Covid-19 #30: Vaccines and All That JJAZ

[Raja]

3 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

Shocking English on my part.

Immigrants. Coming in here, not even trying to assimilate and speak the queen's english. Absolute shambles.

[williamjm]

10 hours ago, Filippa Eilhart said:

from the European perspective, the choice isn't "AZ or nothing", it's "AZ or Pfizer/Moderna". And from this perspective, you have one vaccine that is less efficient (to the point of almost no efficacy against mild disease and unknown efficacy for preventing serious disease for the SA variant, which in parts of Europe represents a very significant 30% of cases) AND sometimes causes serious health problems which are not easily treated, and on the other hand you have a safe and efficient vaccine with no problems. Is it surprising people are hesitant to get the first and would rather get the second?

I think everyone would prefer the MRNA vaccines at the moment if given a choice. It might be simpler if one vaccine had better efficacy but the other had worse side-effects because then you really could give people a choice and people with a higher covid risk could choose the former, but now the only choice where people might choose AZ if given a choice is if it meant being vaccinated much sooner (I think maybe some countries have started to move towards doing that?).

[Zorral]

1 hour ago, BigFatCoward said:

First jab this coming Friday morning, then that afternoon I'm working a shift operationally. 

That's very different.  I too hope you'll be fine.  But even if you don't feel ill with your first, you may feel, quite strongly, lassitude and / or outright fatigue, which could be dangerous to yourself on shift, particularly if driving.  We type because we care!  

[BigFatCoward]

Just now, Zorral said:

That's very different.  I too hope you'll be fine.  But even if you don't feel ill with your first, you may feel, quite strongly, lassitude and / or outright fatigue, which could be dangerous to yourself on shift, particularly if driving.  We type because we care!  

I don't drive at work. And its an operational role that I'm unfamiliar with so its my excuse already lined up if i fuck up. 

[Zorral]

1 minute ago, BigFatCoward said:

I don't drive at work. And its an operational role that I'm unfamiliar with so its my excuse already lined up if i fuck up. 

Excellent.  So now we will worry about somebody else instead.  

[A wilding]

3 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

I don't drive at work. And its an operational role that I'm unfamiliar with so its my excuse already lined up if i fuck up. 

Anecdotal information from us and our friends: you will feel perfectly fine for about 12 hours, and any side effects will then hit you over the course of an hour or so. Both Mrs W and I had about 24 hours of mild flu-like symptoms.

[Kalbear]

Shot 2 - FIGHT

[Martell Spy]

Friend of mine got sick about 6 hours after the 2nd shot. Based on that, and what I'm hearing here, I guess I have that to look forward to.

[Fragile Bird]

As some of you know, I play Pokemon, mainly with a group of people in my neighborhood. We stay in touch through What's App. We basically haven't seen each other in months, though in the summer when Covid numbers dropped to nothing (less than 10 a day in Toronto, as opposed to1,000+ now) we would cautiously gather to do a raid, all socially distanced.

A friend I haven't seen hide nor hair of in months invited me to a raid the other day and we got into a chat. I asked him how come he hadn't been around, and he explained he caught Covid-19. I knew he was being very careful because he has a compromised immune system, but he works in the family business, grocery distribution. He'd be at the food terminal everyday, picking up fresh produce, and one thing we know for sure, truck drivers bringing in food from the south are coming in infected. We know because more testing is being done, and previously they were exempt.

Anyway, he told me he had been very sick for weeks, and medication he was given gave him hallucinations and paranoia, so he ended up in a mental health facility for 4 days. He's also lost 50 pounds. He was a stocky kind of guy, but that would make him damn skinny now. The good news is he's doing much better.

So go get your vaccine shots.

 

[Makk]

In NZ we just had a fully vaccinated airport worker catch it. We've only had a couple of other cases from airport workers before the vaccine so it is a bit disappointing. We all knew it wasn't immunity but was kind of hoping that along with being careful it would protect the border staff a bit better than that. 

[Derfel Cadarn]

12 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

I don't drive at work. And its an operational role that I'm unfamiliar with so its my excuse already lined up if i fuck up. 

As Ted Hastings would say, “regs are regs, fella!”

If you do fuck up don’t take any shit from anyone not “one rank senior”. For the purposes of the DIR.

[rotting sea cow]

4 hours ago, Makk said:

In NZ we just had a fully vaccinated airport worker catch it. We've only had a couple of other cases from airport workers before the vaccine so it is a bit disappointing. We all knew it wasn't immunity but was kind of hoping that along with being careful it would protect the border staff a bit better than that. 

What weird case

According to the news the person in question shouldn't have had direct contact with infected persons

Quote

New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern told reporters the virus was detected in a person who boards aircraft to clean them after they have arrived carrying passengers from countries considered COVID-19 "red zones."

plus being vaccinated.

