Moqorro and his glamor, Marwyn, and Victarion

[Egged]

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Call it what you will. Glamor, seeming, illusion. R'hllor is Lord of Light, Jon Snow, and it is given to his servants to weave with it, as others weave with thread. - Melissandre

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Mummers change their faces with artifice, and sorcerers use glamors, weaving light and shadow and desire to make illusions that trick the eye. - Kindly Man

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The sound echoed queerly from the corners of the room and twisted like a worm inside their ears. The wildling heard one word, the crow another. Neither was the word that left her lips. The ruby on the wildling's wrist darkened, and the wisps of light and shadow around him writhed and faded. - Melissandre

Writher: to twist or bend out of shape or position; distort; contort.

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The wizard was a monster of a man, as tall as Victarion himself and twice as wide, with a belly like a boulder and a tangle of bone-white hair that grew about his face like a lion's mane. His skin was black. Not the nut brown of the Summer Islanders on their swan ships, nor the red-brown of the Dothraki horselords, nor the charcoal-and-earth color of the dusky woman's skin, but black. Blacker than coal, blacker than jet, blacker than a raven's wing. Burned, Victarion thought, like a man who has been roasted in the flames until his flesh chars and crisps and falls smoking from his bones. The fires that had charred him still danced across his cheeks and forehead, where his eyes peered out from amongst a mask of frozen flames. Slave tattoos, the captain knew. Marks of evil. "We found him clinging to a broken spar," said the Vole. "He was ten days in the water after his ship went down."

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The firelight made his black skin shine like polished onyx, and sometimes Victarion could swear that the flames tattooed on his face were dancing too, twisting and bending, melting into one another, their colours changing with every turn of the priest's head.

The words used are literally those that stand for writhered used to describe how the glamor was seen in the Melissandre chapter.

I think it leaves little to no doubt that Moqorro is using a glamor. Strangely, nothing weird is noticed about Moqorro when he's on the Qhoran with Tyrion, his description is close enough to Victarion's minus seeing the glamor-like effect. Something changed between then and when he is found by Victarion. Did something happen as a result of the storm? Whatever the case the use of the glamor is noticeable in Victarion's chapter, and there are indications that not all see the same thing when looking at someone wearing a glamor, so maybe Victarion is seeing Moqorro as almost magical and powerful in appearance because Moqorro wants to be seen as such, or simply because the glamor responds to Victarion's psyche. In any case, either he's just using it to appear more powerful, or Moqorro is not really Moqorro.

If the later is the case, the most likely candidate is that he is Marwyn. Moqorro is a real person according to the WOIAF. Either Marwyn, when he goes abroad for long periods of time as he has done before, as far as Asshai, sometimes uses a glamor to hide his identity, or he has stolen the identity of Moqorro at some point and he is now impersonating him. I'm thinking the former is more likely, that Marwyn has a habit of using the glamor to change his identity when need be and Moqorro was always him, but it works either way.

Aemon's body was placed a cask of rum on the Cinnamon Wind on its way to Oldtown.

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Quhuru Mo would not allow a funeral pyre aboard the Cinnamon Wind, so Aemon's corpse had been stuffed inside a cask of blackbelly rum to preserve it until the ship reached Oldtown.

In a Tyrion chapter in ADWD, they board the same ship as Moqorro, which has the following in its cargo:

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Two days from now, the cog Selaesori Qhoran will set sail for Qarth by way of New Ghis, carrying tin and iron, bales of wool and lace, fifty Myrish carpets, a corpse pickled in brine, twenty jars of dragon peppers, and a red priest. Be on her when she sails.

Preserving the body in rum was a spur of the moment idea, it's not something you'd commonly use for preservation, but brine is more appropriate. Well it would make sense then that Aemon's body was transferred to a more appropriate method of preservation once it reached Oldtown, where people like maesters would know better. Also, let's ignore the strange coincidence of the name Quhuru Mo, a captain who once went to meet Daenerys and her young dragons in person in A Clash of Kings, sounds like a play on Moqorro.

In any case, we have a very likely link between Oldtown and the Selaesori Qhoran with Aemon's corpse. Tyrion also notes that:

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But Moqorro was the true master of the Selaesori Qhoran, at least for this voyage.

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"Dragons," Moqorro said in the Common Tongue of Westeros. He spoke it very well, with hardly a trace of accent. No doubt that was one reason the high priest Benerro had chosen him to bring the faith of R'hllor to Daenerys Targaryen. "Dragons old and young, true and false, bright and dark. And you. A small man with a big shadow, snarling in the midst of all."

Then there is the storm, which seems to be called by Moqorro, and who knows what happens to Aemon's body if it is his. Maybe it was a sacrifice as they neared Valyria, no idea.

And then there are strong similarities between Mirri Maz Duur's healing spell and Moqorro's to Victarion. Remember Mirri said she had been taught anatomy by Marwyn (presumably in Essos). Here Moqorro does his thing, sounding rather Maester-like rather than solely red priest-like:

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“He had a rose on his shield, the man who gave this to me. I scratched my hand on a thorn.”

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“Even the smallest scratch can prove mortal, lord Captain, but if you will allow me, I will heal this. I will need a blade. Silver would be best, but iron will serve. A brazier as well. I must needs light a fire. There will be pain. Terrible pain, such as you have never known. But when we are done, your hand will be returned to you.”

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The iron captain was not seen again that day, but as the hours passed the crew of his Iron Victory reported hearing the sound of wild laughter coming from the captain’s cabin, laughter deep and dark and mad, and when Longwater Pyke and Wulfe One-Eye tried the cabin door they found it barred. Later singing was heard, a strange high wailing song in a tongue the maester said was High Valyrian. That was when the monkeys left the ship, screeching as they leapt into the water.

Mirri's:

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"Is scratch, moon of life, from arakh of one bloodrider to Khal Ogo," Khal Drogo said in the Common Tongue. "I kill him for it, and Ogo too." -Drogo

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"It burned, yes. There is great healing magic in fire, even your hairless men know that." -Mirri

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Braziers were lit. Mirri Maz Duur tossed a red powder onto the coals

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A knife appeared in her hand. Dany never saw where it came from. It looked old; hammered red bronze, leaf-shaped, its blade covered with ancient glyphs.

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Mirri Maz Duur’s voice rose to a high, ululating wail that sent a shiver down Dany’s back

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“Strength of the mount, go into the rider,” Mirri sang as horse blood swirled into the waters of Drogo’s bath. “Strength of the beast, go into the man.”

