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Better Call Saul


SeanF
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If we look at BB and BCS, so far:  Mike, Gus, Salamancas, Bolsa, the don, Hank, Walt, Combo, Jane, Lydia, Gale, all of them dead.  Chuck, dead. Nacho, dead. Howard, dead. Sky: a shell of her former self.  Jesse: a shell of his former self.  The only people who came out of BB unscathed are druggy but loyal stoners Badger and Skinny Pete. 

Maybe they will give Jimmy the happy ending that no one else has gotten, who knows. It would be out of step with the cause and effect of the world they've created.  According to me.

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2 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

If we look at BB and BCS, so far:  Mike, Gus, Salamancas, Bolsa, the don, Hank, Walt, Combo, Jane, Lydia, Gale, all of them dead.  Chuck, dead. Nacho, dead. Howard, dead. Sky: a shell of her former self.  Jesse: a shell of his former self.  The only people who came out of BB unscathed are druggy but loyal stoners Badger and Skinny Pete. 

Maybe they will give Jimmy the happy ending that no one else has gotten, who knows. It would be out of step with the cause and effect of the world they've created.  According to me.

Nacho is dead, but he got redemption, a glorious end, and safety for his dad. It was on his own terms, which is more than most got. I think this is because deep down he was a good person. This show is not breaking bad. Walt was a piece of shit all the way down, I don’t think the show is going to treat Jimmy or Kim like Walt. 

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22 minutes ago, Fury Resurrected said:

Nacho is dead, but he got redemption, a glorious end, and safety for his dad. It was on his own terms, which is more than most got. I think this is because deep down he was a good person. This show is not breaking bad. Walt was a piece of shit all the way down, I don’t think the show is going to treat Jimmy or Kim like Walt. 

Indeed.  Nacho was a better person than Jimmy for certain, and maybe a better person than Kim.  Yet he still had to sacrifice himself to pay for his bad choices.  

ETA, Walt was a POS all the way down, and because he was the protagonist and they had much sympathy for him and loved BC, Walt got as good of an ending as he could possibly have had.  He killed all of his remaining enemies, said goodbye to his wife and children, potentially got some millions to his family and saved Jesse in the end, then died in a meth lab instead of a jail cell or a hospital.  That would argue that Jimmy is going to get at least as good of an ending as Water White got.

Edited by Cas Stark
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6 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

And so is Kim, at the least is an accessory to the murder of Howard not to mention all the crimes and fraud she has committed over the seasons.

 

Don't know if this it true. Kim and Saul had nothing to do with Salamanca showing up and killing Howard so how is she an accessory? I'm sure she could be charged for not reporting it or the cover up but his death was spontaneous and not of their doing.

And you aren't alone, I don't think either deserves a happy ending. What I do like is this season has shown that Kim wasn't this doe eyed victim who Jimmy was corrupting. She was enjoyed what she was doing. For too long we saw, or some viewers saw, her as a unwitting victim just going along for the ride.

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3 minutes ago, dbunting said:

Don't know if this it true. Kim and Saul had nothing to do with Salamanca showing up and killing Howard so how is she an accessory? I'm sure she could be charged for not reporting it or the cover up but his death was spontaneous and not of their doing.

And you aren't alone, I don't think either deserves a happy ending. What I do like is this season has shown that Kim wasn't this doe eyed victim who Jimmy was corrupting. She was enjoyed what she was doing. For too long we saw, or some viewers saw, her as a unwitting victim just going along for the ride.

Accessory after the fact.  

I agree, Kim's arc with Howard made me hate her guts, but also showed how wrong I was to have been blaming Jimmy as you say for corrupting her.  She wanted it, loved it, became the driver of it, and ultimately had more taste for plain old cruelty than Jimmy, which is a stunning heel turn.  It's incredible that I went from worryong about her and rooting for her to 'save herself' to now I would not actually care if she was killed, even though of course she won't be.

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1 hour ago, Cas Stark said:

Accessory after the fact.  

I agree, Kim's arc with Howard made me hate her guts, but also showed how wrong I was to have been blaming Jimmy as you say for corrupting her.  She wanted it, loved it, became the driver of it, and ultimately had more taste for plain old cruelty than Jimmy, which is a stunning heel turn.  It's incredible that I went from worryong about her and rooting for her to 'save herself' to now I would not actually care if she was killed, even though of course she won't be.

