Kalbear Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 3 hours ago, Ran said: I'm sure that there's information somewhere on how many traffic stops there are each year, and how many aren't complied with, and how many who don't comply who actually get away. Yes, and you've missed my point entirely. From where is that data gathered? Who is actually putting in those numbers? Because again the police lie a whole lot. We have ample evidence of this. 3 hours ago, Ran said: I did find the second of those: So, of 25,882 refusals to comply, we have 13 shooting deaths, a rate of 1 shooting death in 1991 refusals, vs. 0 shootings in some much larger number of traffic stops which were complied with. How many who refused to comply got away? No idea, can't find that statistic. However, in 2021, it was noted that police fired their weapons in .76% of all non-compliance stops. And in the US, 18% of people who evade police get away, so lets just transpose that. How many shots were fired at George Floyd? 3 hours ago, Ran said: So if we translated that to France... 4659 non-compliance that led to successful evasion, which if we suppose they were unsuccessful may mean ~2 people might have theoretically died if they had both failed to comply and been less lucky about their evasion... but then again, if they simply didn't fail to comply, there would be 0 deaths. France is not the wild west. Again you need to not look at the overall population especially when we're asserting problems for a specific subset of the French population. But more importantly you're taking the police's word that they were failing to comply - which in the case we're discussing we absolutely 100% know that they lied about! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spockydog Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 7 hours ago, Ran said: BFC seems to be correct: not complying is what gets people killed. Aye. Kalbear 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ran Posted June 30 Share Posted June 30 8 hours ago, Kalnak the Magnificent said: Because again the police lie a whole lot. We have ample evidence of this. That website, which is clearly not a pro-police site, provides more information around the circumstances of each situation, and yet doesn't seem to question that in most cases that people did in fact refuse to comply with the stop, presumably because it's pretty hard to question the fact that someone drove past a roadblock or check point, and that that was the inciting incident to what followed. France is not the Wild West, and it's certainly not America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted July 1 Share Posted July 1 20 hours ago, Ran said: That website, which is clearly not a pro-police site, provides more information around the circumstances of each situation, and yet doesn't seem to question that in most cases that people did in fact refuse to comply with the stop, presumably because it's pretty hard to question the fact that someone drove past a roadblock or check point, and that that was the inciting incident to what followed. France is not the Wild West, and it's certainly not America. No, deaths at police hands in France run at one seventh the rate in the US. Ran 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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