Why Daenerys is a better ruler and leader than Jon

[Alyn Oakenfist]

20 minutes ago, El Guapo said:

9 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

I'm not talking about Dany fans, those are great, I'm talking about the Dany worshippers that think she's the Messiah abd everyone else the antichrist

Yeah nice strawman you got there.

What strawman? I'm not attempting to prove you wrong on anything I was just saying what kind of fans I was referring too.

[Rose of Red Lake]

Dany will take control of the Free Folk and the North, while all the remaining Starks die and stay in their wolves. Dany will unite the Kingdoms because she was able to burn slavers. Dany is Aegon the Conqueror reborn. Dany is Azor Ahai reborn. Dany is Queen Alysanne reborn. Dany is the Greatest Targaryen Ever. Dany is the hero of the story. Dany speaks many languages. The Starks will rule over a frozen hell as punishment for wanting Northern Independence. Walter Frey was just a humble toll worker doing his job. Ramsay was doing his duty while Jon was acting like a nut job. Janos is a martyr. Arya will set off the wildfire and burn Kings Landing because there’s no way Dany would do it shut up don’t even mention it Arya Arya Arya. Sansa is a dumb nobody why would we even talk about her when Dany is so good and the Starks are so bad. 

On Twitter where it’s harder to ban people for hurling insults, I was told to “stay jobless” last week by a lovely person with a Dany icon. And this was a mild week. They stalk, harass you for opinions on a fictional character. There’s really no other character in the story who has this kind of manic fever around her.

[Rose of Red Lake]

9 hours ago, BlackLightning said:

She already is bored and unhappy with ruling by the end of Dance.

Although Dany loves bad boys and finds conquest, war and competition thrilling (if I had to name one character in this series as an Aries, it'd be Daenerys), it is made very clear several times over that Dany would much rather be barefoot and pregnant with good neighbors, a strong husband and a batch of cookies in the oven. Ruling is necessity and a logical means to the end she wants. It's not something she wants or even truly enjoys in her heart-of-hearts.

This was a fair take, thank you. Finally. The only quibble is this last part. Dany had the opportunity to be “barefoot and pregnant “ with Drogo. She made a point to pause, and think about what a good life she had. But decided she was destined for better things because she was a Valyrian/ Targaryen. This has happened on multiple occasions now, so much that I would call these “chances” to walk away. She chose her mythical past, every time.

[Alyn Oakenfist]

26 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

Dany will take control of the Free Folk and the North, while all the remaining Starks die and stay in their wolves. Dany will unite the Kingdoms because she was able to burn slavers. Dany is Aegon the Conqueror reborn. Dany is Azor Ahai reborn. Dany is Queen Alysanne reborn. Dany is the Greatest Targaryen Ever. Dany is the hero of the story. Dany speaks many languages. The Starks will rule over a frozen hell as punishment for wanting Northern Independence. Walter Frey was just a humble toll worker doing his job. Ramsay was doing his duty while Jon was acting like a nut job. Janos is a martyr. Arya will set off the wildfire and burn Kings Landing because there’s no way Dany would do it shut up don’t even mention it Arya Arya Arya. Sansa is a dumb nobody why would we even talk about her when Dany is so good and the Starks are so bad. 

I think you missed a few:

- Jon will at the same time die and stay in Ghost and join up with the others and be resurrected bringing the Wall down. It's Schrodinger's Jon.

- Aegon is Maegor the Cruel, Aegon the Unworthy and Aerys the Mad all rolled into one. He's also definitely 100% sure without a shadow of a doubt a Blackfyre. His cruelty will only be outdone by his incompetence, and the people will hate him, and raise secret toasts for Dany, because God forbid Aegon be an actual good ruler who might distract the people from worshipping Dany.

- Bloodraven is actually evil and working with the others (notice a trend with all the other Targaryens but Dany?)

- Robb actually did turn into a wolf and attack the poor innocent Freys, just like Jared Frey said.

- Rickard Stark was worse then Roose Bolton

- Jon is actually Brandon's or Benjen's and Lyanna's

- Jon ultimate fate is to be with Arya, his 11 year old sister, though how he will do it being dead according to them is beyond me

[Alyn Oakenfist]

6 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

This was a fair take, thank you. Finally. The only quibble is this last part. Dany had the opportunity to be “barefoot and pregnant “ with Drogo. She made a point to pause, and think about what a good life she had. But decided she was destined for better things because she was a Valyrian/ Targaryen. This has happened on multiple occasions now, so much that I would call these “chances” to walk away. She chose her mythical past, every time.

Yeah, and once she deals with her current conflict of Mysha vs Mother of Dragons, presumably favoring her Mother of Dragons side, I think her next big internal conflict will be with her family's legacy, as in Westeros she will be fully confronted by her dynasty's past.

[Alyn Oakenfist]

29 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

On Twitter where it’s harder to ban people for hurling insults, I was told to “stay jobless” last week by a lovely person with a Dany icon. And this was a mild week. They stalk, harass you for opinions on a fictional character. There’s really no other character in the story who has this kind of manic fever around her.

Also don't forget that "there will be a reckoning" to all of us who don't worship the Fairy God Queen

[Rose of Red Lake]

 

24 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

I think you missed a few:

That's more than a few. Sheesh! I cant keep up. 

22 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

and raise secret toasts for Dany,

This is incorrect. A sloppy drunk at an Oldtown bar publicly toasted "The Stormborn." So this is proof of the smallfolk's support!

(even though I dont think he realizes that the tales of dragons are connected to her lmao)

[Alyn Oakenfist]

1 minute ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

This is incorrect. A sloppy drunk at an Oldtown bar publicly toasted "The Stormborn." So this is proof of the smallfolk's support!

