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Public Figures Satirized as Genre Characters: eg. Ten Rules for Life, By Red Skull

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21 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

I don’t care about putting social commentary in comics, it’s a good place for it. If it’s clever.. and maybe in some way accurate. The Red Skull stuff is like some dumb meme cooked up by some kid on the internet. Am I supposed to take it for biting satirical commentary on the state of America?!  Is that the cleverest point Coates can make? 

It's pretty fucking funny, especially the edgelord reactions

21 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Surely someone as well respected as Coates should be aiming higher no? And maybe try to be a little bit better informed?

Sorry, how is he misinformed? Peterson himself represents himself as the Red Skull. Seems like it's pretty accurate!

21 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

But like you, I guess he thinks Peterson is a Nazi.. because .. well who knows why.

I don't think Peterson is a Nazi. I do think Peterson likes comparing himself to the Red Skull, as do his fans. Maybe take it up with Peterson why he wants to compare himself to the Red Skull as a good thing?

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1 hour ago, Karlbear said:

Sorry, how is he misinformed? Peterson himself represents himself as the Red Skull. Seems like it's pretty accurate!

I don't think Peterson is a Nazi. I do think Peterson likes comparing himself to the Red Skull, as do his fans. Maybe take it up with Peterson why he wants to compare himself to the Red Skull as a good thing?

This entire time I assumed you were just trolling, but maybe you genuinely don’t understand?

Like you’ve missed the bit where Peterson and his fans are laughing at the fact that Coates compared Peterson to the Red Skull? Like you don’t see how they are taking the piss out of that? 
 

Im hoping you are still just trolling this entire thread really. 

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57 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

This entire time I assumed you were just trolling, but maybe you genuinely don’t understand?

So you're saying that Peterson does self-identify as the Red Skull?

57 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Like you’ve missed the bit where Peterson and his fans are laughing at the fact that Coates compared Peterson to the Red Skull? Like you don’t see how they are taking the piss out of that? 

Sorry, is taking the piss another thing that Peterson does other than eating only beef?

 

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6 hours ago, Heartofice said:

This entire time I assumed you were just trolling, but maybe you genuinely don’t understand?

Like you’ve missed the bit where Peterson and his fans are laughing at the fact that Coates compared Peterson to the Red Skull? Like you don’t see how they are taking the piss out of that? 
 

Im hoping you are still just trolling this entire thread really. 

100% trolling.

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Posted (edited)

Red Skull is a fictional superhuman Nazi.

Red Skull's utterances are thus Nazi utterances.

Some of Red Skull's utterances are vaguely similar to Jordan Peterson's utterances.

Jordan Peterson's utterances are sometimes Nazi utterances.

Adolf Hitler was a Nazi.

Adolf Hitler liked dogs.

Liking dogs is something Nazis would do.

Most people like dogs.

Most people exhibit Nazi behavior by liking dogs.

This is fun.

----

In all seriousness, the comic actually has some interesting things to say, and rather uncomfortable things at that. Like there's the bit about Captain America saying that the detective he's talking with found the badge, he found the flag, but these poor saps who have become terrorists found the Red Skull. But you go back a bit, and Coates's argument is darker than that. For one thing, he has Cap tell the detective that being a cop isn't his job, it's his mission, and that the NYPD is a fraternity. Now, in the voice of Captain America, this is a benign statement. But one can't help but think that for Coates, this is not, in fact, a benign statement at all!

And then Cap talks about how he himself was once a guy on the outside looking in, a guy without a mission, because everyone he knew was a soldier, everyone else was convinced to fight the good fight, but he couldn't be one and was desperate to belong. But does Coates think it was a good fight? His own writing suggests deep ambivalence

Coates does have a dark view of human nature and human society -- he is not a hopeful person -- and it seems to me that he's basically equating becoming a cop and becoming a soldier with becoming a Nazi. There's differences between them, for sure, but they operate under the same mechanisms and it's a flip of the coin where you end up. That's pretty damned dark. 

Edited by Ran

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Ran said:

 

In all seriousness, the comic actually has some interesting things to say, and rather uncomfortable things at that. Like there's the bit about Captain America saying that the detective he's talking with found the badge, he found the flag, but these poor saps who have become terrorists found the Red Skull. But you go back a bit, and Coates's argument is darker than that. For one thing, he has Cap tell the detective that being a cop isn't his job, it's his mission, and that the NYPD is a fraternity. Now, in the voice of Captain America, this is a benign statement. But one can't help but think that for Coates, this is not, in fact, a benign statement at all!

And then Cap talks about how he himself was once a guy on the outside looking in, a guy without a mission, because everyone he knew was a soldier, everyone else was convinced to fight the good fight, but he couldn't be one and was desperate to belong. But does Coates think it was a good fight? His own writing suggests deep ambivalence

Coates does have a dark view of human nature and human society -- he is not a hopeful person -- and it seems to me that he's basically equating becoming a cop and becoming a soldier with becoming a Nazi. There's differences between them, for sure, but they operate under the same mechanisms and it's a flip of the coin where you end up. That's pretty damned dark. 

I think it's a pretty good observation, especially given how comfortable so much of the American right has become with Nazis and white supremacists.

And the numerous times individual cops have been caught espousing white supremacist ideology, or the times that secret Facebook groups for cops were revealed to be rife with racist rants and jokes. And the well established efforts of white supremacists to infiltrate law enforcement and the military.

One of the most horrifying things about the Nazis is how many ordinary people just went along with them. And yet here we are in 2021 and large swathes of the population are okay with police brutality and racism. Is Coates' view so dark?

But hey, he might have used Jordan Peterson's grifting pseudo-intellectual douchebaggery to satirize the radicalization of over-privileged underachieving young Americans, so his work must be puerile and dumb.

Edited by DanteGabriel

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