These things fascinate me. Countries like NZ that have practically eliminated COVID are in good position to spot these weird infections that in most countries get buried under the deluge of cases.

What is going on? I'd guess there is a low level of infections going on among airport workers that showed up in that particular individual.

[Impmk2]

1 hour ago, rotting sea cow said:

What is going on? I'd guess there is a low level of infections going on among airport workers that showed up in that particular individual.

Yes it's odd. I'd be very surprised if NZ isn't routinely testing all its border workers, so would think they would've picked it up prior if there was a significantly more widespread cluster.

I'm wondering how quickly they've been getting on to aircraft after they landed. In Australia we've seen a few cases in hotel quarantine which can only be explained by aerosols from infected people hanging around for a few minutes, and someone walking through them.

In any case we'll know if there's more infections soon enough - all their co-workers will undoubtedly be tested as close contacts. 

[Padraig]

2 minutes ago, Impmk2 said:

In any case we'll know if there's more infections soon enough - all their co-workers will undoubtedly be tested as close contacts. 

Given it is hoped that vaccination will hinder spread also, it will be an interesting case study!   With COVID under control, they should be able to trace things very clearly.

The EMA will give an update on J&J today.  Largely a non-story except if they give an update on the number of relevant cases.

[Fragile Bird]

AZ has reportedly warned our federal government that the 1.2 M doses scheduled to arrive next month will be cut in half. The premier of Ontario has apparently been calling on countries in Europe that have rejected AZ to see if they’ll send their spare doses to us, like Denmark and Norway.

[Makk]

They almost certainly caught it from their job cleaning planes. They were cleaning them from high risk countries. All front line staff are supposed to be tested at least every two weeks, and in this case they they were clean on the 12th.

[JoannaL]

56 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

AZ has reportedly warned our federal government that the 1.2 M doses scheduled to arrive next month will be cut in half. The premier of Ontario has apparently been calling on countries in Europe that have rejected AZ to see if they’ll send their spare doses to us, like Denmark and Norway.

Yes there must be another new problem with AZ. It is not in the media but the delivery schedule which you can look up for Germany (webpage health ministry) has changed from 12,5 mio for the second quarter to 2,3 mio for the second quarter. Afterwards I do not think we need any AZ any longer because the over 60 are vaccinated. So can AZ not deliver (AGAIN) or are already resources redirected because of demand?

[Padraig]

1 hour ago, JoannaL said:

Yes there must be another new problem with AZ. It is not in the media but the delivery schedule which you can look up for Germany (webpage health ministry) has changed from 12,5 mio for the second quarter to 2,3 mio for the second quarter. Afterwards I do not think we need any AZ any longer because the over 60 are vaccinated. So can AZ not deliver (AGAIN) or are already resources redirected because of demand?

Wow.  That is a huge drop.  Even if Germany thought it only needed 2m more AZ vaccines, I would have thought it would still get as much as possible and figure it out afterwards.

2 hours ago, Fragile Bird said:

AZ has reportedly warned our federal government that the 1.2 M doses scheduled to arrive next month will be cut in half. The premier of Ontario has apparently been calling on countries in Europe that have rejected AZ to see if they’ll send their spare doses to us, like Denmark and Norway.

Even in Denmark, it hasn't closed the door completely on AZ apparently.

Quote

The Danish government has said it is prepared to listen to suggestions the country’s shelved AstraZeneca Covid-19 vaccines can be given to individuals who consent to take it.

...

A lack of clarity also exists as to liability in the case of serious side effects, and how compensation would be given.

Probably explains why it hasn't officially declared what it will do with the spare vaccine.  The volunteer idea is a good one, except it still worries about liability if something goes wrong with those who agreed to get it.  We live in a litigious society.

https://www.thelocal.dk/20210416/denmark-to-consider-individual-choice-over-astrazeneca-vaccine/

[Fragile Bird]

Axios has a new poll out that shows 8% of people in the US don’t know anyone who has been vaccinated. That’s a pretty good trick in a country with more than 50% of the adult population having received at least one shot.

And there’s a plant in Michigan that manufactures the Ram truck that has shut down, not because of the microchip shortage that has shut down other plants, but because 600 employees either have Covid-19 or are in quarantine because of exposure to those people.

[IheartIheartTesla]

Polarization in the US has meant people hang out with others who have similar interests, I wouldnt be surprised to find some conservatives enclaves within the US with very low vaccination numbers.

And regarding the Michigan plant, I believe its almost impossible to socially distance in many if not most assembly lines; doesnt surprise me at all such places are struck hard by this new wave.