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Better Call Saul


SeanF

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18 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Oh Lalo.  You should have remembered Tuco’s advice, in The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.

”When you have to shoot, shoot, don’t talk.”

Especially, when your intended victim used to kill for Pinochet.

Fair points.  On the other end, if Gus was wary enough to wear body armor, maybe bring a gun for yourself?

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24 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Especially, when your intended victim used to kill for Pinochet.

That's a fan theory, as far as I know. Have the writers canonized it?

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Wow so I totally misread that scene. I thought he was in PTSD panic survival mode and figured the one who went to Gus' house was at more risk. I figured that was the start of the end of their relationship. 

I was also playing The Long Dark on my steam deck for half the episode and that was a mistake, this show deserves my full attention. 

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10 minutes ago, Ran said:

That's a fan theory, as far as I know. Have the writers canonized it?

I recall in the fourth season (of BB) episode Hermanos, Hank questions him about his past and says they have no record of him as a Chilean national or anything before he emigrated to Mexico in 1986.  Gus chalks this up to the Pinochet regime being notoriously poor at record keeping.  And of course Hector refers to him at one point as "generalissimo."  I suppose not canonized, but highly suggestive.

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7 minutes ago, DMC said:

I recall in the fourth season (of BB) episode Hermanos, Hank questions him about his past and says they have no record of him as a Chilean national or anything before he emigrated to Mexico in 1986.  Gus chalks this up to the Pinochet regime being notoriously poor at record keeping.  And of course Hector refers to him at one point as "generalissimo."  I suppose not canonized, but highly suggestive.

Also he's for sure connected in some way, this is why Eladio has Max the chemist killed and spares Gus. 

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23 minutes ago, Ran said:

That's a fan theory, as far as I know. Have the writers canonized it?

Hector spared his life, back in 1988, because they did not want to make enemies of the Chilean security forces.  Then there’s his reference to Herr Shuyler about their time in Santiago.

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15 minutes ago, DMC said:

I recall in the fourth season (of BB) episode Hermanos, Hank questions him about his past and says they have no record of him as a Chilean national or anything before he emigrated to Mexico in 1986.  Gus chalks this up to the Pinochet regime being notoriously poor at record keeping.  And of course Hector refers to him at one point as "generalissimo."  I suppose not canonized, but highly suggestive.

He also said Pinochet's government was guilty of many sins when he remarked on its record keeping being among them, which feels a bit unnecessary if he was a Pinochet partisan. A theory I like is that Fring was high up in the liberation front that tried and failed to kill Pinochet in 1986, and were considered terrorists by the state department. Eladio sparing him would have been an acknowledgment of his being a guy who fought for liberation from a US-backed government, rather than because he was afraid. In particular, Eladio says nothing at all about Chile's security forces, he just says Gus is alive because he knows who he is.

 

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24 minutes ago, SeanF said:

Hector spared his life, back in 1988, because they did not want to make enemies of the Chilean security forces.

As RumHam mentioned, in the flashback at the end of Hermanos Eladio says the only reason Gus was spared was because Eladio knew who Gus was.  However, I don't recall Hector specifically mentioning the Chilean security forces.  Was that in BCS?

1 minute ago, Ran said:

He also said Pinochet's government was guilty of many sins when he remarked on its record keeping being among them, which feels a bit unnecessary if he was a Pinochet partisan.

I think it makes sense in the context of the scene where he's being (lightly) interrogated.  Particularly considering Hank's question appears to be one of the rare occasions he's caught off-guard.

That theory is compelling on the timing, but I have a hard time buying the leader of the cartel would have such political predispositions - especially in regards to "sparing" Gus.  That seems like something only done due to fear of reprisals.

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13 hours ago, DMC said:

As RumHam mentioned, in the flashback at the end of Hermanos Eladio says the only reason Gus was spared was because Eladio knew who Gus was.  However, I don't recall Hector specifically mentioning the Chilean security forces.  Was that in BCS?

I think it makes sense in the context of the scene where he's being (lightly) interrogated.  Particularly considering Hank's question appears to be one of the rare occasions he's caught off-guard.

That theory is compelling on the timing, but I have a hard time buying the leader of the cartel would have such political predispositions - especially in regards to "sparing" Gus.  That seems like something only done due to fear of reprisals.

On checking, No.  It was a conclusion I jumped to.

I think it the likeliest reason he was spared however.  That he did have powerful connections in Chile, that even Eladio would be reluctant to upset.

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47 minutes ago, Ser Glendon Fireball said:

Man, that "Lalo won't come back" dialogue between Mike and Jimmy. You could almost hear Vince Gilligan shouting to Jonathan Banks: "be convincing, Jon! the fans want it to be canon!"

I did think about that line, and the fact that Jimmy used the same phrase about it having been Nacho, not him, as from BB. Good stuff. Maybe a little bit of a stretch that Jimmy didn't assume "not coming back" = dead, but I'll take it. 

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2 minutes ago, Ser Glendon Fireball said:

also I was wondering, what does Mike know about Howard? because it's quite touching when he says "slowly" to the men throwing Howard' corpse into the grave

I mean, not only did Mike know about Howard, but he knew the objectives of Jimmy and Kim's scheme.  That was kinda surprising to me when he mentioned it as part of the cover story for Howard's death, but I just chalked it up to Mike being Super PI.

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8 minutes ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

Mike had people watching Jimmy and Kim, and I assume he or his guys took a closer look once they realized they were cooking up a scheme.

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. Like when he dressed up as Howard and borrowed his Jag for that stunt with the prostitute, surely one of Mike's men was around? They'd have to report what was going on and putting it all together I expect Mike could see they were fucking with Howard for some reason. Maybe he doesn't know why, maybe they were right to do it, he doesn't care -- he just knows they were doing it.

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36 minutes ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

Mike had people watching Jimmy and Kim, and I assume he or his guys took a closer look once they realized they were cooking up a scheme.

Yep, that's pretty much what I meant.  Still, putting together their scheme just based on surveillance is what makes him Super PI.

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3 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I would have expected a more vague type resolution in terms of what Jimmy would know about Lalo than what they did, just because Mike doesn't say 'he's dead, Jim' doesn't mean that he wouldn't be clear on it.  Odd choice.

Yeah, I would have preferred this too.  But, I kind of give em a pass because they already established that Jimmy and Kim thought he was dead once...and then he came back.  With that context (not to mention the context of Lalo killing Howard etc.), it makes sense that Jimmy would still be scared he's still alive despite what Mike told him.

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7 minutes ago, DMC said:

Yeah, I would have preferred this too.  But, I kind of give em a pass because they already established that Jimmy and Kim thought he was dead once...and then he came back.  With that context (not to mention the context of Lalo killing Howard etc.), it makes sense that Jimmy would still be scared he's still alive despite what Mike told him.

Yeah, maybe, it still seems kinda weak considering what a big deal that one single line turned out to be in the prequel. 

The show(s) have been mostly good at having events unspool realistically and in character [accounting for various characters being preternaturally lucky and intelligent] and the quirky nature of both shows.  So, it's a nitpick I guess, same as my personal belief that prequel Mike should not have killed the German engineer since BB 'no half measures' Mike didn't kill the vicious POS Lydia...incongruous, but another nitpick.

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1 minute ago, Cas Stark said:

since BB 'no half measures' Mike didn't kill the vicious POS Lydia...incongruous, but another nitpick.

Heh, I actually caught that episode this weekend when AMC was doing their marathon.  Mike is very clear about that mistake - he didn't kill her because he was sexist.  And then when Jesse objects to killing her Mike says "now you're being sexist too."  Good stuff.

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