US Politics: The Republicans problem with small packages

[Kalbear]

Heh

 

 

[Jaxom 1974]

Only the best people...seriously, someone is trolling with all of this right? Anything and everything that comes from that camp has to have at least one massive typo...

 

[briantw]

10 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

Only the best people...seriously, someone is trolling with all of this right? Anything and everything that comes from that camp has to have at least one massive typo...

 

Only the best people who are willing to work for him knowing they are almost certainly never getting paid for it.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

28 minutes ago, briantw said:

Only the best people who are willing to work for him knowing they are almost certainly never getting paid for it.

Everything he touches withers and dies.

[Hereward]

Tywin,

I don’t know how to quote from a previous thread. Sue me, I’m old. But yes, you are right to say that the comment should apply to urban areas, outside the cities. However, that does not mean that they do not encounter immigrants. Northern urban communities often tend to live segregated lives, rather than not encountering anyone from an immigrant community. This problem is exacerbated by cultural differences, though I know I’m going to get in trouble for this. 
 

The old communitarian ethos of the areas that went Conservative was centred around the chapel, the unions and the pub. Immigrants were overwhelmingly from Muslim communities from the sub-continent. Two of the three connection points were never going to happen, and the unions were also largely hostile to immigrants perceived as willing to work for less and not joining unions. 
 

But that’s not the whole story. Half of My own family comes from unusually poor agricultural areas in the east of the country. They voted overwhelmingly for Brexit, and are culturally concerned. That’s not because they are worried particularly about darker skinned immigrants they don’t meet, but rather a massive change in the population in their areas, almost all of whom are white Eastern Europeans. They are used to a situation where they know everyone, and all their relatives and dubious histories. They find having 40% of their local population totally alien to them distressing.

You have to remember that, unlike the US, the UK was 98% white in living memory. But that’s not the whole story. On the other side of my family, in the east end of London and south Essex, and even in the far right groups some of them associate with, there’s no real hostility towards black people, especially with the large number of mixed race people in these communities. They have lots in common, culturally, but there is massive resentment of other immigrant communities, sparked by the closure of what they regard as community hubs that have closed because the newer communities do not frequent them, though of course in some cases that’s understandable. The “white flight” is not really just about fear of the other, after all east London has been a melting pot for centuries, it’s about an influx of people who, perfectly understandably, cannot integrate into or evolve the existing culture, which makes these places economically unviable.

 

[SpaceChampion]

@A Horse Named Stranger said:

Quote

Which is kinda the point. Brexit was/is (white) British identity politics on steroids.

Among the hoi peloi.  Amongst the elite, George Monbiot says it was a civil war amongst capitalists.  One side, the neoreactionaries like in the U.S. Peter Thiel types who want capitalism without the democracy, and basically chaos allow them to strip away the latter.  On the other, ye old democratic-capitalists who for this does not compute.

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/24/brexit-capitalism

 

[Mindwalker]

Lindsey Graham keeps arning against calling witnesses. What is he afraid of?

[A Horse Named Stranger]

6 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

@A Horse Named Stranger said:

Among the hoi peloi.  Amongst the elite, George Monbiot says it was a civil war amongst capitalists.  One side, the neoreactionaries like in the U.S. Peter Thiel types who want capitalism without the democracy, and basically chaos allow them to strip away the latter.  On the other, ye old democratic-capitalists who for this does not compute.

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/24/brexit-capitalism

 

You could view it thru that lense. You can also view the Trump presidency thru that lense. That explains some of the donors actions. It does not explain the behaviour of the voters.

Do you believe roughly half the British electorate knowingly and willingly voted for getting screwed over by Peter Thiel? [Thank you btw. for claiming him as American. You can keep him, no, returns, no refunds. He is now yours for all eternity]. Anyway, @mormont explained my point. They voted for some nationalist sentinemt/values/identity politics. Brexit Britania Rule the waves (free strong independent, whatever), Trump voters. Make America Great Again, America First. Neither was about particularly well thought out policies.

 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

I know, people get a bit tired of it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5g6_y-QbDY

 

But they know their attacks.

[SpaceChampion]

2 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Do you believe roughly half the British electorate knowingly and willingly voted for getting screwed over by Peter Thiel?

Is that what you think I said, or you just enjoy strawmen?

[DMC]

1 hour ago, KalbearAnon said:

Heh

 

 

That's one topic of discussion that will ruin a perfectly good lunch.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

5 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

Is that what you think I said, or you just enjoy strawmen?

