US Politics: Electoral College Votes (12/14/2020)

[Fragile Bird]

52 minutes ago, DMC said:

This should help answer some of your questions.

It doesn’t, really, because the NY court decision made Uber drivers entitled to unemployment. If they hadn’t been entitled previously, it means that no one was paying into the UI system, neither the drivers nor Uber. As the article says, independent contractors have to pay their own UI, which is why corporations try to label people as ICs, to reduce tax costs. Same situation in Canada.
 

I just reread the decision and while the mechanics are not set out, I assume the court decision will allow NY to collect at least the employer portion of UI from Uber. I don’t know if the law allows them them to do this too but they might demand the employee portion from Uber as well, since they failed to collect it as required. I also suspect this decision will be appealed by Uber because, well, too many costs screws Uber’s business model. That was the whole reason Uber and Lyft stopped services in California until Prop 22 could be voted on. Prop 22 made drivers ICs, meaning Uber successfully shifted the tax burden onto its drivers.

I was focused on Larry’s comment that drivers were now entitled to receive unemployment, rather than the fact the court found them to be employees. As ICs they were entitled to receive unemployment as well, because they should have been declaring their income and paying their taxes, including unemployment. Except, I guess, as drivers they were in a work category that didn’t entitle them to get unemployment insurance, maybe? So no one ever paid into UI?
 

That goes to my question about how things work in the US. In Canada, only some ICs can opt to pay the UI tax. If you are an IC you have to apply to Revenue Canada to be made eligible, but many categories of work are ineligible. It’s usually people on contract doing jobs like employees do, under the control of the employer, like an accountant or a lawyer taking a short term contract at a company that needs you because of extra workload. They don’t intend to make you an employee, so they don’t have to do the payroll taxes, but you can ask to pay UI on your earnings.

Does NY have a proposition system like California? Can the proposition fairy touch Uber drivers and “poof”, turn them into ICs too?
 

 

[DMC]

7 minutes ago, Fez said:

If Biden wants her, great; but keep Richmond and Fudge in the House then.

Seems weird to worry so much about this appointment rendering the majority going from 220-219 yet not Richmond's taking it from 222-221 or Fudge's from 221-220.

As for the GOP "effectively" gaining a majority, that's only going to matter on key votes.  The only one that's likely to happen before those vacancies are replaced is a stimulus bill, and again, now Pelosi can employ the proxy voting rule.  Plus, obviously, just because Dems will now only have 219 members for a bit doesn't change the fact the GOP still only has 213.

[Fez]

53 minutes ago, DMC said:

Seems weird to worry so much about this appointment rendering the majority going from 220-219 yet not Richmond's taking it from 222-221 or Fudge's from 221-220.

As for the GOP "effectively" gaining a majority, that's only going to matter on key votes.  The only one that's likely to happen before those vacancies are replaced is a stimulus bill, and again, now Pelosi can employ the proxy voting rule.  Plus, obviously, just because Dems will now only have 219 members for a bit doesn't change the fact the GOP still only has 213.

If you go back, to the old threads I did worry. I complained when Richmond made the his announcement, and said I hoped no one else from the House got nominated to anything.

Also, proxy voting only works if the member is still alive. Let's not forgot that there's still a deadly pandemic going around for the next several months and an awful lot of House members are in a high-risk group.

[DMC]

3 minutes ago, Fez said:

Also, proxy voting only works if the member is still alive.

Damned technicalities.  Seriously, between vaccinations starting, the fact that no MCs have died of it yet, and how even high risk members of the Trump administration seemed to recover fine, I think this is an overstated worry.  Richmond, btw, just tested positive.  The likelihood of the amount of (only) Dem MCs dying in order to give the GOP an effective majority is probably less than the minuscule likelihood of Biden needing their votes on anything but stimulus until the vacancies are filled.

[Fragile Bird]

44 minutes ago, DMC said:

Damned technicalities.  Seriously, between vaccinations starting, the fact that no MCs have died of it yet, and how even high risk members of the Trump administration seemed to recover fine, I think this is an overstated worry.  Richmond, btw, just tested positive.  The likelihood of the amount of (only) Dem MCs dying in order to give the GOP an effective majority is probably less than the minuscule likelihood of Biden needing their votes on anything but stimulus until the vacancies are filled.

