 

[polishgenius]

To be fair like I strongly suspect that things having a chance of being back to relatively normal by the end of the year is exactly the point.  They get to use 'hey we're reacting to COVID' to hit back against cinemas inevitable moaning about it, but if that was the only reason they'd have done it already. This way, they get people used to the idea of buying new films at home while there's not much other option, then the rest of the time they get to gauge takeup when cinema is an option while using the (fairly thin) screen of 'of course we announced the whole year, for certainty's sake and so we wouldn't have to push more films back'.

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

42 minutes ago, Fez said:

Right now, absolutely. But it seems like things should be mostly back to normal by late summer/early fall, if not sooner. A movie that would be released next fall would probably fine in theaters-only.

But the theaters to release them in may be largely gone. One of my brothers works in the film industry and he's pretty convinced it could take a decade to recover from all of this. 

[RumHam]

Theaters were going downhill even before Covid. I don't see them ever fully recovering to 2019 levels. Just as a lot of people are going to keep wearing masks during flu seasons after this I think a lot of people are going to be fine or even prefer watching most new releases at home. 

Edit: Nice I won't have to go watch the sopranos prequel in a theater. 

[Fez]

1 hour ago, SpaceChampion said:

Eh, I think that's too soon to expect normality.  I read that here in Canada the government isn't expecting more than 50% immunized by September.  And that's their optimistic goal.  It's more than optimistic to expect sooner.  Bordering on utopian.  Did 2020 not teach you we can't have nice things?

Trump lost. Sometimes nice things do happen.

And my understanding in the US is that right now the expectation is that general population (under 65, no co-morbidities, not a health care or essential worker) should be able to start getting the vaccine around June. Not that everyone will in June, or even July. But I'd think by September it's not unrealistic to have around a 70% immunization rate, which should be high enough to make things feel pretty close to normal.

46 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

"Should", "mostly", "Probably". And if it isn't?

And if it isn't, extend the streaming policy out. They aren't under any deadline here. They could say, "hey, every release through June is going out on HBO Max too and we'll re-assess where things are in May regarding the rest of the year." 

That'd make the most sense if this was just about concern with no theater revenue. But it's not, it's also about trying to maximize HBO Max revenue, which is why I think they went with the whole year at once. And if it boosts subscriber numbers, they'll probably keep doing it forever.

[Maithanet]

6 minutes ago, Fez said:

And my understanding in the US is that right now the expectation is that general population (under 65, no co-morbidities, not a health care or essential worker) should be able to start getting the vaccine around June. Not that everyone will in June, or even July. But I'd think by September it's not unrealistic to have around a 70% immunization rate, which should be high enough to make things feel pretty close to normal.

I've seen estimates that are all over the map in terms of level of optimism wrt vaccine distribution and uptake.  There was one doctor who seemed legit who seemed to think that the US could have 50% immunization rate by the end of MARCH.  And other things I've seen that we won't be at 50% until well into fall 2021.  But I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that there's so much uncertainty...

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

10 hours ago, polishgenius said:

To be fair like I strongly suspect that things having a chance of being back to relatively normal by the end of the year is exactly the point.  They get to use 'hey we're reacting to COVID' to hit back against cinemas inevitable moaning about it, but if that was the only reason they'd have done it already. This way, they get people used to the idea of buying new films at home while there's not much other option, then the rest of the time they get to gauge takeup when cinema is an option while using the (fairly thin) screen of 'of course we announced the whole year, for certainty's sake and so we wouldn't have to push more films back'.

They've already been reacting to cover for almost a year.

9 hours ago, Fez said:

Trump lost. Sometimes nice things do happen.

And my understanding in the US is that right now the expectation is that general population (under 65, no co-morbidities, not a health care or essential worker) should be able to start getting the vaccine around June. Not that everyone will in June, or even July. But I'd think by September it's not unrealistic to have around a 70% immunization rate, which should be high enough to make things feel pretty close to normal.

And if it isn't, extend the streaming policy out. They aren't under any deadline here. They could say, "hey, every release through June is going out on HBO Max too and we'll re-assess where things are in May regarding the rest of the year." 

That'd make the most sense if this was just about concern with no theater revenue. But it's not, it's also about trying to maximize HBO Max revenue, which is why I think they went with the whole year at once. And if it boosts subscriber numbers, they'll probably keep doing it forever.

