Dareon was a victim of Arya's brand of "justice"

[Lilac & Gooseberries]

8 hours ago, The Lord of the Crossing said:

That settled it.  Arya Stark is a pscyho.   It's actually clear from the books. 

I have two words for you. One is prove and the other is it.

[Lady_Qohor]

I'll second this. Unless you are a qualified psychiatrist and have had Arya in for assessment sessions its very difficult to tell if she is mentally ill or just a child whose has been surrounded by adults (Sandor, Jaquen, Roose Bolton, the Kindly Man) who have all shown a contempt/disregard for human life.

Children absorb and reflect their environment and Arya's environment has been extremely violent.

Don't forget that her beloved father, the honourable Ned Stark committed the same violence at the start of the book that she is being judged here for - the killing of a Nights Watch deserter. Unlike Arya, Ned was an adult when he carried out his execution and his deserter is scared out of his wits and warning about the Others. Yet no-one calls Ned Stark an insane pyschopath for this crime (yes I know it was a legal execution but I think we can agree that it was still morally wrong).

[HoodedCrow]

Lady Q, yes, Jaime, Ned, the Hound, Robert, Robb, or Stannis kill people too.

I did take psychiatry, in which they went over the DSM( that I had already studied in my undergrad) 

Arya shows no sign of being psychopathic, or psychotic, so I’m not sure what people mean by “ insane”. It is not a clinical word. She is traumatized, but she is also resilient, resourceful and likes to help her allies. I suppose she is a transvestite and a male impersonator, with non traditional gender role affiliation? Nevertheless, she could really stand some counseling after all that she has been through! She is on a bleak path.

I suspect that Martin went backwards on this. Something like...I’ll have a rogue/assassin, I wonder what would drive a Stark girl to this role? Ah, like a child soldier.

[Rondo]

16 hours ago, Bowen 747 said:

George R. R. Martin said in an interview that Arya Stark is psychopathic murderer.  Pay careful attention around the 55 minute mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfbwx7RAJss&feature=youtu.be&t=3316

That settles the argument.  No amount of spinning from her fans will change that.  Arya Stark is crazy and suffers from a severe personality disorder. 

 

I agree.   .  That was a very nice find.  

 

2 hours ago, James West said:

I've always considered Arya howling mad.  No need for this confirmation from GRRM.  All one need do is read the story and it is evident.  

She is a loony.  The interview simply confirmed what many among us already knew.

16 hours ago, Darksnider05 said:

I think I'll go with the context of him joking around after saying he's an incredibly hot girl who rides Dragons and Dwarf or a psychotic ten year old while laughing is a bit much for you.  If you can read all of the chapters of these characters and believe they are only one thing I think maybe there's no point of discussing anything with you.  

Arya spends to much time wool gathering about what she do for her to be a psychopath that whole build up to the insurance man should of explained that to you.  Or her caring about innocent people so much that she catches a beating till she bleeds over it.

 

Also there is a multi quote button you need to start using it triple/double posting is bad form on any forum.

It is your right to choose what to believe, no matter the evidence for or against it.  I don't hold that against you.  Just please understand, as far as many of the people here are concerned, Arya is crazy.  To me, the text made that evident through what Arya does and thinks.

I don't get upset if Arya's fans continue to like her.  Just because I don't like Arya does not mean others have to dislike her too.  We're not all going to feel the same way about the story's characters.

9 hours ago, The Lord of the Crossing said:

That settled it.  Arya Stark is a pscyho.   It's actually clear from the books. 

It is settled for those who are not very prejudiced towards Arya or may still had doubts about her condition.  

[HoodedCrow]

I suppose, if you consider warging or dragons, if someone in the real world told us that they have episodes in which they become an animal, or hatched dragon eggs we would consider that psychotic. So all the characters who think they are using magic are crazy and maybe Martin for having a Herculean imagination, and us for having the ability to suspend disbelief?

[CamiloRP]

3 hours ago, James West said:

I've always considered Arya howling mad.  No need for this confirmation from GRRM.  All one need do is read the story and it is evident.  

If it's so evident then you woul think someone would give a reason for it... But no, sixteen pages and not a shred of it.

[CamiloRP]

55 minutes ago, Rondo said:

She is a loony.  The interview simply confirmed what many among us already knew.

It is your right to choose what to believe, no matter the evidence for or against it.  I don't hold that against you.  Just please understand, as far as many of the people here are concerned, Arya is crazy.  To me, the text made that evident through what Arya does and thinks.

Whatin the text makes you think this?

 

57 minutes ago, Rondo said:

 

I don't get upset if Arya's fans continue to like her.  Just because I don't like Arya does not mean others have to dislike her too.  We're not all going to feel the same way about the story's characters.

It is settled for those who are not very prejudiced towards Arya or may still had doubts about her condition.  