If Richmond dies it's on you for jinxing him! (kidding)

I think it's because politicians have the blood of evil flowing through their veins, it kills off the virus more quickly. No high level politician has died, except that guy, where, in New Hampshire? No one in Canada has died so far, and even Boris survived in the UK.

[Fury Resurrected]

2 hours ago, Fez said:

Again, Haaland is great. But Republicans temporarily gaining an effective majority in the House does more damage than the good she can do in the cabinet. If Biden wants her, great; but keep Richmond and Fudge in the House then.

That’s my point. She does more damage than good *for you* - for indigenous women, who are basically legal to rape and second only to trans women in most likely to be murdered- there is no way it could do more damage than good. To say she does more damage than good dismisses the enormous good she does for indigenous women and that is a shitty thing I am requesting you stop doing.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

24 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

If Richmond dies it's on you for jinxing him! (kidding)

I think it's because politicians have the blood of evil flowing through their veins, it kills off the virus more quickly. No high level politician has died, except that guy, where, in New Hampshire? No one in Canada has died so far, and even Boris survived in the UK.

I believe we need to test your hypothesis. Someone infect Newt Gingrich.

[Larry of the Lawn]

4 hours ago, Fragile Bird said:

It doesn’t, really, because the NY court decision made Uber drivers entitled to unemployment. If they hadn’t been entitled previously, it means that no one was paying into the UI system, neither the drivers nor Uber. As the article says, independent contractors have to pay their own UI, which is why corporations try to label people as ICs, to reduce tax costs. Same situation in Canada.
 

I just reread the decision and while the mechanics are not set out, I assume the court decision will allow NY to collect at least the employer portion of UI from Uber. I don’t know if the law allows them them to do this too but they might demand the employee portion from Uber as well, since they failed to collect it as required. I also suspect this decision will be appealed by Uber because, well, too many costs screws Uber’s business model. That was the whole reason Uber and Lyft stopped services in California until Prop 22 could be voted on. Prop 22 made drivers ICs, meaning Uber successfully shifted the tax burden onto its drivers.

I was focused on Larry’s comment that drivers were now entitled to receive unemployment, rather than the fact the court found them to be employees. As ICs they were entitled to receive unemployment as well, because they should have been declaring their income and paying their taxes, including unemployment. Except, I guess, as drivers they were in a work category that didn’t entitle them to get unemployment insurance, maybe? So no one ever paid into UI?
 

That goes to my question about how things work in the US. In Canada, only some ICs can opt to pay the UI tax. If you are an IC you have to apply to Revenue Canada to be made eligible, but many categories of work are ineligible. It’s usually people on contract doing jobs like employees do, under the control of the employer, like an accountant or a lawyer taking a short term contract at a company that needs you because of extra workload. They don’t intend to make you an employee, so they don’t have to do the payroll taxes, but you can ask to pay UI on your earnings.

Does NY have a proposition system like California? Can the proposition fairy touch Uber drivers and “poof”, turn them into ICs too?
 

 

I don't know too much about the legal ins and outs but I have been an independent contractor pretty much my whole life and from what I understand* I have been paying into UI even though I cannot ever collect it (well, other than during the pandemic).  

It also seems like a weird concern here - if they are employees then from now on Uber and the employees (through a payroll deduction) will pay into UI.  As far as retroactively goes, maybe NY tries to back charge the company but that seems like it would just keep Uber from operating in the state.  Either way, seems like a minor detail.

NY is ahead of many states on policing [who ]is really an independent contractor, in non-union construction especially you rarely find actual employees anywhere between absolute beginner or a master level specialist, because then you have to pay workers comp and everything.  So the labor board does occasionally get involved making sure that if an 'independent contractor' works exclusively for one company, has to hand in time sheets, and isn't setting their own schedule that they are reclassified as employees.  I remember a big HVAC company in Albany being fined and then forced to 'employ' most of their staff back in 2014.  

 

Tangentially, would be cool (not getting my hopes up though) if a labor related take-away from the pandemic is that people who are out of work find better jobs and that companies get better fitting hires if people aren't shoved off UI as fast as possible.  What little social safety net we have has so many hoops to jump through, and so many restrictions.  Between means testing and rushing people off UI it Is imagine we're not getting close to the optimal societal benefit that a such safety nets could ideally have.

[argonak]

1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

I believe we need to test your hypothesis. Someone infect Newt Gingrich.