Hum? No, just pointed out, that the discussion was about the what made the electorate vote. Not the sinister underlying interests of disaster capitalists or vulture funds. You could've also brought up Russian interests and their use of social media. Cambridge Analytica and Sugarhill's propaganda bubble.

[Lollygag]

In Biden's inauguration with all of the unity and video from people from all walks of life, I caught not one single farm or small town Main Street.

https://thehill.com/homenews/house/536860-the-memo-ohio-dem-says-many-in-party-cant-understand-working-class-concerns

Quote

A Democratic colleague of Rep. Marcy Kaptur (D-Ohio) recently suggested a simple solution to the economic problems afflicting the industrial Midwest.

“ ‘Well, Congresswoman Kaptur, the answer is: Leave,’ ” Kaptur says she was told by the Democratic member, whom she declined to name.

Kaptur, whose district includes her hometown of Toledo, where she grew up the daughter of a union organizer, was appalled.

“They just can’t understand,” she told The Hill. “They can’t understand a family that sticks together because that’s what they have. Their loved ones are what they have, their little town, their home, as humble as it is — that’s what they have. Respect it. It was so insensitive.”

...

“Several of my colleagues who are in the top ranks have said to me, ‘You know, we don’t understand your part of the country.’ And they’re very genuine,” Kaptur says. “You can’t understand what you haven’t been a part of.”

Quote

The story is part of a bigger narrative for Kaptur, the longest-serving woman in Congress.

She fears that her party is increasingly dominated by members representing affluent districts — and that the social mores of rich coastal cities are sidelining kitchen-table economic concerns.

...

Kaptur shared with The Hill a chart ranking congressional districts by median household income, and their party representation. Of the top 20 wealthiest districts, 19 are represented by Democrats. Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s (D-Calif.) district is the fourth-richest in the nation, according to Kaptur’s data.

Democrats also dominate the upper half of the nation’s districts by a clear margin, with the bottom half disproportionately choosing Republicans as their members of Congress.

...

But it is the economic issues that really animate Kaptur — and the fear that her party is losing its ability to grasp the problems confronting the heartland.

Asked what the party should do, she replies emphatically: “Understand what has happened economically in these places, for heaven’s sake!”

 

[Fez]

The Senate just voted to formally begin the reconciliation process on a 50-49 vote (Toomey was absent, so Harris wasn't needed), so this is happening. I saw rumors this morning that a vote-a-rama may start later today, but I don't know if the timing still works out on that. 

Perhaps they really will be able to wrap up COVID relief before Trump's trial begins. Although, I'm not sure how quickly things can move when there's still no organizing resolution and Republicans still chair all the senate committees based on the last session. It's so weird that this hasn't gotten resolved yet; and also that there's been almost no press coverage about it or senators making statements.

 

[DMC]

Just now, Fez said:

Although, I'm not sure how quickly things can move when there's still no organizing resolution and Republicans still chair all the senate committees based on the last session.

Yeah they're not getting any reconciliation bill out of committee until there's an organizing resolution.

[Fez]

Oh and classic Sanders

Time for Sanders to do his best impression of James Adomian's impression of him.

[Mindwalker]

*snicker*

 

[Fragile Bird]

32 minutes ago, Fez said:

The Senate just voted to formally begin the reconciliation process on a 50-49 vote (Toomey was absent, so Harris wasn't needed), so this is happening. I saw rumors this morning that a vote-a-rama may start later today, but I don't know if the timing still works out on that. 

 

 

I have a question. Maybe I have heard this before, I have a fuzzy recollection of it, but I heard someone say the other day something like "Don't forget, any money spent by way of Reconciliation, because it hasn't received the higher vote, has to be deducted from the budget somewhere. Where's it going to come from, Medicare?"

Is that right

[Maithanet]

2 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

I have a question. Maybe I have heard this before, I have a fuzzy recollection of it, but I heard someone say the other day something like "Don't forget, any money spent by way of Reconciliation, because it hasn't received the higher vote, has to be deducted from the budget somewhere. Where's it going to come from, Medicare?"

Is that right

No, it is not.  There are legal hoops you have to jump through and there are plenty of things that can't fit into a reconciliation bill, but reconciliation bills can and often do increase deficit spending. 

I will defer to better informed boarders for a more detailed response. 

[JGP]

This. 

Excise them from wherever they've embedded themselves, toss them into the heap of defective castings and extraneous scrap.