I don't really like Arya that much, but no one has provided even one bit of textual support for her being 'insane' 'totally mad' 'psychotic' etc

[Lilac & Gooseberries]

17 minutes ago, CamiloRP said:

If it's so evident then you woul think someone would give a reason for it... But no, sixteen pages and not a shred of it.

I can bet that we will never get a clear answer. 

[Rondo]

10 minutes ago, CamiloRP said:

Whatin the text makes you think this?

Don't take this as a personal attack.  It is not meant to be.  Are you just overlooking what Arya was doing?  Mentally reciting and planning killing a lot of people, for one.  She crossed an ocean to learn how to kill more people.  It's like going overseas to enroll in Murder University.  She took on the ego and the identity of a poor girl who died.  She sees nothing wrong or odd about that.  She kills two people who meant her no harm.  I could go on but those are more than enough.

10 minutes ago, CamiloRP said:

 

I don't really like Arya that much, but no one has provided even one bit of textual support for her being 'insane' 'totally mad' 'psychotic' etc

 

[HoodedCrow]

Another fair assumption is that Arya has a high intelligence quotient, but Westeros doesn’t have cognitive testing. 

[SeanF]

2 hours ago, HoodedCrow said:

Lady Q, yes, Jaime, Ned, the Hound, Robert, Robb, or Stannis kill people too.

I did take psychiatry, in which they went over the DSM( that I had already studied in my undergrad) 

Arya shows no sign of being psychopathic, or psychotic, so I’m not sure what people mean by “ insane”. It is not a clinical word. She is traumatized, but she is also resilient, resourceful and likes to help her allies. I suppose she is a transvestite and a male impersonator, with non traditional gender role affiliation? Nevertheless, she could really stand some counseling after all that she has been through! She is on a bleak path.

I suspect that Martin went backwards on this. Something like...I’ll have a rogue/assassin, I wonder what would drive a Stark girl to this role? Ah, like a child soldier.

Both Daenerys and Arya are subject to endless cod psychology from people who have no qualifications in the subject.

[Alyn Oakenfist]

48 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Both Daenerys and Arya are subject to endless cod psychology from people who have no qualifications in the subject.

Good God I don't know which is worse. I mean Dany is the more outlandish claim, but Arya is the one made more often, so not sure which is worse. Anyways...

 

@Lilac & Gooseberries, @CamiloRP, @Darksnider05, @Nathan Stark and all the rest who have asked but I can't recall right now, I have till now asked I think 7 times on this thread for a single shred of textual evidence. You guys have asked just as often if not more so. The only replies we have gotten have just reiterated the main point of "Arya is insane" without it even being clear what the fuck "insane" even means, it's not like it's a medical term. I think it's safe to say we're wasting our time and should maybe move on.

[CamiloRP]

1 hour ago, Rondo said:

Don't take this as a personal attack.  It is not meant to be.  

I don't.

 

1 hour ago, Rondo said:

Are you just overlooking what Arya was doing?  

I'm not. A few months back I got labeled a Stark hater because of my views on Arya. What she's doing is wrong. Period. It's unhealthy, and a lot of people don't see that, but it doesn't mean she's insane/ a psycho/ completely mad.

 

1 hour ago, Rondo said:

Mentally reciting and planning killing a lot of people, for one.  

She has that list as a coping mechanism for her trauma, but wishing to kill people who harmed her does not equal insane. 

 

1 hour ago, Rondo said:

She crossed an ocean to learn how to kill more people.  It's like going overseas to enroll in Murder University.  

She didn't tho, she planned to get passage to the Wall, to find the only family she has left (as far as she knows). She only got the the hobaw because she had nowhere else to go, and they, like cults do, gave her an insentive to stay.

 

1 hour ago, Rondo said:

She took on the ego and the identity of a poor girl who died.  She sees nothing wrong or odd about that. 

Honestly, I don't see a big issue here. And even then, she's eleven, and she's being molded by a cult of death worshipers.

 

Quote

She kills two people who meant her no harm.  I could go on but those are more than enough.

Yes, and again, that's wrong, but it's not a signifier of insanity.

 

She's a little girl, and like I said before, there are a bunch of children in our world that lose their families and get consumed by revenge, that gets coopted by people whose interest is them becoming murderers, so they get brainwashed into it. Are this kids psychos/ insane/ mad? No, they are traumatized.

 

Arya's arc is leading her towards a dark path, really dark, but she's not insane.

[SeanF]

1 hour ago, CamiloRP said:

I don't.

 

I'm not. A few months back I got labeled a Stark hater because of my views on Arya. What she's doing is wrong. Period. It's unhealthy, and a lot of people don't see that, but it doesn't mean she's insane/ a psycho/ completely mad.

 

She has that list as a coping mechanism for her trauma, but wishing to kill people who harmed her does not equal insane. 

 

She didn't tho, she planned to get passage to the Wall, to find the only family she has left (as far as she knows). She only got the the hobaw because she had nowhere else to go, and they, like cults do, gave her an insentive to stay.