So if we accept this we have:

1- Moqorro is using a glamor.
2- Aemon's body, which was last in old town, is now on the ship which he is said to be essentially the master of.
3- Moqorro sounds like a Westerosi.
4- Marwyn is on his way to Slaver's Bay with no explanation of how he'd get through considering how the Ironborns are there. Well Moqorro manages to get onboard their leader's ship and gain his confidence.
5- Moqorro's spell is extremely similar to Mirri Maz Duur's, who was taught by Marwyn.
5- GRRM often said that the Meereenes knot was getting all the characters he wanted in the right place at the right time. Marwyn leaves to Meereen in AFFC and yet is never heard from again. Instead we have a new character tagging along, which would make it even more difficult to have Marwyn show up as it would require more writing to explain things. Unless of course he is in ADWD and he is Moqorro.

It's unlikely that Moqorro is Euron, as he trashes their drowned god as a pawn of the Other and the dusky woman, who is clearly an Euron spy, hisses at him:

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As he opened the door to the captain's cabin, the dusky woman turned toward him, silent and smiling … but when she saw the red priest at his side her lips drew back from her teeth, and she hisssssed in sudden fury, like a snake.

So I can only imagine he is Marwyn, and be left wondering what the heck is Marwyn planning to do with Victarion and beyond.

[Aebram]

You've made some interesting connections here, but the conclusion seems like a stretch to me. Marwyn may be able to glamour himself, but what about those 5 slaves who traveled with him and came out to chant with him every night? Also, why would he bring Maester Aemon's body with him on such a long and dangerous journey?

(And on a completely unrelated topic: Marwyn, Mirri, Moqorro... Is there something special about the letter M related to sorcery? Melisandre, Maggy ... seems like a pattern.)

[Megorova]

There's definitely something there, though there's two inconsistencies in your theory:

1.

4 hours ago, Egged said:

5- Moqorro's spell is extremely similar to Mirri Maz Duur's, who was taught by Marwyn.

Marwyn indeed was Mirri's teacher, though from him she learned medicine, anatomy, things like that, and magic she learned from a different person, from a shadowbinder.

Spoiler

In my opinion that shadowbinder was Quaithe, who's real name is Shiera Seastar. Both Marwyn and Mirri were Quaithe's apprentices, they learned magic from her, and learned different forms of medicine from each other, sort of a cultural exchange.

2. "The glass candles are burning. Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon. Trust none of them. Remember the Undying. Beware the perfumed seneschal."

Spoiler

Kraken and dark flame - Victarion and Moqorro. Lion and griffin - Tyrion and Jon Connington. The sun's son - Quentyn Martell. The mummer's dragon - fAegon.

The perfumed seneschal - septa Lemore, real name - Jeyne Swann, fAegon's mother, parallel to Lady Jonquil (jonquil is a flower, in Medieval times jonquil oil was used as a component to make perfumes), while fAegon's father, Barristan Selmy is a parallel to Florian the Fool (Barristan's mother was Aenys Blackfyre's daughter. Daemon I Blackfyre was a grandson of Larra Rogare/Serenei of Lys, Larra's mother was Johanna Swann, the Black Swan of Lys, she was a courtesan and worked in a pleasure house, the Perfumed Garden).

ADOS, Tyrion IX, on board of the Selaesori Qhoran/Fragrant Steward:

"You think Daenerys will execute me and pardon you, but the reverse is just as likely. Maybe you should hop up on that pig, Ser Jorah. Put on a suit of iron motley, like Florian the—"

The blow the big knight gave him cracked his head around and knocked him sideways, so hard that his head bounced off the deck."

Marwyn is Quaithe's/Shiera's apprentice, she didn't warned Dany about Marwyn's coming, him Dany shouldn't mistrust, while she did warned Dany against "dark flame". Thus Moqorro is not Marwyn.

Though could be that there are two Moqorros. One is real, and one is Marwyn in shadow-glamour.

For a shadowbinder to impersonate someone, he/she needs to use someone's look/face as a basis. Could be that Marwyn met Moqorro, and decided that it will be easier to travel thru Essos, if he will impersonate a Red Priest. Thus Moqorro at Volantis was the real one, while later Marwyn took over his place, and from then on he was wearing shadow-glamour and pretending to be Moqorro. And the real Moqorro is also traveling to Meereen, and that's him who is the dark flame, and of whom Dany should be aware of.

Also, just because the kraken and the dark flame were together in Quaithe's warning, it doesn't mean that they will come to Dany also together. Just look at Tyrion - the lion was paired together with the griffin, but now Tyrion separated from Jon Connington. The sun's son and the mummer's dragon also didn't came together, instead Quentyn came to Dany alone, and fAegon went to Westeros. So could be that the kraken and the dark flame are also separated, and never even were going anywhere together, and they will come to Dany not together. Though the kraken/Victarion will come to Meereen together with fMoqorro(Marwyn in shadow-glamour). And then the real Moqorro will also arrive to Meereen, alone.

That's kind of convoluted, but it makes an interesting twist to the story. For example, Victarion and Moqorro will come to Dany, and readers and Dany will expect that both of them are bad guys, because Quaithe warned Dany about both of them. But then it will be revealed that Moqorro is not Moqorro, instead he is Marwyn, and he will reveal to Dany that he knows Quaithe, and that in the past he used to be Quaithe's apprentice, thus to him Dany could trust. Or something like that.

P.S. By the way, your theory is quite good . It's rare to meet on this forum people who think out of the box, and are able to notice new elements in the books.

[Egged]

3 hours ago, Aebram said:

You've made some interesting connections here, but the conclusion seems like a stretch to me. Marwyn may be able to glamour himself, but what about those 5 slaves who traveled with him and came out to chant with him every night? Also, why would he bring Maester Aemon's body with him on such a long and dangerous journey?

(And on a completely unrelated topic: Marwyn, Mirri, Moqorro... Is there something special about the letter M related to sorcery? Melisandre, Maggy ... seems like a pattern.)

We don't know Marwyn's intention. A sacrifice for his storm-moment? No idea. But they wouldn't know better. He's Moqorro, the same Moqorro people would have known before. A red priest. Red priests traveling with red priests is not surprising. And later Moqorro is quite fine with having Victarion sacrifice a bunch of people. So if he's Marwyn, Marwyn is someone who makes sacrifices, which is unsurprising for anyone who made it to Asshai and makes queer sacrifices to weird gods and whatnot.

 

2 hours ago, Megorova said:

There's definitely something there, though there's two inconsistencies in your theory:

1.

Marwyn indeed was Mirri's teacher, though from him she learned medicine, anatomy, things like that, and magic she learned from a different person, from a shadowbinder.

  Hide contents

In my opinion that shadowbinder was Quaithe, who's real name is Shiera Seastar. Both Marwyn and Mirri were Quaithe's apprentices, they learned magic from her, and learned different forms of medicine from each other, sort of a cultural exchange.

