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NBA 2021 - Randle Hearts

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Who you call got for MVP at this point?

Edited by Relic

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Giannis and Embiid are my 2 most valuable.

Try to imagine the Bucks or Sixers W-L record if either of them were out for the season.

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4 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

Giannis and Embiid are my 2 most valuable.

Try to imagine the Bucks or Sixers W-L record if either of them were out for the season.

By that logic LeBron should have like 10 awards. 

Embiid is probably the favorite if nothing changes.

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By that logic it would be AD given the Lakers recent free fall. You don't have to imagine it either. Its there. Also by that logic, KD would be amongst the least valuable players since his team does just as well without him. 

Anyway, Embiid has the stats, but I don't like him. I'd go for Jokic.

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4 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

By that logic LeBron should have like 10 awards. 

Just like Jordan he probably should.  And yeah, my impression is Embiid is the frontrunner right now.

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1 hour ago, Proudfeet said:

By that logic it would be AD given the Lakers recent free fall. You don't have to imagine it either. Its there. Also by that logic, KD would be amongst the least valuable players since his team does just as well without him. 

Sure, AD is probably the Lakers MVP, but I wasn't talking about this season. If you look at the entirety of his career, it's easy to argue that he should more than four MVPs.

47 minutes ago, DMC said:

Just like Jordan he probably should.  And yeah, my impression is Embiid is the frontrunner right now.

It's just player fatigue. They feel like they have to pass it around. And besides, the MVP is not a perfect construct or measurement anyways.

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8 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

It's just player fatigue. They feel like they have to pass it around.

It's human nature.  Especially for the media.  Still doesn't make it any less stupid.

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1 minute ago, DMC said:

It's human nature.  Especially for the media.  Still doesn't make it any less stupid.

It's indeed. One aspect of the selection I really hate with all MVP awards is was there a narrative?"

Who the fuck cares?

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3 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Sure, AD is probably the Lakers MVP, but I wasn't talking about this season. If you look at the entirety of his career, it's easy to argue that he should more than four MVPs.

I wasn't talking about you. And its not just about the Lakers.

Anyway, yeah, LeBron should probably have more MVPs. I wouldn't go as far as ten though. I'd stop at around maybe his stint at Miami. He's been on regular season energy conservation mode for awhile.

8 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

And besides, the MVP is not a perfect construct or measurement anyways.

Its a pageant. Don't think too deeply about it. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

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Mvp is a regular season award, and the actually best player on the nba is rarely the best player in the regular season.  Hence LeBron and Jordan having so few mvps, because they have better things to do.  It's fine.

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10 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

Mvp is a regular season award, and the actually best player on the nba is rarely the best player in the regular season.  Hence LeBron and Jordan having so few mvps, because they have better things to do.  It's fine.

Um, I'm not sure about LeBron (haven't followed the NBA much), but Jordan definitely was still the best player in the regular season too.

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17 minutes ago, Proudfeet said:

I wasn't talking about you. And its not just about the Lakers.

Anyway, yeah, LeBron should probably have more MVPs. I wouldn't go as far as ten though. I'd stop at around maybe his stint at Miami. He's been on regular season energy conservation mode for awhile.

Ten is a bit hyperbolic, but there was probably a 6-8 year in which he should have won it basically every year. The Cavs situation is an interesting example though about the flaw in the award. the Cavs sucked before LeBron got there and his arrival immediately made them a legit contender. That's rather MVPish to me, even if he did take nights off.

Quote

Its a pageant. Don't think too deeply about it. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

I know, and frankly it's probably good for the league to not just have the same player win it every year even if they are deserving. 

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Just now, Tywin et al. said:

Ten is a bit hyperbolic, but there was probably a 6-8 year in which he should have won it basically every year. The Cavs situation is an interesting example though about the flaw in the award. the Cavs sucked before LeBron got there and his arrival immediately made them a legit contender. That's rather MVPish to me, even if he did take nights off.

