Gender and bathrooms

[Xray the Enforcer]

[mod] Stop the body shaming of women right now. [/mod]

[Xray the Enforcer]

[mod] Further, posting material from groups with an obvious transphobic agenda will not be tolerated and the material removed. If you don't know if something is transphobic or not, err on the side of not posting it. Thank you [/mod]

[Xray the Enforcer]

19 minutes ago, Xray the Enforcer said:

[mod] Stop the body shaming of women right now. [/mod]

And for the record, nobody should be body shaming ANYONE, no matter what their gender identity or gender presentation. It's bullshit behavior and it does not belong here. 

[Fez]

Wasn't there someone on the board years and years ago who went on and on about how all body fluids were incredibly gross; to the point of saying that was why he always had sex with a condom no matter what?

The board attracts all type. Especially weird ones.

[BigFatCoward]

6 minutes ago, Fez said:

 

The board attracts all type. Exclusively weird ones.

Fixed.

[BigFatCoward]

2 hours ago, Fury Resurrected said:

I am very surprised by how many of you are pooping in public bathrooms. Unless I have food poisoning or something there would be no convincing my colon to participate in that even if I wanted to (I don’t). 

I leave the house at 0615, and get home at 1730. So its either use alternative toilets (and police ones are one step up from the toilet in trainspotting), or shit myself. 

[Ran]

Yeah, when you gotta go, you gotta go... 

Though to be honest, public restrooms in Sweden are largely much cleaner than my recollection of same in the U.S. Very rare to come across an unpleasant one.

As for unisex bathrooms, that's becoming somewhat more common -- the big new movie theatre has them -- and it's basically a common wash area followed by small rooms with lockable doors, full floor-to-ceiling walls and what not (not stalls where you can play footsies with your neighbor, as in the US). 

(The one thing that took getting used to when I moved to Sweden -- actually, I first saw it at Frankfurt airport -- was urinals without modesty panels.... though the "urinals" in Frankfurt was more a long, stainless steel trough...)

[DaveSumm]

1 minute ago, Ran said:

Yeah, when you gotta go, you gotta go... 

Though to be honest, public restrooms in Sweden are largely much cleaner than my recollection of same in the U.S. Very rare to come across an unpleasant one.

As for unisex bathrooms, that's becoming somewhat more common -- the big new movie theatre has them -- and it's basically a common wash area followed by small rooms with lockable doors, full floor-to-ceiling walls and what not (not stalls where you can play footsies with your neighbor, as in the US). 

Now that I think of it, what’s the design rationale behind the footsie stalls? Just cheaper because less material? I can’t think of any other reason to stop a foot short of the floor with a wall. 

[Ran]

1 minute ago, DaveSumm said:

Now that I think of it, what’s the design rationale behind the footsie stalls? Just cheaper because less material? I can’t think of any other reason to stop a foot short of the floor with a wall. 

Ease of cleaning would be my guess, if you really need to hose a stall down or dump a bucket of water to push things toward any kind of drainage you may have.

ETA: This article goes into a number of reasons, including the visual of seeing whether there's feet inside to tell you it's occupied, the opening allows better air circulation, and (apparently seriously) allows people in a pinch to ask their neighbor for some toilet paper. God, the horror.

[Fez]

Just now, Ran said:

Ease of cleaning would be my guess, if you really need to hose a stall down or dump a bucket of water to push things toward any kind of drainage you may have.

Might also be an anti-sex thing. Easier to know if people are getting it on if you can see two sets of ankles in the stall. That's just a guess though.

 

More darkly, could also be an anti-overdose thing. Easier to know if someone died/is having a medical emergency in a stall.

[DMC]

22 minutes ago, Fez said:

Wasn't there someone on the board years and years ago who went on and on about how all body fluids were incredibly gross; to the point of saying that was why he always had sex with a condom no matter what?

Was it this guy?

 

[Theda Baratheon]

I’m not saying random acts of sexual assault and violence don’t happen but I wish we’d focus on the fact that most sexual violence committed on women is by someone they know and not a complete stranger, especially not a trans woman in a unisex bathroom. 
 

anyway on the point - I’ve always been for “all gender bathrooms” that are stalls with sinks inside and locks - then everyone feels safe. 
 

but this not only helps trans people which is fantastic, but also fathers and young daughters, mothers and young sons etc. 
 

absolutely no problem with unisex/all gender bathrooms at all - certainly not going to make a marginalised group who already receive large amounts of violence into a bogeyman character. 

[Lollygag]

A few things:

Most assault is by someone known, but 1 in 6 women have experienced attempted or completed assault which means assault by strangers still happens *a lot*. I know. As the article I cited states, predatory behavior is heavily influenced by opportunity.

Sexual predators, especially those who go after strangers, aren't to be mistaken with horny men. They have some sort of predator/prey mentality. Those who identify as women and make difficult life choices to become women are extremely unlikely to view women as prey and trans women experience violence themselves from men. Predatory rapists are also unlikely to choose to dress as women to enter a women's room because identifying as prey is offensive to them.