2. "The glass candles are burning. Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon. Trust none of them. Remember the Undying. Beware the perfumed seneschal."

  Reveal hidden contents

Kraken and dark flame - Victarion and Moqorro. Lion and griffin - Tyrion and Jon Connington. The sun's son - Quentyn Martell. The mummer's dragon - fAegon.

The perfumed seneschal - septa Lemore, real name - Jeyne Swann, fAegon's mother, parallel to Lady Jonquil (jonquil is a flower, in Medieval times jonquil oil was used as a component to make perfumes), while fAegon's father, Barristan Selmy is a parallel to Florian the Fool (Barristan's mother was Aenys Blackfyre's daughter. Daemon I Blackfyre was a grandson of Larra Rogare/Serenei of Lys, Larra's mother was Johanna Swann, the Black Swan of Lys, she was a courtesan and worked in a pleasure house, the Perfumed Garden).

ADOS, Tyrion IX, on board of the Selaesori Qhoran/Fragrant Steward:

"You think Daenerys will execute me and pardon you, but the reverse is just as likely. Maybe you should hop up on that pig, Ser Jorah. Put on a suit of iron motley, like Florian the—"

The blow the big knight gave him cracked his head around and knocked him sideways, so hard that his head bounced off the deck."

Marwyn is Quaithe's/Shiera's apprentice, she didn't warned Dany about Marwyn's coming, him Dany shouldn't mistrust, while she did warned Dany against "dark flame". Thus Moqorro is not Marwyn.

Though could be that there are two Moqorros. One is real, and one is Marwyn in shadow-glamour.

For a shadowbinder to impersonate someone, he/she needs to use someone's look/face as a basis. Could be that Marwyn met Moqorro, and decided that it will be easier to travel thru Essos, if he will impersonate a Red Priest. Thus Moqorro at Volantis was the real one, while later Marwyn took over his place, and from then on he was wearing shadow-glamour and pretending to be Moqorro. And the real Moqorro is also traveling to Meereen, and that's him who is the dark flame, and of whom Dany should be aware of.

Also, just because the kraken and the dark flame were together in Quaithe's warning, it doesn't mean that they will come to Dany also together. Just look at Tyrion - the lion was paired together with the griffin, but now Tyrion separated from Jon Connington. The sun's son and the mummer's dragon also didn't came together, instead Quentyn came to Dany alone, and fAegon went to Westeros. So could be that the kraken and the dark flame are also separated, and never even were going anywhere together, and they will come to Dany not together. Though the kraken/Victarion will come to Meereen together with fMoqorro(Marwyn in shadow-glamour). And then the real Moqorro will also arrive to Meereen, alone.

That's kind of convoluted, but it makes an interesting twist to the story. For example, Victarion and Moqorro will come to Dany, and readers and Dany will expect that both of them are bad guys, because Quaithe warned Dany about both of them. But then it will be revealed that Moqorro is not Moqorro, instead he is Marwyn, and he will reveal to Dany that he knows Quaithe, and that in the past he used to be Quaithe's apprentice, thus to him Dany could trust. Or something like that.

P.S. By the way, your theory is quite good . It's rare to meet on this forum people who think out of the box, and are able to notice new elements in the books.

Thanks!

Regarding Mirri learning medicine from Marwyn, in the quote I posted she says calls it healing magic. And it does heal Drogo's body. It's his mind which gets screwed/pulled out/whatever. To be honest Mirri says Marwyn taught her to speak Westerosi and showed her the insides of the human body and its secrets which hide under the skin. But what is clear is that Moqorro and Mirri use a similar spell, and that alone doesn't create a strong link with Marwyn, but with the rest it's close enough. If anything, they both learned them together as you say.

As for Quaithe not warning about Marwyn, she warned about Moqorro, the dark flame with the kraken. I can't say Marwyn is Quaithe's disciple because I don't see what indicates it specifically. But who knows if Marwyn would present himself as Marwyn or as Moqorro. For now I have to assume that he'd remain under his Moqorro identity. She seems more likely to listen to a red priest than a maester of Oldtown, who are not known to like dragons. But as you say, the warnings are not necessarily about people who come to her together, so it may not even be about Moqorro, and if it is it can still apply.

[Megorova]

20 hours ago, Egged said:

I can't say Marwyn is Quaithe's disciple because I don't see what indicates it specifically.

It was specifically indicated in AGOT, Dany IX, in Dany's fevered dream. Though to understant it, it requires a long and complicated explanation of what actually happened to Dany when she was giving birth to Rhaego. Because when readers don't understand the bigger picture, they are also unable to notice Marwyn's presense in it.

Spoiler

Several years ago I had discussion with another poster in a thread "Dany is Azor Ahai reborn". She was insisting that those ghosts with swords of pale fire are previous incarnations of Azor Ahai, and I was arguing that they can't be, because until now there was only one Azor Ahai, and only one Long Night before the upcoming one. Also, even if Long Night does have a circular nature, and it repeats every several thousands years, it's impossible for all those Azors to have swords, because swords weren't yet invented that long ago, not 20.000 years ago, not 30.000 or 40.000 or 50.000 years ago. Thus, those ghosts of kings are not Azors. I thought that instead those ghosts were Targaryen kings with Valyrian steel blades in their hands. Because their description was similar to what Valyrians looked like. So I went thru ASOIAF's Wikia searching for description of all Targaryen kings, what was their hair color, and what was their eye color. It was before F&B's publication, so there was description of only half (or so) of Targaryen kings that ruled in 7K. I listed how many of them had what eye color (kings in the vision had eyes colored like opals, tourmalines, amethysts, and jades). But then I realised that even though I know what jades and amethysts look like (their colors), I have no idea about opals. Also it's qustionable what color exactly did GRRM meant by jades, is it blue or green? I noticed that amongst Targaryens there was only several with blue-colored eyes, and only one with green, and it was Shiera Seastar. Or rather she had mismatched blue-green eyes. I used Wikipedia to find out what opals look like, this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opal

And when I saw that picture, I had an enlightenment I realised what GRRM meant. Thus I went thru Wikipedia, reading descriptions of those four gemstones, and then I found out that amongst tourmalines there is a bi-colored blue-green/green-blue variety, and that there are jades of all sorts of colors (not only blue or green), and that "Amethyst occurs in primary hues from a light lavender or pale violet color, to a deep purple color. Amethyst may exhibit one or both secondary hues, red and blue". All four gemstones, that GRRM used in the description of those ghosts, have dual coloration, green-blue/blue-green, same as Shiera Seastar's eyes. Those ghosts cried as one, because it was one person - Shiera.