And that is what's called good writing!

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33 minutes ago, Mark Antony said:
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|Really thought Saul was gonna bash a cancer patients head in with his dead dogs ashes and strangle an old lady with a telephone cord.

 

Spoiler

I thought he was just going to tie her up.  Doesn't seem to be any benefit to killing her.  They'd find the body and then her kid would talk anyway.

 

Edited by briantw
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Spoiler

Definitely seemed to me like he was at least threatening to strangle her based on his demeanor and how he was holding the cord. :dunno: 
Kim breaking down on the shuttle was some incredible acting

 

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5 minutes ago, Mark Antony said:
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Definitely seemed to me like he was at least threatening to strangle her based on his demeanor and how he was holding the cord. :dunno: 
Kim breaking down on the shuttle was some incredible acting

 

Spoiler

I agree that the threat was implied but I think he likely would have just tied her up if it came to that.  Again, I just don't see the benefit to him to kill her.  The drunk guy, I get.  He was desperate to get out of that house without being seen and bashing that guy in the back of the head would have accomplished that (potentially without actually killing him), but what does he gain by killing the old lady?  He'd just end up wanted for murder in addition to everything else, and Saul has never been a killer.

 

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Yeah, he wouldn't have done anything. Contemplating something is not doing it, or we'd all be in trouble.

This series always had an element of hope and humor to it, I hope they remember that, in the finale. It's gotten so depressing, it's hard to watch.

Edited by Le Cygne
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6 hours ago, briantw said:
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I agree that the threat was implied but I think he likely would have just tied her up if it came to that.  Again, I just don't see the benefit to him to kill her.  The drunk guy, I get.  He was desperate to get out of that house without being seen and bashing that guy in the back of the head would have accomplished that (potentially without actually killing him), but what does he gain by killing the old lady?  He'd just end up wanted for murder in addition to everything else, and Saul has never been a killer.

 

Spoiler

Don’t think he was really thinking that far ahead at the time. Until she said “I trusted you” and kinda broke him out of his trance 

 

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@Mark Antony Agreed

Spoiler

I think part of it with the "I trusted you" goes back to his elder law days, and something about that really snapped him out of even contemplating doing the unthinkable.

Amazing episode. Rhea Seehorn deserves all the awards. Jimmy was not wrong when he mentioned a "hair shirt", because the small, constrained, vapid, empty life she is in feels like purgatory. 

I feel like her confession and the tears that follow in the aptly-named "Waterworks" are really carthatic and shows a growth that I'm not sure Jimmy/Saul/Gene will manage. 

 

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Beautiful episode.  I thought Kim's FL life would be pretty grim and it was. I knew she would punish herself with a super mundane life and she did.  What she did to Howard to me is unforgivable but at least she has taken a step to repair that damage.

I didn't really buy that Jeff would panic to such an extreme, but that's a quibble.  As suspected Carol Burnett is the cause of Jimmy getting outed.  It looks like prison for Jimmy, maybe Kim will visit him and it will end like that.  That is the most hopeful ending I can imagine at this point.

I didn't see that the Jesse cameo added anything to the story, but whatever.  It made me wondre what kind of life Aaron Paul is leading that has caused him to age so much.

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I loved this episode.

I don't think Saul was thinking clearly in the moment when he was threatening Carol Burnett with the telephone wire. His worst instincts and character had taken hold and he was prepared to murder her, just as he was prepared to kill the cancer patient if need be.

Kim's breakdown was incredible acting. It was almost as sad as seeing that parking at the Albuquerque court is now automated :( . So long, sticker system.

It was really grim and tragic all around, but I did get a big laugh out of Jeffy's getaway and seeing how he got caught.

Finally, the one scene that worked less well for me was Jesse's. I know what they were going for, but I didn't really need another Jesse cameo, and I think the same purpose could have been served better through Mike.

 

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2 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

I didn't really buy that Jeff would panic to such an extreme, but that's a quibble.

I thought initially he was faking a drunk driving accident in order to distract the cops from looking at the house, allowing Slipping Jimmy to slip out.

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