UK Politics - Taking the Land Rover to Heaven

[mormont]

8 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Not sure about that. Numbers 10 and 11 are a bit of a disaster zone: they've been refurbished, rebuilt and renovated on a near-constant basis almost since their founding, and whenever anyone left it alone for a decade or two they stored up massive problems later on. They once effectively tore 10 and 11 down and rebuilt them exactly the same as before to put in a better frame and it's still causing problems.

Pulling the whole thing down (probably the street) and completely rebuilding it from scratch is what's needed, but they're never going to spring for that, not with the monstrous renovation costs of the Houses of Parliament as well.

There are two issues that have been conflated under 'renovation' here, though: maintenance of the actual building, and redecorating. It's reasonable for the taxpayer to maintain the building. It's not reasonable for us to pay to have Johnson's choice of furnishings installed and the kitchen lighting changed.

Of course, neither should be paid for by party donors looking for favours from the PM.

Sarah Vine's intervention is a classic 'whoops, was that unhelpful? silly me!' comment. Not subtle.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

I think the point is not to leave it 10 years when there is a fund to use every year.  If the fund is not enough because the state of the building (and not a desire to spend lots) that is another matter and an increased fund or one off should be considered.

 

also maybe choose wallpaper that doesn't cost £850 per roll.

 

I don't think its unreasonable for the Tax payer to pay for any babyproofing or even some basic nursery furniture.  (or converting the a nursery to a non-nursery at the change of PM)  I do think if we are expected to pay for it then better value for money should be expected or the PM personally pays for any excess.

 

[BigFatCoward]

If it was me I'd spend the whole 30 grand the day before I was kicked out making it as vile as possible for the new resident. 

[Heartofice]

Isn’t it that Theresa May did some decorating there and the whole thing looked ‘a bit John Lewis’?  and Carrie Symons has her own ideas about interior decoration. 
 

I think if I’d moved in after Theresa May I’d probably need to start all over again as well! 

[Spockydog]

 

[Spockydog]

9 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Isn’t it that Theresa May did some decorating there and the whole thing looked ‘a bit John Lewis’?  

Nah, the John Lewis Nightmare is in the Chancellor's flat.

[mormont]

2 hours ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

I don't think its unreasonable for the Tax payer to pay for any babyproofing or even some basic nursery furniture.  (or converting the a nursery to a non-nursery at the change of PM)  I do think if we are expected to pay for it then better value for money should be expected or the PM personally pays for any excess.

I think it's unreasonable to ask that the taxpayer fund anything a landlord wouldn't.

1 hour ago, Spockydog said:

Nah, the John Lewis Nightmare is in the Chancellor's flat.

That is the flat Johnson is living in.

[Spockydog]

11 minutes ago, mormont said:

That is the flat Johnson is living in.

Ah. Is that where the PM's residence is, or is he staying there for some other reason? 

[Werthead]

4 minutes ago, Spockydog said:

Ah. Is that where the PM's residence is, or is he staying there for some other reason? 

The flat above Number 11 is bigger than the one above Number 10, so starting with Tony Blair (who had a big family), it's been traditional for the PM's family to stay above Number 11 and for the Chancellor to stay above Number 10 or in their own home. I think Gordon Brown was the only exception since then. So the flat refurbishment in question was for Number 11, not 10.

[Spockydog]

So what, if anything, can the Electoral Commission actually do once they've confirmed that Johnson broke the law here? 

[Maltaran]

17 minutes ago, Spockydog said:

So what, if anything, can the Electoral Commission actually do once they've confirmed that Johnson broke the law here? 

Fine both him and whoever gave him the money, but that’s about it

[Maltaran]

Arlene Foster has resigned as DUP leader

[Pebble thats Stubby]

Given that Covid has meant a lot (I assume) more people have requested postal votes than normal do we think all these sleaze stories is happening a little too late to have any real effect on the results?  Especially for local council elections which are often much lower turnout anyway and not the ones for the Scottish Welsh parliaments and the Mayor of London.

[williamjm]

1 hour ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

Given that Covid has meant a lot (I assume) more people have requested postal votes than normal do we think all these sleaze stories is happening a little too late to have any real effect on the results?  Especially for local council elections which are often much lower turnout anyway and not the ones for the Scottish Welsh parliaments and the Mayor of London.

I was wondering the same, I think I sent off my vote about 10 days ago.

I suppose it's possible it could increase turnout as well if people who weren't that interested in their local elections might feel more like making a protest vote now.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

21 minutes ago, williamjm said:

I was wondering the same, I think I sent off my vote about 10 days ago.

I suppose it's possible it could increase turnout as well if people who weren't that interested in their local elections might feel more like making a protest vote now.

I was thinking those motivated to vote against him are probably already voting against him.  I think its more likely to make his supporters less likely to turn up on the day and be bothered to vote

[Werthead]

16 hours ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

Given that Covid has meant a lot (I assume) more people have requested postal votes than normal do we think all these sleaze stories is happening a little too late to have any real effect on the results?  Especially for local council elections which are often much lower turnout anyway and not the ones for the Scottish Welsh parliaments and the Mayor of London.

You might get an increased protest vote, but going by the sheer volume of Johnson apologists online, I don't think it'll move the needle too much. The Mail and the Murdoch rags have taken against him, though, so if they keep that up for a while that might start having an impact.

[Heartofice]

So far doesn’t look like ‘cash for curtains’ is cutting through with voters

 

[mormont]

So, for anyone unfamiliar with NI politics and the DUP in particular, we can now helpfully sum up.

80% of Arlene Foster's MPs and MLAs wanted her gone at least in part because abstaining on a vote banning gay conversion 'therapy' was deemed too progressive.

The only declared candidate to succeed her so far believes the Earth to be around 6,000 years old.

And people wonder why NI politics is such a mess.

ps - because I know the audience in this thread, yes, he's called Poots.

[Which Tyler]

6,000 years? Heretic!

 

It's obviously only 4,000 years old.

 

Oops, you're right, he did say 4000BC

[Werthead]

1 hour ago, mormont said:

So, for anyone unfamiliar with NI politics and the DUP in particular, we can now helpfully sum up.

80% of Arlene Foster's MPs and MLAs wanted her gone at least in part because abstaining on a vote banning gay conversion 'therapy' was deemed too progressive.

The only declared candidate to succeed her so far believes the Earth to be around 6,000 years old.

And people wonder why NI politics is such a mess.

ps - because I know the audience in this thread, yes, he's called Poots.

I'm not sure what the DUP's play is here. They are in a semi-strong position (at least as can be expected) and it seems they've decided to endanger that for no readily apparent reason. They're not going to magically change the demographics that make their long-term (or even medium-term) prospects look dim, and they're not going to force either the EU or the UK government to redraw the Brexit agreement (the UK government having reverted to its old standby of forgetting that Northern Ireland exists now it doesn't need their votes to prop them up) and they're not going to force the UK government or Sinn Fein or anyone else into regressive moves to strip rights from minorities in Northern Ireland.

As far as I can tell, this is going to be an effective protest vote that makes them feel good about themselves but changes absolutely nothing.

Meanwhile, the clock continues to tick down to Irish reunification and the point at which unionists in Northern Ireland have to agree to accept the inevitable or resort to blowing things up from the other side of the demographic and democratic fault line.