Then some time later I was re-reading Dany's last chapter in ADWD, and noticed this: "She dreamed. All her cares fell away from her, and all her pains as well, and she seemed to float upward into the sky. She was flying once again, spinning, laughing, dancing, as the stars wheeled around her and whispered secrets in her ear. “To go north, you must journey south. To reach the west, you must go east. To go forward, you must go back. To touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow.” “Quaithe?” Dany called. “Where are you, Quaithe?” Then she saw. Her mask is made of starlight."

And then I understood "GRRM's code". I figured out how he thinks, what he actually mean, when he writes this or that.

I realised that Quaithe is Shiera Seastar, and that she was with Dany in Drogo's tent, when Dany was giving birth to Rhaego. I deciphered what Dany's fevered dream mean. In that dream there was two points of view, one was Dany's own, and the other was Rhaego's, from inside of Dany's body. With the phrase "wake the dragon" there was happening a switch between their POVs. In her dream in ADWD Dany "was flying once again", but it's not a reference to her previous flights on Drogon, rather it's about that one other time, when she was flying on her own, here - "the ghosts cried as one, and she screamed and threw herself forward. A great knife of pain ripped down her back, and she felt her skin tear open and smelled the stench of burning blood and saw the shadow of wings. And Daenerys Targaryen flew." In both dreams, in which Dany was flying, there were whispering stars, and in both cases those stars symbolised Shiera/Quaithe (because of her starlight mask). And stars don't whisper, and they don't smile, because they don't have mouths. Furthermore, Dany couldn't have seen "stars in a daylight sky" because - 1. during daylight stars are not visible, the Sun's brightness outshines them, 2. when Dany had that confrontation with the Dothraki, when Mirri was performing her ritual, it was in evening, thus there was no daylight, 3. Jorah brought Dany to Drogo's tent, so the sky and the stars were blocked from Dany's view by the tent's ceiling. So what Dany saw in her dream, wasn't real, though the symbolism of her visions did reflected what actually happened in reality, when Dany was giving birth to Rhaego, and that fevered dream is actually a distorted memory mixed with symbolical elements. And those symbols, present in Dany's dream, are clues to what actually happened. Drogo didn't had sex with Dany (because he was half-dead and unconsciousness at that time), Dany didn't saw Viserys (because he was dead), and she didn't saw Jorah (because he went out of Drogo's tent after he brought Dany there). Thru Rhaego's POV Dany experienced running away from coldness and death thru long hall with stone arches - Rhaego's passage thru birth canal. In Rhaego's POV his physical experiences were mixed with prophetic visions about his future. And in the end of his POV, when he was born, Dany saw her own face thru his eyes. It's an evidence that Rhaego was born alive and not blind. After he was born, he was taken away by Khal Pono, a guy whose khalasar Dany met again in her last chapter in ADWD. Rhaego's kidnapping by his Dothraki-relatives is the treason for blood. Seems likely that when Pono took Rhaego, he warned Dany's people that if they will follow him, he will kill them all. And thus Jorah and Mirri agreed to lie to Dany about what actually happend to her child. They lied that he was born dead, and that his body magically decomposed afterwards <- how convenient . Though Jorah was too ashamed to say that lie, and he was unable to do it, and thus Mirri had to step up and do it herself: "She waited, but Ser Jorah could not say it. His face grew dark with shame. He looked half a corpse himself. "Monstrous," Mirri Maz Duur finished for him. The knight was a powerful man, yet Dany understood in that moment that the maegi was stronger, and crueler, and infinitely more dangerous. "Twisted. I drew him forth myself. He was scaled like a lizard, blind, with the stub of a tail and small leather wings like the wings of a bat. When I touched him, the flesh sloughed off the bone, and inside he was full of graveworms and the stink of corruption. He had been dead for years." Darkness, Dany thought. The terrible darkness sweeping up behind to devour her. If she looked back she was lost. "My son was alive and strong when Ser Jorah carried me into this tent," she said. "I could feel him kicking, fighting to be born." " Mirri, Jorah, Dany's handmaids. Liars all of them.

SO WHERE'S MAESTER MARWYN IN ALL OF THAT?

Besides Dany, Mirri, and half-dead Drogo, in that tent there were other people.

This is Quaithe/Shiera (AGOT, Dany IX):

"Wings shadowed her fever dreams.

the stars smiled down on them, stars in a daylight sky.

but suddenly the stars were gone, and across the blue sky swept the great wings, and the world took flame.

Ghosts lined the hallway, dressed in the faded raiment of kings. In their hands were swords of pale fire. They had hair of silver and hair of gold and hair of platinum white, and their eyes were opal and amethyst, tourmaline and jade.

the ghosts cried as one, and she (actually he, Rhaego) screamed and threw herself (himself) forward. A great knife of pain ripped down her back (back labour pains, Google it), and she felt her skin tear open and smelled the stench of burning blood and (he) saw the shadow of wings (outside of his mother's body) (<- final push, the baby came out, and he saw Shiera).

After that, for a long time, there was only the pain, the fire within her, and the whisperings of stars."

At first Quaithe was wearing her starlight mask, but then "the stars were gone", and instead of them Dany saw great wings and flame, because when Quaithe took off her starlight mask, underneath it Dany saw a person with Valyrian looks - Shiera. In Dany's dream Shiera was seen by her as wings and fire (because she's a dragonseed), and stars and shadows (because she's a Seastar and a shadowbinder). Also all readers (me included) incorrectly interpreted that scene with the ghosts - just because they were "dressed in the faded raiment of kings" doesn't mean that they WERE kings. Instead it was a person, who was wearing red and black attire - traditional colors of Targaryen kings, who are kings of the past, that's why "faded raiment". Quaithe's mask is red, and her hooded cape is black. She took them off and Dany saw her silver-gold and platinum-white hair and her blue-green eyes. And those swords of pale fire was actually a Valyrian glass candle. That's how Quaithe came to Drogo's tent, unseen by other people. She did explained (in ADWD, Dany II) how it works:

" "What are you doing here? How did you get past my guards?"

"I came another way. Your guards never saw me."

"If I call out, they will kill you."

"They will swear to you that I am not here."

"Are you here?"

"No. Hear me, Daenerys Targaryen. The glass candles are burning." "

GRRM has peculiar sense of humor. And maester Marwyn is one of those people who has a glass candle.

One of the people that Dany saw in her fevered dream was represented by wings-fire and stars-shadows. And the other person was MALE. Dany saw him as Drogo, Viserys, and Jorah (explanation to all three will be further below).

