Bloodraven’s Spider Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Maesters are liars... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastWolf Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 4 hours ago, Bloodraven’s Spider said: Maesters are liars... History is written by the winners... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeron the Daring Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 10 hours ago, Endymion I Targaryen said: This can explain Gerold Dayne's silver hair which is the only clear Valyrian characteristic that GRRM has said nothing about. Edric Dayne - Dark blue/purple eyes, plus pale blond hair. This is just a simple example of George evading the answer, because it might be related to important things later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeron the Daring Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 hour ago, TheLastWolf said: History is written by the winners... That does change nothing. Remember how Maester Yandel wrote in TWOIAF that Elia herself crushed Aegon's skull to the wall? 50 years passing, and the truth would've been that everywhere, maybe not for Dorne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Endymion I Targaryen Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 2 hours ago, Daeron the Daring said: Edric Dayne - Dark blue/purple eyes, plus pale blond hair. This is just a simple example of George evading the answer, because it might be related to important things later. Tommen has white-blond hair. This does not indicate Valyrian heritage necesarily. Same with Edric. Agree with you.GRRM can give us the answer later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven’s Spider Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 18 hours ago, TheLastWolf said: History is written by the winners... Thats correct. Doesnt change that they lie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLastWolf Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 21 hours ago, Daeron the Daring said: That does change nothing. Remember how Maester Yandel wrote in TWOIAF that Elia herself crushed Aegon's skull to the wall? 50 years passing, and the truth would've been that everywhere, maybe not for Dorne. 4 hours ago, Bloodraven’s Spider said: Thats correct. Doesnt change that they lie I was not opposing your points so much as supporting it mates! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rose of Red Lake Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Because GRRM has a crush on Elizabeth Taylor, that's why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilac & Gooseberries Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 2 hours ago, Rose of Red Lake said: Because GRRM has a crush on Elizabeth Taylor, that's why. Can you blame him? She was mesmerizing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julia H. Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 I agree that GRRM's reply referring to Elizabeth Taylor was an evasive one, which seems to indicate that the colour of Ashara's eyes is an important clue to something. Otherwise he could have just said oh, well, a Targaryen girl or two obviously married into the Dayne family. But he didn't say that, instead he started talking about Elizabeth Taylor not being Valyrian. Having said that, I must confess that I totally subscribe to the Empire of Dawn theory. It is a great theory - and will remain so even if it gets disproved by upcoming books. It is based on the text of the books and I love the idea that perhaps Martin writes in this way. If that theory is true, then the Daynes, while not of Valyrian origin, are descendants of the same ancestors as the Valyrians. That would also explain the evasive answer - not exactly Valyrian but has something to do with Valyrians, a connection Martin may not have wanted to point out in an interview. The idea that House Dayne would not have preserved their original looks for thousands of years makes absolute sense in a real world context. However, in this world we know that every time a Baratheon man had a child with a Lannister woman, the child looked like a Baratheon, with black hair - the implication being that Baratheon men have always been black-haired, while Lannister women have always had golden hair. Already Lann the Clever was associated with golden hair - but how could the Lannisters preserve a feature apparently based on a recessive gene in the family intact over the centuries? ASOIAF genetics works differently from the real world one. In addition, purple eyes have a magical vibe in the story, which may also explain why this ancient feature may have been kept all the way down from the Great Empire of Dawn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilac & Gooseberries Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 24 minutes ago, Julia H. said: The idea that House Dayne would not have preserved their original looks for thousands of years makes absolute sense in a real world context. However, in this world we know that every time a Baratheon man had a child with a Lannister woman, the child looked like a Baratheon, with black hair - the implication being that Baratheon men have always been black-haired, while Lannister women have always had golden hair. Already Lann the Clever was associated with golden hair - but how could the Lannisters preserve a feature apparently based on a recessive gene in the family intact over the centuries? ASOIAF genetics works differently from the real world one. In addition, purple eyes have a magical vibe in the story, which may also explain why this ancient feature may have been kept all the way down from the Great Empire of Dawn. About the Baratheons, their genes seem to be the most powerful of them all. No matter who they procreate with their offspring will always look like them. My personal pet theory is that is a gene from their maternal line and a result of their Durrandon divine ancestors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julia H. Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Lilac & Gooseberries said: About the Baratheons, their genes seem to be the most powerful of them all. No matter who they procreate with their offspring will always look like them. My personal pet theory is that is a gene from their maternal line and a result of their Durrandon divine ancestors. This could be. The Lannister golden hair is still quite persistent though - but then it comes from the sun, doesn't it? Or from the gold of their mines? The emperors of the Empire of Dawn also had a divine ancestor... This may explain why eyes of special colours have been preserved in their descendants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobity. Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 On 1/17/2021 at 6:15 PM, Bloodraven’s Spider said: Maesters are liars... Who is feeding the lie though? Seems that the Hightowers have always held sway at the Citadel...who happen to resmeble the Daynes a wee bit if I say so myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodraven’s Spider Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 5 hours ago, Bobity. said: Who is feeding the lie though? Seems that the Hightowers have always held sway at the Citadel...who happen to resmeble the Daynes a wee bit if I say so myself. There is no doubt that House Hightower has shaped the citadel from the beginning. And history is written from the winners.. Not all of them are liars, Luwin has given no indication of lying. I think he truly didn’t understand the threat of white walkers and the children, the citadel forbids certain ways of thinking (exactly what marwyen tell Sam). The Daynes and Hightowers could easily have married into each other’s houses 1000’s of years ago or just men and women of each house getting together.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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