Full stalls that go to the floor with proper locking doors helps, but in a deserted bathroom, one is still truly trapped. If a man walks into a women's room, he's immediately stared at and called out from across the room - actions that predators actively avoid. In a unisex restroom, a predator can get within a few feet of me in an empty restroom and at that point, it's too late. And that doesn't address PTSD and anxiety.
 

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

22 minutes ago, Leap said:

Not sure I know the terminology here, but I'm in favour of sinks inside cubicles where possible. Definitely the best option though. Not sure about where the "cover" you're describing goes, but for me I always wash my hands after flushing anyway. Toilets are dirty. Clean them regularly and wash your hands on the way out. 

Cubicles=stalls. When you think about everything you touch in a shared space, washing your hands quickly makes a lot of sense. Keep that in mind next time you casually lock the cube door and pull out your phone. 

The "cover" is simply a lid. Read about what happens when you flush a toilet without one. And keep that in the perspective of your own home. Now picture a public loo, getting used over and over. It's unpleasant to think about, but if one does you can see how they're even far more disgusting than we typically imagine. 

[Mlle. Zabzie]

3 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Cubicles=stalls. When you think about everything you touch in a shared space, washing your hands quickly makes a lot of sense. Keep that in mind next time you casually lock the cube door and pull out your phone. 

The "cover" is simply a lid. Read about what happens when you flush a toilet without when. And keep that in the perspective of your own home. Now picture a public loo, getting used over and over. It's unpleasant to think about, but if one does you can see how they're even far more disgusting than we typically imagine. 

This is why I actually want to wash my hands AFTER I've left the cubicle/stall, and want a no touch option to get out of the bathroom (if there is another door) or I'll take a paper towel with me to open the door.

ETA: In a public restroom multi-stall context, I think it is way more efficient from a sanitation perspective to have open sinks that are not within cubicles - much easier to replace towels/soap, clean the area while still leaving the actual toilets open for use.  I think there's a reason that the design is as it is.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

4 minutes ago, Mlle. Zabzie said:

This is why I actually want to wash my hands AFTER I've left the cubicle/stall, and want a no touch option to get out of the bathroom (if there is another door) or I'll take a paper towel with me to open the door.

See, this is why we get one another. 

[Relic]

18 hours ago, Chataya de Fleury said:

I saw the thread title and I totally thought it was about something else.

For the record, I have had sex in a bathroom.

Who hasnt?

[Relic]

Clearly there should be 2 kinds of bathrooms. Adult bathrooms, and children bathrooms. Unisex. /thread

[Lollygag]

22 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Cubicles=stalls. When you think about everything you touch in a shared space, washing your hands quickly makes a lot of sense. Keep that in mind next time you casually lock the cube door and pull out your phone. 

The "cover" is simply a lid. Read about what happens when you flush a toilet without one. And keep that in the perspective of your own home. Now picture a public loo, getting used over and over. It's unpleasant to think about, but if one does you can see how they're even far more disgusting than we typically imagine. 

Here you go.

In spoilers in case you're eating right now.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/01/its-time-talk-about-how-toilets-may-be-spreading-covid-19/

Spoiler

Here’s what we know: When you flush a toilet, the churning and bubbling of water aerosolizes fecal matter. That creates particles that will float in the air, which we will now politely call “bioaerosols” for the rest of this article.

Surprisingly little has been published on toilets and disease risk (well, maybe not surprisingly). But there are a few brave scientists out there. Take one 2018 study of flushing toilets in a hospital. Researchers found high concentrations of bioaerosols when a toilet with no lid was flushed.

 

[The Anti-Targ]

1 hour ago, Relic said:

Clearly there should be 2 kinds of bathrooms. Adult bathrooms, and children bathrooms. Unisex. /thread

Or, stand up bathrooms and sit down bathrooms. If adults are banned from children's bathrooms then that does not prevent older children behaving inappropriately. And if Adults are allowed in with an accompanying child then the creeps will find a way. There are enough creeps that are interested in being inappropriate to children of the same sex that it's questionable as to whether gender neutral bathrooms increases the risk substantially or marginally.

Floor to ceiling partitions between cubicles is a must, small gap under the door and larger gap above the door to allow for airflow is sufficient. Or better yet, venting fans in the ceiling for each cubicle and full enclosure, with an emergency access panel.

59 minutes ago, Lollygag said:

Here you go.

In spoilers in case you're eating right now.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/01/its-time-talk-about-how-toilets-may-be-spreading-covid-19/

  Hide contents

Here’s what we know: When you flush a toilet, the churning and bubbling of water aerosolizes fecal matter. That creates particles that will float in the air, which we will now politely call “bioaerosols” for the rest of this article.

Surprisingly little has been published on toilets and disease risk (well, maybe not surprisingly). But there are a few brave scientists out there. Take one 2018 study of flushing toilets in a hospital. Researchers found high concentrations of bioaerosols when a toilet with no lid was flushed.

 

I always close the lid when flushing. Since we have a single space with toilet, shower and other daily sanitary activities, like brushing teeth, I really don't want to be coating my toothbrush with "bioaerosols". I am not certain everyone in my household is so vigilant.