Marwyn and Quaithe are Mirri's masters/teachers, thus when Dany needed help with Rhaego's birth, Mirri summoned both of them, and they came, "teleported" there, by using glass candles (which became activated again after nearly 100 years of inactivity, not when Dany's dragons hatched, but nearly a year before that, when Dany had a dragon-dream in which she saw Drogon, and after which in reality Drogon's egg became hot. That's when dragon-magic returned into the world, and glass candles got re-activated).

According to rumors Marwyn "kept company with whores" (AFFC, Prologue), and nevertheless he wasn't banished from the Citadel. That's because his superiors know that he doesn't have sex with those women, instead he assists them with abortions, childbirth, etc. Because gynecology is one of his major specialisations, he partially learned it from Mirri, who was a midwife. He used to be family maester of Targaryens, stationed at the Dragonstone. It's likely that he was assisting Elia with Rhaenys' and Aegon's birth, and he was the one who said to Rhaegar that his wife can't have children anymore. Also it's likely that he was assisting Lyanna during Jon's birth. Beause he was one of those people to whom Rhaegar trusted. Marwyn has read three pages out of the Book of Signs and Portents, written by Daenys the Dreamer, a Targaryen who predicted the Doom of Valyria, and recorded in her book that and other prophecies, including the one about the Second Long Night and the Prince that was Promised. Based on those writings Rhaegar in his youth thought that he is the Promised Prince. This information was shared by him with Marwyn and Aemon, to Marwyn he also showed the Book (or what was left of it 400 years after it was written). And thus Marwyn also believed that Rhaegar was supposed to become the Messiah. So when Rhaegar died, Marwyn went to Asshai, to seach there for more information about the prophecy. Because at Asshai 5.000 years ago was given another prophecy, about Azor Ahai reborn, the one that Melisandre knows. Which made her think that Stannis in the Promised Prince, because officially Stannis in the Prince of Dragonstone. Though the real Prince of Dragonstone is Jon, because he is the son of the Crown Prince, so from his birth and until his coronation, Jon is the Crown Prince/Prince of Dragonstone. Marwyn went to Asshai and met there Quaithe/Shiera. And Mirri too.

When Dany was pushed by one of those Dothraki, she had an internal bleeding, seems that her placenta got detached from the womb. What the heck is placenta? ->

https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/pregnancy-week-by-week/in-depth/placenta/art-20044425

"The placenta is an organ that develops in your uterus during pregnancy. This structure provides oxygen and nutrients to your growing baby and removes waste products from your baby's blood. The placenta attaches to the wall of your uterus, and your baby's umbilical cord arises from it."

Thus, if Dany didn't gave birth in the next several hours, both she and her baby would have died. The baby would have died from deficiency of oxigen, or from carbon dioxide poisoning, or by products of blood decomposition from "dead" placenta, or by a blood clot that would have went into his body thru the umbilical cord. And Dany could have died either from the bleeding, or from blood poisoning, if the placenta wasn't removed from her body, which could be done only after the baby come out.

Mirri was a mere midwife, she was not a specialist in human anatomy, thus she didn't knew what to do, and had to summon her ex-teacher - maester Marwyn. He didn't actually physically came there, it's only his astral projection, that got teleported there by him using a glass candle (or something like that). So he couldn't have touched Dany himself, nor to perform Dany's medical checkup. Instead he was saying to Mirri what to do, and everything physical was done by her. Both Marwyn and Shiera were giving instructions to Mirri, Marwyn about labour's aspects and Shiera about magical aspects. To urge Rhaego to be born, they used on both him and Dany some sort of magic that merged their souls. Dany sort of skinchanged into her unborn baby's body, and was guiding him to his birth, away from "a death that was more than death"/to be born dead.

This -

"She saw sunlight on the Dothraki sea, the living plain, rich with the smells of earth and death. Wind stirred the grasses, and they rippled like water. Drogo held her in strong arms, and his hand stroked her sex and opened her and woke that sweet wetness that was his alone, and the stars smiled down on them, stars in a daylight sky. “Home,” she whispered as he entered her and filled her with his seed, but suddenly the stars were gone, and across the blue sky swept the great wings, and the world took flame."

- is not Drogo having sex with Dany, this is Mirri checking the state of Dany's womb and what's happening with the baby inside of it. Then she injected some sort of medicine inside Dany's womb, and that medicine caused Dany to go into labour. Marwyn instructed Mirri what to do, and left shortly afterwards, because he wasn't interested in Dany, nor in Rhaego. He thought that they were irrelevant, he lost his faith after Rhaegar's death, he believed that Rhaegar was the Messiah.

"Ser Jorah’s face was drawn and sorrowful. “Rhaegar was the last dragon,” he told her. He warmed translucent hands over a glowing brazier where stone eggs smouldered red as coals. One moment he was there and the next he was fading, his flesh colorless, less substantial than the wind. “The last dragon,” he whispered, thin as a wisp, and was gone. She felt the dark behind her, and the red door seemed farther away than ever."

He wasn't physically there. He was using a glass candle to project there. And he warmed his hands above dragons eggs, because that way he had drawn dragon-magic from them, and used that power to teleport back to the Citadel, where his body was at that time. Unlike Quaithe he wasn't holding glass candle in his hands, so he had to recharge himself for the return trip. Or something like that.

Next scene, after he left -

"Viserys stood before her, screaming. “The dragon does not beg, slut. You do not command the dragon. I am the dragon, and I will be crowned.” The molten gold trickled down his face like wax, burning deep channels in his flesh. “I am the dragon and I will be crowned!” he shrieked, and his fingers snapped like snakes, biting at her nipples, pinching, twisting, even as his eyes burst and ran like jelly down seared and blackened cheeks."

- nipple stimulation is a method of labour induction. It causes woman's body to produce hormone oxytocin, which strengthens contractions during childbirth.

The one who was doing it was Mirri, not Viserys who was dead, and Dany saw Mirri as Viserys because 1. Shiera, who had Valyrian looks, same as Viserys, was there, and because 2. Dany saw a male/Viserys roughing her breasts because Marwyn/male told Mirri to do that, to stimulate Dany's labour thru that method. He gave instuctions how to save Dany's child, and then left. And even without him Mirri and Shiera suceeded. Rhaego went thru the red door/was born, and saw his mother's face (Dany's soul was still in his body at that moment):

"She could smell home, she could see it, there, just beyond that door, green fields and great stone houses and arms to keep her warm, there. She threw open the door.

“…the dragon…”

And saw her brother Rhaegar, mounted on a stallion as black as his armor. Fire glimmered red through the narrow eye slit of his helm. “The last dragon,” Ser Jorah’s voice whispered faintly. “The last, the last.” Dany lifted his polished black visor. The face within was her own.

After that, for a long time, there was only the pain, the fire within her, and the whisperings of stars."