70% immunization rate? Based on what? That means manufacturing, distributing, and administering about 230 million doses of a new vaccine in the next nine months. And that's just for the United States. I'm no expert. Is that even possible?

[polishgenius]

18 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

They've already been reacting to cover for almost a year.

...yes. And they didn't release their whole slate of films during that year and pushed them instead, and yet now they announce a whole year.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

10 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

...yes. And they didn't release their whole slate of films during that year and pushed them instead, and yet now they announce a whole year.

Like I said, "it's an acknowledgment that life will not be going back to normal until further notice."

According to Worldometers, for the United States:

Current 7 day moving average for daily infections: 168,000 and trending up.

Current 7 day moving average for daily deaths: 1,664 and trending up.

For reference, back in yearly July when states started "going back to normal" without much of a plan or coordination, it was ~20,000/day and ~500/day respectively. The United States was actually trending down nicely. Then the optimists fucked it up.

[Veltigar]

I just saw John Carpenter's The Thing (1982) for the first time. Color me impressed. It's weird that this movie was savaged on release by critics. I loved it and I can definitely see why it is frequently cited as one of the best horror films ever made. It is definitely better than the original The Thing From Another World from the 1950s which I saw a few years back.

The paranoia that oozes from every pore of this film is tremendously effective. I knew that the creature effects were revolutionary, but while fantastic, what really makes the film work for me is that you never know for sure who is and who isn't infected. Brilliantly done and there were many moments were I was at the edge of my seat:

Spoiler

My favorite scene was definitely the blood test. The fact that Mac Ready was revealed to have shot a real human and then the reveal of Parker being a monster... My God, I could feel the dread of the men tied up on the bench next to him! That does not often happen anymore. 

The actors were all fantastic. I loved the music as well. It's an outrage that Ennio Morricone got a razzie nomination for this (although the parts they reused for the Hateful Eight were given the prize the deserved). I have mentioned the creature design already, but all the effects were splendidly done. I'm usually not the one to notice sound work that much, but the sound effects on this were great as well.

I think the only real points of criticism that I have is that:

Spoiler

1. They forgot Blair for most of the film. Locking a man up on his own without guards seems like sacrificing him to The Thing to be honest.
2. I felt like they were a bit too casual to leave one another's sight. I would think that in a scenario like that I'd always try to be with at least three people together. But here, even until the final act, you have people wandering alone outside of each other's field of vision. That felt like begging for the monster to win to be honest.

All in all I still greatly enjoyed it however. In a lesser film, these mistakes would have stood out like a sore thumb but when everything else is so great, you can suspend your disbelief enough to give it a pass.

On 12/1/2020 at 6:42 PM, Ran said:

  Reveal hidden contents

First one. Yes, the implication of what was going to happen was definitely in there, which is what was so shocking... even if he pulled back and didn't actually do it as a step too far.

It's finished in that all the filming was done and the editing was complete and it was released. The redubbing had to do with, on one hand, several actors with heavy accents getting dubbed over, and on the other because the audio from the original filming was in many places unusable and so they had to re-record it and because of time constraints Welles and some other performers dubbed over several other performances. 

But the finished film was presented at Cannes and all. Same with The Trial, it was completed and edited and eventually released. But it's true that Welles tended to attract all kinds of problems for himself with his filming approach and his independence leading to funding sometimes falling through, especially in the later years, which provided complications. Speaking of Welles and investors, I'm reminded of this story...

 

Interesting, I didn't know that about Chimes at Midnight! And that clip you shared is just delightful. Not only a great display of humor, but I never realized they knew each other on and off during the war as well.

On 12/2/2020 at 3:32 AM, Tywin et al. said:

Mad Max is a lot like Rocky in that several later additions in the series are better than the original. It may actually be the weakest entry. I'd go Furiosa Road > Road Warrior> THUNDERDOME!!! > Mad Max, but the last two are a toss up. The Rocky series is Rocky 3 > Rocky 4 > Creed > Rocky 2 > the rest, and the order doesn't matter, but give it to Rocky because reasons. 

Oh, it's definitely between the original and Thunderdome for the weakest entry in the series. Although I'd be inclined to rate Thunderdome higher just because it had a title song by Tina Turner and because as @Heartofice turns out, it is just so different from the others.