Sure, but its not just whether he had a good season or not. There are other teams and players after all.

7 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

I know, and frankly it's probably good for the league to not just have the same player win it every year even if they are deserving. 

Deserving is a tough word.

As I said, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Sometimes people want to freshen things up. People/things don't have the same impact when you're used to them. Sometimes others just think differently. You might raise an eyebrow or make a couple of pointed comments here or there but that's the extent of it. I mean, I don't get Picasso or avant garde art in general. I think that its rubbish but you do you. 

Its the same for the MVP. As long as you don't trot out something that can be independently be verified as false as your argument, I'm not going to deny you. If you are being as vague as possible, then all I can say is that you have weird/bad taste. I can't say that you're wrong.

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MVP is so weird, nobody seems to be able to explain exactly what it means, it's like its deliberately vague, just so they can stop dominant players as mentioned above winning 10.

Why not just have a best player award and be done with it?

Anyway, I vote for the big weird, unathletic dude that does amazing shit. 

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Edwards may have just thrown down a dunk even nastier than the one that got him a lot of love of a few weeks back. And he's got 34 with a minute left in a tight game. 

 

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Legit chuckles

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And we reach the final player in the Greatest Peaks series, Stephen Curry.  I am glad to see that Ben spent enough time on his defense, as a lot of time his otherworldly offense uses up all the oxygen in the discussion about what a transformative player he was.

The final Greatest Peaks video next Monday will be a look at what Ben considers to be the ten Greatest Peaks.

My own list in chronological order would be:

  1. Bill Russell
  2. Wilt Chamberlain
  3. Bill Walton
  4. Kareem
  5. Larry Bird
  6. Magic Johnson
  7. Michael Jordan
  8. Akeem Olajuwon
  9. LeBron James
  10. Stephen Curry

 

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I think Bird could end up number one overall. If we're going solely on peaks, that three year run of his was insane. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

I think Bird could end up number one overall. If we're going solely on peaks, that three year run of his was insane. 

I am a charter member in the Cult of Larry, and if he starts a church next week my application to become a deacon will be in the mail before you can say, "French Lick".

However, despite my love for Bird..

  • LeBron has done everything Larry did, and a little bit more and a lot more athletically for longer;
  • And Curry has utterly changed the game;
  • And Bill Russell never got into a bar fight during the playoffs where he got injured and cost his team the clear championship;
  • And Michael Jordan didn't destroy his own body doing manual labor in the heat and humidity of an Indiana summer that would have cost him $350 to have somebody else do.

But I would pay good money to see the five of them (at their peaks) play together against any other time-traveling collection of players of your choosing in a five- or seven-game series.

  • Curry
  • Jordan
  • LeBron
  • Bird
  • Russell

Imagine the poetry you might get out of that team.

Edited by Wilbur

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1 hour ago, Wilbur said:

I am a charter member in the Cult of Larry, and if he starts a church next week my application to become a deacon will be in the mail before you can say, "French Lick".

However, despite my love for Bird..

  • LeBron has done everything Larry did, and a little bit more and a lot more athletically for longer;
  • And Curry has utterly changed the game;
  • And Bill Russell never got into a bar fight during the playoffs where he got injured and cost his team the clear championship;
  • And Michael Jordan didn't destroy his own body doing manual labor in the heat and humidity of an Indiana summer that would have cost him $350 to have somebody else do.

But I would pay good money to see the five of them (at their peaks) play together against any other time-traveling collection of players of your choosing in a five- or seven-game series.

  • Curry
  • Jordan
  • LeBron
  • Bird
  • Russell

Imagine the poetry you might get out of that team.

Longer doesn't really matter in this discussion, and I'm factoring eras and style of play. Larry Bird would be an absolute monster in today's game. Imagine how much he'd score upping his volume of three point shots and playing in a less physical time. He'd be totally unstoppable. 

Also, Swap Russell out for Kareem and I'm with you.

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