Shiera was staying with Dany for many hours after Rhaego's birth. Apparently she was separating/untangling their souls. And it was she who said to Dany what she has to do to hatch her dragons. She sacrificed Mirri, her ex-disciple, for the return of the dragons.

And Marwyn, even though he had a glass candle and could have found out about Dany and her dragons, haven't looked over Dany after that single encounter, he wasn't interested in her, and thus until Sam's arrival didn't knew that Dany and Rhaego are 2/3 of the dragon from the prophecy. While the third one is Jon, and GRRM gave hints about this in Dany's next chapter:

"She heard a crack, the sound of shattering stone. ... And something else came crashing down, bouncing and rolling, to land at her feet; a chunk of curved rock, pale and veined with gold, broken and smoking.

And there came a second crack, loud and sharp as thunder, and the smoke stirred and whirled around her and the pyre shifted, the logs exploding as the fire touched their secret hearts. She heard the screams of frightened horses, and the voices of the Dothraki

Don’t you SEE?

The third crack was as loud and sharp as the breaking of the world."

First crack, when hatched Viserion/white and gold dragon, Dany heard sound of shattering rock, because this dragon's rider, Jon, will be a dragon that will be awakened from stone. AGOT, Bran III - "Finally he looked north. He saw the Wall shining like blue crystal, and his bastard brother Jon sleeping alone in a cold bed, his skin growing pale and hard as the memory of all warmth fled from him." <- this was a vision of the future about what will happen to Jon after that attack in the end of ADWD. Then Melisandre will awake a dragon(Jon) from stone.

Jon is the last dragon. Because he will become the last dragonrider out of the three. Rhaego will become next, the second, because his dragon/Rhaegal hatched second. Dany's dragon hatched the last out of three, but she became the first dragonrider. Because the three of them will become dragonriders in the same order as Dany placed her dragon eggs on Drogo's funeral pyre - "She climbed the pyre herself to place the eggs around her sun-and-stars. The black beside his heart, under his arm. The green beside his head, his braid coiled around it. The cream-and-gold down between his legs."

Second egg cracked with the sound of thunder and the screams of horses and voices of Dothraki, after the fire went under the logs, that's where the horse was, the second sacrifice - "Rakharo chose a stallion from the small herd that remained to them; he was not the equal of Khal Drogo’s red, but few horses were. In the center of the square, Aggo fed him a withered apple and dropped him in an instant with an axe blow between the eyes. ... Over the carcass of the horse, they built a platform of hewn logs".

Rhaegal's egg hatched with the sound of thunder because of this (AGOT, Dany V) -

"Finally the crone opened her eye and lifted her arms. "I have seen his face, and heard the thunder of his hooves," she proclaimed in a thin, wavery voice.

"The thunder of his hooves!" the others chorused. "As swift as the wind he rides, and behind him his khalasar covers the earth, men without number, with arakhs shining in their hands like blades of razor grass. Fierce as a storm this prince will be. His enemies will tremble before him, and their wives will weep tears of blood and rend their flesh in grief. The bells in his hair will sing his coming, and the milk men in the stone tents will fear his name." The old woman trembled and looked at Dany almost as if she were afraid. "The prince is riding, and he shall be the stallion who mounts the world." "

And Drogon's egg hatched with the sound of the breaking of the world, because his rider, Dany, will become the Breaker of Chains (already became) and will break the existing world order.

Three sacrifices were - Mirri for Viserion (she was burned alive, thus this sacrifice was the most powerful, hatched the egg faster than others); the horse for Rhaegal (the horse was killed shortly prior the burning), Drogo for Drogon (he was dead for several hours, thus he had the least amount of life-force left, and thus this dragon hatched the last out of three).

So, as you can see, even though in the books we don't get any direct writing from GRRM (the guy loves mysteries too much), he did left for readers enough clues to figure out what is what. But only if they will think out of the box, and will be visualising what are they reading.

And thus Marwyn is Quaithe's disciple/acquaintance (why else was he there with her?), and there were specific indications of that in AGOT. Though those indications are so convolutely hiden by GRRM, that it's not easy to notice them. Not easy, but possible.

I'm aware that all of that is very convoluted. And I did tried to explain it to other posters/readers here, but they still don't get it. What a pity.

[Springwatch]

Quote

The wizard was a monster of a man, as tall as Victarion himself and twice as wide, with a belly like a boulder and a tangle of bone-white hair that grew about his face like a lion's mane. His skin was black. Not the nut brown of the Summer Islanders on their swan ships, nor the red-brown of the Dothraki horselords, nor the charcoal-and-earth color of the dusky woman's skin, but black. Blacker than coal, blacker than jet, blacker than a raven's wing. Burned, Victarion thought, like a man who has been roasted in the flames until his flesh chars and crisps and falls smoking from his bones. The fires that had charred him still danced across his cheeks and forehead, where his eyes peered out from amongst a mask of frozen flames. Slave tattoos, the captain knew. Marks of evil. "We found him clinging to a broken spar," said the Vole. "He was ten days in the water after his ship went down."

So much emphasis on the deep blackness of this skin tone - it's a bit weird because Mel doesn't seem to like black. She says:

'The night is dark and full of terrors, the day bright and beautiful and full of hope. One is black, the other white...'

also:

'The Other's servants oft hide black hearts in gaudy light, so R'hllor gives his priests the power to see through falsehoods.'

So, I don't know.  Red priests are complicated about darkness. But Moqorro is probably himself, because he stands out too much to be a useful disguise.

ETA

Maybe he wears a glamour because he's really a thousand years old  and needs to hide it.

[Sir Tumbleweed]

Awesome thread! I've been pondering over this for awhile. Melissandre tells Mance to make sure wears his bones many times during her POV because the clothing is a strong part of the glamour. When Tyrion first meets Moqorro he has his robes and staff, and Tyrion doesn't notice any of the flames moving across his face, the glamour is still stable. 

Next Victarions men find him after he's been drifting at sea. He's lost his staff and his robes are stained. Here's where Vic first notes that his tattoos seem to move but it's pretty tame. He describes them in relatively slow terms as 'dancing' and 'frozen flames'. With his disguise deteriorating the spell is starting to lose its effect.

In the next Victarion chapter Vic insists that he throw out his stained robes and offers him fresh clothing made from Ironborn donations. Shortly after being stripped completely of his disguise he's described as 'more sinister than ever' in appearance, and the flames are much more erratic in their movements. They're now 'dancing, twisting, bending, and melting into one another'. So again, the glamour is deteriorating more and more as Moqorro's personal effects and stripped away.