 

Honestly, I don't see a big issue here. And even then, she's eleven, and she's being molded by a cult of death worshipers.

 

Yes, and again, that's wrong, but it's not a signifier of insanity.

 

She's a little girl, and like I said before, there are a bunch of children in our world that lose their families and get consumed by revenge, that gets coopted by people whose interest is them becoming murderers, so they get brainwashed into it. Are this kids psychos/ insane/ mad? No, they are traumatized.

 

Arya's arc is leading her towards a dark path, really dark, but she's not insane.

In our world, children get inducted into terrorist movements and gangs by cynical olders.  That does not make them mad or evil.

[Darth Sidious]

22 hours ago, Bowen 747 said:

George R. R. Martin said in an interview that Arya Stark is psychopathic murderer.  Pay careful attention around the 55 minute mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfbwx7RAJss&feature=youtu.be&t=3316

That settles the argument.  No amount of spinning from her fans will change that.  Arya Stark is crazy and suffers from a severe personality disorder. 

 

Great!  From Martin himself.  

It’s the author’s deliberate decision to write Arya Stark as a psycho.  The interview is that direct evidence that she is one.

[Lilac & Gooseberries]

3 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

@Lilac & Gooseberries, @CamiloRP, @Darksnider05, @Nathan Stark and all the rest who have asked but I can't recall right now, I have till now asked I think 7 times on this thread for a single shred of textual evidence. You guys have asked just as often if not more so. The only replies we have gotten have just reiterated the main point of "Arya is insane" without it even being clear what the fuck "insane" even means, it's not like it's a medical term. I think it's safe to say we're wasting our time and should maybe move on.

Of course we will never get one. Mainly because there isn't one.

[Nathan Stark]

@Bowen 747 @Rondo @The Lord of the Crossing @Moiraine Sedai @James West @Prince Rhaego Targaryen

I saw the video posted. I wonder if you guys understand the concept of tongue in cheek? Because George was joking around in the interview, as shown by the audience laughter and applause. Here's a hint: when the author refers to himself as inhabiting "a dwarf," "an incredibly hot chick riding a dragon," or "a psychopathic 10 year old," for the amusement of a crowd, he's probably not being 100% serious. Weak sauce, guys. Weak sauce.

More to the point, psychopathy is a distinct sort of anti-social disorder, characterized by:

-a lack of empathy

-a lack of conscience

-a lack of remorse

-a high degree of self regard or narcissism

-complete willingness to manipulate others

-a high degree of impulsivity

Arya is, in the text, characterized as being deeply empathetic for Micah, and for the smallfolk she encounters in the riverlands. She has a strong sense of justice, to the extent that the names on her list are all of people who committed crimes against her, her family, her friends, or the smallfolk, indicating a strong moral conscience. She displays feelings of remorse or guilt over some of her actions, most notably over her first kill, the stableboy. She does not display a sense of narcissism at any point. She is quite impulsive and hot headed. So, 1 out of six. And that's just from a single google search.

Find better arguments. What you guys are doing here, with this video, is a logical fallacy called an Appeal to Authority. And in this case, the authority in question, George R. R. Martin, is not even being entirely serious in his comments. He has, on the other hand, compared Arya in the past to child soldiers, who are real people who exist in our own world. Such people are not psychopaths, they are not insane, and they are not necessarily evil, but they have often done terrible things in wartime. Which is a situation that is much more comparable to Arya than her being insane and psychotic.

[CamiloRP]

6 hours ago, Prince Rhaego Targaryen said:

Great!  From Martin himself.  

It’s the author’s deliberate decision to write Arya Stark as a psycho.  The interview is that direct evidence that she is one.

Again, some textual support? Or are you just making stuff up?

[Dracul's Daughter]

@Prince Rhaego Targaryen are you aware that people say the same stuff about your favourite character : Daenerys Targaryen and mostly they act exactly like you do,twisting things up,posting quotes without a context and make assumptions based mostly on speculations?

I love all these characters either them being Stark or Targaryen does not matter (I also love other characters outside those houses) so I honestly can't wrap my head around this stupid "war" amongst fans.You and other haters throw shade on characters that Martin definitely wrote as sympathetic and missing out big points of the books.

[SeanF]

2 minutes ago, Dracul's Daughter said:

@Prince Rhaego Targaryen are you aware that people say the same stuff about your favourite character : Daenerys Targaryen and mostly they act exactly like you do,twisting things up,posting quotes without a context and make asumptions based mostly about speculations?

I love all these characters either them being Stark or Targaryen does not matter (I also love other characters outside those houses) so I honestly can't wrap my head around this stupid "war" amongst fans.You and other haters throw shade on characters that Martin definitely wrote as sympathetic and missing out big points of the books.

Likewise, I like all of Arya, Daenerys, Jon, Sansa, Bran, Jaime, et. and hope they pull through (but suspect not all will). I can't say I like Tyrion, but he is a compelling character.