Come on Tywin, even viruses have standards.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

I work in a Regus office.  Lots of different companies and offices with a common area for everyone to use. 

A group of men were standing in the lobby chatting.  I heard one say, “we should just take out one of these high officals”

I was getting a glass of ice and could help overhearing what he said.  He wasn’t even trying to be quiet.  

I said, “Are you suggesting we kill someone”.

He said, “I am.”

Then he got indignant that I jumped into the conversation he was having in the public gathering area for the office.  

What the hell is wrong with people.  

I’m sitting in my office shaking... Good grief.

[Myshkin]

Today I learned that Mitch McConnell cannot he trusted because he is married to a Chinese Communist. This feels a little strange to me since Elaine Chao was born in Taiwan, a country that literally only exists because of its opposition to Chinese Communism. 

[Fragile Bird]

Set Scot, I’d like to think that was just “water cooler” nonsense, but who the hell knows in this day and age.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

2 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

Set Scot, I’d like to think that was just “water cooler” nonsense, but who the hell knows in this day and age.

I’m still a bit freaked out.

[Fragile Bird]

1 minute ago, Myshkin said:

Today I learned that Mitch McConnell cannot he trusted because he is married to a Chinese Communist. This feels a little strange to me since Elaine Chao was born in Taiwan, a country that literally only exists because of its opposition to Chinese Communism. 

Do you actually post in these places? I thought you said no. But if you do, you should say that Trump the traitor focused all the attention against China (trade wars! Tik Tok!) so that US security forces would miss the fact the Russkies were infiltrating and stealing America’s secrets while “we weren’t looking!”

[Fez]

1 hour ago, Fury Resurrected said:

That’s my point. She does more damage than good *for you* - for indigenous women, who are basically legal to rape and second only to trans women in most likely to be murdered- there is no way it could do more damage than good. To say she does more damage than good dismisses the enormous good she does for indigenous women and that is a shitty thing I am requesting you stop doing.

Don't put words in my mouth. I never said that.

[Myshkin]

4 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

Do you actually post in these places? I thought you said no. But if you do, you should say that Trump the traitor focused all the attention against China (trade wars! Tik Tok!) so that US security forces would miss the fact the Russkies were infiltrating and stealing America’s secrets while “we weren’t looking!”

Oh no, no posting on these subreddits for me. I am an observer only. Besides, posting wouldn’t do anything except get me sucked into a vortex of circle-jerking anti-logic. I have witnessed it many times.

[Altherion]

3 hours ago, Fez said:

Again, Haaland is great. But Republicans temporarily gaining an effective majority in the House does more damage than the good she can do in the cabinet. If Biden wants her, great; but keep Richmond and Fudge in the House then.

The Republicans are not temporarily gaining an effective majority. Biden has been in politics longer than most Americans have been alive and he would not have missed such a detail. Furthermore, he got Pelosi's endorsement of his cabinet which means she finds the arrangements in the House acceptable.

Haaland for Interior is probably my favorite of the Cabinet picks so far. As far as I can tell, she really does mean to limit fossil fuel extraction on Federal lands which is long overdue.

[Myshkin]

4 hours ago, Fez said:

Again, Haaland is great. But Republicans temporarily gaining an effective majority in the House does more damage than the good she can do in the cabinet. If Biden wants her, great; but keep Richmond and Fudge in the House then.

I get where you’re going with this, but the idea that temporarily lessening the House majority (which will, you know, still be a majority) somehow comes close to offsetting the fact that a Native American woman will be the next head of Interior is ludicrous, and yes, even offensive. Keep in mind that the BIA (the agency through which the government has continually oppressed Native Americans) is part of Interior. Deb Haaland being named Secretary of the Interior isn’t just some symbolic victory; she will have the power to bring some measure of justice and equality to people who have for centuries, continuing to this day, been denied those very things. And that is much, much more important than a single House vote.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Myshkin said:

Oh no, no posting on these subreddits for me. I am an observer only. Besides, posting wouldn’t do anything except get me sucked into a vortex of circle-jerking anti-logic. I have witnessed it many times.

Some Goblin King you are...

[The Anti-Targ]

6 hours ago, DMC said:

This should help answer some of your questions.

Lol, I wonder if Uber and Lyft know how how ridiculous they sound threatening to withdraw from the California market. Prices will rise, but so long as they stay lower than the cost of taxis, and provide a more responsive service they will do fine.