It's also interesting to note that in their first conversation when Moqorro and Victarion meet, the men don't seem to be on the same page as to who/what they're seeing. "Why do you say this man is a wizard? I see only a ragged priest"

And another thing! Is the dusky woman able to see through the glamour and that's why she hissed at him? Are there rivaling sorcerers competing to manipulate Victarion?

[Bowen 747]

@Egged  It's a nice theory and explains why we haven't heard from Marwyn.  He is clearly on a mission of great importance.  May as well catch a ride with the iron fleet and bring them to the service of the most important person in the world.  If true, he will make sure the Vicster and his ironborn end up serving the goald of our favorite young lady, Queen Daenerys Targaryen. 

[Egged]

2 hours ago, Sir Tumbleweed said:

Awesome thread! I've been pondering over this for awhile. Melissandre tells Mance to make sure wears his bones many times during her POV because the clothing is a strong part of the glamour. When Tyrion first meets Moqorro he has his robes and staff, and Tyrion doesn't notice any of the flames moving across his face, the glamour is still stable. 

Next Victarions men find him after he's been drifting at sea. He's lost his staff and his robes are stained. Here's where Vic first notes that his tattoos seem to move but it's pretty tame. He describes them in relatively slow terms as 'dancing' and 'frozen flames'. With his disguise deteriorating the spell is starting to lose its effect.

In the next Victarion chapter Vic insists that he throw out his stained robes and offers him fresh clothing made from Ironborn donations. Shortly after being stripped completely of his disguise he's described as 'more sinister than ever' in appearance, and the flames are much more erratic in their movements. They're now 'dancing, twisting, bending, and melting into one another'. So again, the glamour is deteriorating more and more as Moqorro's personal effects and stripped away.

It's also interesting to note that in their first conversation when Moqorro and Victarion meet, the men don't seem to be on the same page as to who/what they're seeing. "Why do you say this man is a wizard? I see only a ragged priest"

And another thing! Is the dusky woman able to see through the glamour and that's why she hissed at him? Are there rivaling sorcerers competing to manipulate Victarion?

That is such a good observation! I felt too that it was as if the glamor was malfunctioning but didn't want to say "did a hit from a lightning strike screw it up or something?", was too baseless. But your point explains it perfectly.

Which could also imply that Marwin may not have always been Moqorro, rather he stole his identity at some point.

As for the dusky woman, I'd think it's Euron seeing through her and recognizing Marwyn, or something akin to that.

[Springwatch]

Marwyn studies the higher mysteries, so I think he could manage a glamour if he wanted - the remaining question is why would he want to? If Moqorro can get himself transport to Daenerys, why can't Marwyn? As himself?

Also, 'Moqorro' says that Benerro predicted the ship would get hit by a storm and not make port. I can't imagine why Marwyn would say that if it wasn't true. Or if it was true (and he overhead it) - why would he get on the ship in the first place? He's not a fanatic who can rely on destiny and R'hllor to keep him safe.

[James West]

Marwyn is already on a fast ship with a skilled captain.  Why take a chance with the Ironborn.  I also think Quhuru Mo and Dany will meet again.  

[Egged]

4 hours ago, Springwatch said:

Marwyn studies the higher mysteries, so I think he could manage a glamour if he wanted - the remaining question is why would he want to? If Moqorro can get himself transport to Daenerys, why can't Marwyn? As himself?

Also, 'Moqorro' says that Benerro predicted the ship would get hit by a storm and not make port. I can't imagine why Marwyn would say that if it wasn't true. Or if it was true (and he overhead it) - why would he get on the ship in the first place? He's not a fanatic who can rely on destiny and R'hllor to keep him safe.

Marwyn wouldn't be welcomed on Victarion's ship, he suspects Kerwin already of poisoning him. Moqorro also gets Kerwin killed under the pretense it would bring them good wind. Moqorro looks like a powerful wizard, something the others on his crew don't even see in him. He is exactly what Victarion would welcome and trust over some maester, especially if magic needs to be used openly, a maester wouldn't be expected or trusted. And on top of it all, Marwyn is going to meet Daenerys, who says he can just switching personality constantly? He might want to be seen as Moqorro all the way and beyond. If Victarion is there now and when he meets her, it would make sense to continue as such instead of disappearing and some random maester showing up.

As for why he'd go even knowing the storm was coming, does it matter? Who knows what Marwyn can see or do, and he literally makes sacrifices to gods, so as far as we can tell he can do whatever others do with magic or rituals and what not.

Also how would the Cinnamon Wind would get into Slaver's Bay? He must have changed ship and brought Aemon's body over as well. Why else would there be a corpse in brine?

[Sir Tumbleweed]

19 hours ago, Egged said:

That is such a good observation! I felt too that it was as if the glamor was malfunctioning but didn't want to say "did a hit from a lightning strike screw it up or something?", was too baseless. But your point explains it perfectly.

Which could also imply that Marwin may not have always been Moqorro, rather he stole his identity at some point.

Thanks  I never had any suspects as to who he was, but I do like the idea of it being Marwyn. He left Westeros like a month after the Iron fleet though so I don't know how he would have been able to catch up. The 'corpse pickled in brine' is a nice connection to the cinnamon wind and it is supposedly a really fast ship so I'm convinced. And yes using a disguise makes sense for him to do. @James West he would be taking a chance with the Ironborn whether he's glamoured or not. The Ironborn are taking any ship they see and looting/drowning/burning the people or enslaving them. And like Egged said, Maesters don't do too well around Greyjoys.

 

19 hours ago, Egged said:

As for the dusky woman, I'd think it's Euron seeing through her and recognizing Marwyn, or something akin to that.

Yeahhh I've read people saying this a few times but it just doesn't make sense to me. Euron is waging war in Westeros, his banner is spotted by Old Town. He's a loud-mouthed swashbuckling pirate and on top of that he's just become a king. Why would he leave that (even temporarily) to stay below deck on a ship, not speak to anybody for months, let his own brother show up and bang him whenever he wants, and tend to his wounds in the meantime? Kinda gross, sorry I'm just not on board with that one. Not to mention the Ironborn misogyny and how Victarion is debating slitting the Dusky Womans throat almost immediately after getting her, Euron would leave that for someone more disposable. I agree she's one of his agents though. My money's on she's one of the four warlocks that Euron captured.

[Egged]

28 minutes ago, Sir Tumbleweed said:

Thanks  I never had any suspects as to who he was, but I do like the idea of it being Marwyn. He left Westeros like a month after the Iron fleet though so I don't know how he would have been able to catch up. The 'corpse pickled in brine' is a nice connection to the cinnamon wind and it is supposedly a really fast ship so I'm convinced. And yes using a disguise makes sense for him to do. @James West he would be taking a chance with the Ironborn whether he's glamoured or not. The Ironborn are taking any ship they see and looting/drowning/burning the people or enslaving them. And like Egged said, Maesters don't do too well around Greyjoys.