It kind of makes me wonder when Miller came up with this idea of the Mad Max tales as a sort of dystopian version of the grail mythos with all the Max's we see not necessarily being the same.

Curious ranking of the Rocky films btw, if I had to rank them I'd definitely go:

Creed > Rocky Balboa > Rocky IV > Rocky > Creed II/Rocky II/Rocky III (hard to rank these three in my book) > Rocky V

On 12/2/2020 at 9:35 AM, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

I might have missed something.

For all the back and forth about Orson Wells, no one has mentioned "F for fake". It's a kind of long form film essay Wells did back in the '70's. It's fantastic.  I think you can still find it on youtube.

Never seen it!

3 hours ago, Kalbear Total Landscaping said:

HBO Max just decided to...I don't even know. Wow.

 

 

That's crazy! 

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

14 minutes ago, Veltigar said:

I just saw John Carpenter's The Thing (1982) for the first time. Color me impressed. It's weird that this movie was savaged on release by critics. I loved it and I can definitely see why it is frequently cited as one of the best horror films ever made. It is definitely better than the original The Thing From Another World from the 1950s which I saw a few years back.

The paranoia that oozes from every pore of this film is tremendously effective. I knew that the creature effects were revolutionary, but while fantastic, what really makes the film work for me is that you never know for sure who is and who isn't infected. Brilliantly done and there were many moments were I was at the edge of my seat:

I'm not a huge John Carpenter aficionado, but IMO The Thing is his best film.  And yes, the extant critical reaction is really hard to believe given how well made that film was and how it has aged since.

18 minutes ago, Veltigar said:

Never seen it!

 You can definitely find F For Fake on youtube. 

[Maithanet]

@Veltigar, so what did you think of the end of The Thing?

Spoiler

Were one or both of them infected?  Carpenter has his interpretation, but I'm a fan of Death to the Author, so I don't see his opinion as being definitive.

 

[Ran]

Carpenter did make some shlock, but he also made some really fun films besides The Thing: They Live, Big Trouble in Little China, Starman, Escape from New York, The Fog, Dark Star, and of course Halloween which is an instant classic of the slasher horror genre and I suspect many mainstream critics would consider his best. But it was a commercial film he made for money, to try and fund the stuff he really cared for.

Also, terrific composer, really. Made some really memorable tunes for his films...

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Veltigar said:

Oh, it's definitely between the original and Thunderdome for the weakest entry in the series. Although I'd be inclined to rate Thunderdome higher just because it had a title song by Tina Turner and because as @Heartofice turns out, it is just so different from the others.

It kind of makes me wonder when Miller came up with this idea of the Mad Max tales as a sort of dystopian version of the grail mythos with all the Max's we see not necessarily being the same.

Curious ranking of the Rocky films btw, if I had to rank them I'd definitely go:

Creed > Rocky Balboa > Rocky IV > Rocky > Creed II/Rocky II/Rocky III (hard to rank these three in my book) > Rocky V

I put Thunderdome over the original because it's a lot of fun. Mad Max just drags at so many many points.

Regarding the Rocky films, perhaps I need to revisit Balboa, but why do you have 3 so low? I normally hear people say it's their favorite. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

15 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

@Veltigar, so what did you think of the end of The Thing?

  Reveal hidden contents

Were one or both of them infected?  Carpenter has his interpretation, but I'm a fan of Death to the Author, so I don't see his opinion as being definitive.

 

 

Spoiler

What do you think of the theory that it wasn't scotch in the bottle, but gasoline? 

 

[Spockydog]

1 hour ago, Veltigar said:

I just saw John Carpenter's The Thing (1982) for the first time.

That's a Great Fuckin' Movie. Absolutely brilliant, in almost every regard. 

 

[Fez]

17 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

I put Thunderdome over the original because it's a lot of fun. Mad Max just drags at so many many points.

There's something delightfully grungy about the original though. I really like it a lot, almost more than The Road Warrior even; though not quite. And of course it's got nothing on Fury Road.

[Astromech]

Speaking of the Mad Max films, I read Hugh Keays-Byrne passed away yesterday. I had no idea he played both Immortan Joe as well as Toecutter in the original Mad Max.