(even though I dont think he realizes that the tales of dragons are connected to her lmao)

Shhh, don't you know, even if she's lived in Westeros for less then a day, the smallfolk can barely be asked to recall who the crown prince is, and Dany is currently half a world a way, all of Westeros knows about her, and sow dragon banners in the dark awaiting her return.

It is known.

[Rose of Red Lake]

5 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Shhh, don't you know, even if she's lived in Westeros for less then a day, the smallfolk can barely be asked to recall who the crown prince is, and Dany is currently half a world a way, all of Westeros knows about her, and sow dragon banners in the dark awaiting her return.

It is known.

The dragon banners are already sewn, the servants at House Darry had them in the basement the whole time! Just waiting for her return to put them back up! 

[Alyn Oakenfist]

Just now, Rose of Red Lake said:

The dragon banners are already sewn, the servants at House Darry had them in the basement the whole time! Just waiting for her return to put them back up! 

And all those loyalists will see Aegon as the fake that he is, and will definitely not support him with all their heart as the son of Rhaegar and Elia, instead waiting for the one true Fairy God Queen.

[Rose of Red Lake]

Just now, Alyn Oakenfist said:

And all those loyalists will see Aegon as the fake that he is, and will definitely not support him with all their heart as the son of Rhaegar and Elia, instead waiting for the one true Fairy God Queen.

So Daenerys is the cloth dragon on poles the crowds are cheering for? That's an interesting new theory. 

[Alyn Oakenfist]

1 minute ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

So Daenerys is the cloth dragon on poles the crowds are cheering for? That's an interesting new theory. 

No you see, the crowds are actually cheering for Daenerys while ignoring the fake cloth dragon. As I said, we can't have Aegon be popular or a good King, it might distract the people from worshipping the Fairy God Queen.

[Rose of Red Lake]

7 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

No you see, the crowds are actually cheering for Daenerys while ignoring the fake cloth dragon. As I said, we can't have Aegon be popular or a good King, it might distract the people from worshipping the Fairy God Queen.

Can we just jump to the timeline when it's,

"the small folk betrayed her,

they must burn."

[Alyn Oakenfist]

2 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

Can we just jump to the timeline when it's,

"the small folk betrayed her,

they must burn."

They were actually killed by Arya, who teleported to King's Landing from Braavos or the North to kill everyone as revenge for Jon being assassinated, and blame Dany for it.

[SeanF]

1 hour ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

This was a fair take, thank you. Finally. The only quibble is this last part. Dany had the opportunity to be “barefoot and pregnant “ with Drogo. She made a point to pause, and think about what a good life she had. But decided she was destined for better things because she was a Valyrian/ Targaryen. This has happened on multiple occasions now, so much that I would call these “chances” to walk away. She chose her mythical past, every time.

Drogo was never going to be a pipe and slippers man.  War is the trade of a khal.

[Alyn Oakenfist]

Just now, SeanF said:

Drogo was never going to be a pipe and slippers man.  War is the trade of a khal.

Not really, not full scale all out war that is. The Dothraki haven't done that since the Qohori 3000. The state the Dothraki exist with everything outside of the Great Grass Sea can best be described as a state of eternal skirmishing I think, mixed in with a half peace consisting of trade and tribute. However all out war only happens between khalasars.

[Moiraine Sedai]

16 hours ago, El Guapo said:

Well you are tiring yourself out for nothing because most Dany fans fully admit she has flaws which is the primary reason why she is such a great character.

She does but her strengths greatly outweigh her weaknesses.  

[SeanF]

5 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Not really, not full scale all out war that is. The Dothraki haven't done that since the Qohori 3000. The state the Dothraki exist with everything outside of the Great Grass Sea can best be described as a state of eternal skirmishing I think, mixed in with a half peace consisting of trade and tribute. However all out war only happens between khalasars.

40,000 warriors have to kept occupied and rewarded, else they’ll fight among themselves.  Drogo planned war around Qarth.

[Alyn Oakenfist]

1 minute ago, SeanF said:

40,000 warriors have to kept occupied and rewarded, else they’ll fight among themselves.  Drogo planned war around Qarth.

Not war. Raiding, raping and looting. Aka skirmishing. War would be trying to storm and take Qarth

[Rose of Red Lake]

Quote

If I were not the blood of the dragon, she thought wistfully, this could be my home. She was khaleesi, she had a strong man and a swift horse, handmaids to serve her, warriors to keep her safe, an honored place in the dosh khaleen awaiting her when she grew old … and in her womb grew a son who would one day bestride the world. That should be enough for any woman … but not for the dragon. With Viserys gone, Daenerys was the last, the very last. She was the seed of kings and conquerors, and so too the child inside her. She must not forget.

Dany makes a choice. Somehow staying with the Dothraki is forgetting who you are. "Remember who you are" comes up again at the end of ADWD.

Quote

The sky was blue, the grass was green, and I was full of hope. Ser Jorah had been with her then, her gruff old bear. She'd had Irri and Jhiqui and Doreah to care for her, her sun-and-stars to hold her in the night, his child growing inside her. Rhaego. I was going to name him Rhaego, and the dosh khaleen said he would be the Stallion Who Mounts the World. Not since those half-remembered days in Braavos when she lived in the house with the red door had she been as happy.

Dany remembers the place she was previously unsatisfied with, as a happy home now. It's like Sansa remembering the good times in Winterfell after her fairy tale in the South went to hell. Sansa is over it, while Dany is still acting toward a new fairy tale in Westeros. It's not necessarily wrong to want out of the situation she was sold into, and being proud of one's heritage is normal, but she romanticizes the past/future a lot still, very late in the story.