 

Yeahhh I've read people saying this a few times but it just doesn't make sense to me. Euron is waging war in Westeros, his banner is spotted by Old Town. He's a loud-mouthed swashbuckling pirate and on top of that he's just become a king. Why would he leave that (even temporarily) to stay below deck on a ship, not speak to anybody for months, let his own brother show up and bang him whenever he wants, and tend to his wounds in the meantime? Kinda gross, sorry I'm just not on board with that one. Not to mention the Ironborn misogyny and how Victarion is debating slitting the Dusky Womans throat almost immediately after getting her, Euron would leave that for someone more disposable. I agree she's one of his agents though. My money's on she's one of the four warlocks that Euron captured.

Well her reaction can be all sorts of things, Euron's gifts are poisoned, and so far we don't know why that gift would be considered as such. Euron wouldn't actually be her, he'd just see and/hear what she does. It's some warging thing or whatever other trick he could use. Victarion has been confiding his innermost thoughts to her. I really don't believe she is actually Euron, makes little sense as you say.

But in any case, her reaction could be relative to seeing Moqorro (red priest, afraid of being burned), or seeing more.

[Sir Tumbleweed]

7 minutes ago, Egged said:

Well her reaction can be all sorts of things, Euron's gifts are poisoned, and so far we don't know why that gift would be considered as such. Euron wouldn't actually be her, he'd just see and/hear what she does. It's some warging thing or whatever other trick he could use.

hahahah okay, as long as it's not physically him  So about the hissing. The only person in the book that I specifically remember doing that is Biter, and he's a bit of a weird case. I remember Pyat Pree making some weird noises after the house of the Undying but not sure if he hissed or not. Do you know? Or did the Undying themselves hiss at Dany when they were attacking her?

[Egged]

50 minutes ago, Sir Tumbleweed said:

hahahah okay, as long as it's not physically him  So about the hissing. The only person in the book that I specifically remember doing that is Biter, and he's a bit of a weird case. I remember Pyat Pree making some weird noises after the house of the Undying but not sure if he hissed or not. Do you know? Or did the Undying themselves hiss at Dany when they were attacking her?

I did a quick search on A Search of Ice and Fire. It’s usually people talking with a hiss, so her hiss may be like her trying to say something.

There is Maggy the Frog, a Ghiscary captain in a Victarion chapter, Dany’s dragons, and lots of other mentions of hissing.

Wouldn’t surprise me that she is just there to kill Victarion if he ever betrays Euron.

[Aebram]

3 hours ago, Egged said:

Wouldn’t surprise me that she is just there to kill Victarion if he ever betrays Euron.

This is more in line with my own thinking. I've never been convinced by the theories that Euron is watching through the Dusky Woman's eyes. We know that he's powerful, and that he has some magical artifacts; but I don't think we've seen any indication that he can actually do that kind of sorcery himself.

We do know that "Euron's gifts are poisoned," so there must be something going on with her. Maybe it actually is poison.

Euron could have instructed her to serve Victarion and keep him healthy ... until after he captures Daenerys. Then she is supposed to slip some poison into his food or wine: something that will make his death seem like a sickness rather than a murder. The Tears of Lys would serve nicely. She hissed at the Red Priest because she realized that he might be able to discern her purpose, or to heal Victarion after she poisons him.

[Egged]

So wondering a bit more about what Marwyn's goal is.

What would be the greatest gift of all for Daenerys?

Quote

"When will he be as he was?" Dany demanded.

"When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east," said Mirri Maz Duur. "When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves. When your womb quickens again, and you bear a living child. Then he will return, and not before."

Quote

The thought of home disquieted her. If her sun-and-stars had lived, he would have led his khalasar across the poison water and swept away her enemies, but his strength had left the world. 

Marwyn/Moqorro's healing spell is like Mirri's. Yet Victarion still needs to be "drained" according to TWoW chapter. So it's not over.

Mirri's spell snatched Drogo's soul out of his body

Quote

"He seems to like the warmth, Princess," Ser Jorah said. "His eyes follow the sun, though he does not see it. He can walk after a fashion. He will go where you lead him, but no farther. He will eat if you put food in his mouth, drink if you dribble water on his lips."

.It sounds almost like his body ended up with the soul of his horse into it.

Alivealive0 on Reddit noted the following:

Quote

The iron captain was not seen again that day, but as the hours passed the crew of his Iron Victory reported hearing the sound of wild laughter coming from the captain's cabin, laughter deep and dark and mad, and when Longwater Pyke and Wulfe One-Eye tried the cabin door they found it barred. Later singing was heard, a strange high wailing song in a tongue the maester said was High Valyrian. That was when the monkeys left the ship, screeching as they leapt into the water.

This may be the first time George drops the point of view in a POV chapter. Why? Because Victarion's soul left his body for a while.

TWoW spoiler:

Spoiler

In a Victarion chapter of TWoW, Victarion's arm is still not healed, it still needs to be drained.

So what is Marywin trying to do? What can he bring to Daenerys Targaryen that would be certain to make him an ally she could not refuse?

Marwyn is trying to find Drogo's soul and bring him back, and Victarion will be his vessel.

The Dothrakis will cross the poison waters, led by Khal Drogo and his ships.

[Springwatch]

21 hours ago, Egged said:

This may be the first time George drops the point of view in a POV chapter. Why? Because Victarion's soul left his body for a while.

It is interesting. Is this the Iron Captain chapter? Because Arya is 'the girl' quite a lot, in her un-named chapters. Could be a pattern there.

ETA

Not just un-named chapters, also in Victarion I of Dance.

[Egged]

33 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

It is interesting. Is this the Iron Captain chapter? Because Arya is 'the girl' quite a lot, in her un-named chapters. Could be a pattern there.

ETA

Not just un-named chapters, also in Victarion I of Dance.

It's in the Iron Suitor in ADWD.

It's different than Arya's case as far as I know, because here we literally have a narrator POV. Something that I don't think ever usually happened other than maybe in the prologue of AGOT? Arya remains the POV of her chapters no matter her name.

Victarion is the POV of all of his chapters. Why would Victarion not remain the POV while the healing spell took place? Usually George would have a character dream or have visions if they aren't quite awake (Daenerys in AGoT has a vision-like moment as she gives birth semi-passed out). Here we end up outside, with no one being the POV, and literally have a visual and auditory description, as if Victarion himself is outside, out of his body.

George's POV approach is pretty well ingrained and has been throughout the series, until this precise moment. It might just be a weird mistake by George, but considering what happened to Drogo when Mirri cast a very similar spell, I doubt it.