LØkI, a TVA/Disney+ series [SPOILERS]

[felice]

2 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

I guess what’s tripping me up is how they talked about each other’s parents as if they were different people. She said she was adopted, but nothing about the conversation implied that that adoption was by Odin and Frigga.

They talk about each other as if they were different people too, even though they started out the same. Loki certainly had a lot of interactions with his parents that Sylvie didn't, and Sylvie had at least some that Loki didn't. Unless Loki was told at a young age that he'd been adopted, it went very badly, and they eventually wiped his memory (Sylvie's variation splitting off at some point during this period)? In any case, they definitely seem to be talking about the same adoption.

2 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

I still revert back to thinking the writers just thought ‘ah, pesky Loki, always varianting him/herself’ and didn’t think through the consequences of how that’d actually work.

That is indeed possible.

[mormont]

There is a simpler solution, though it's going to perhaps raise some quibbles because causality and linear time and so on, but hear me out.

The TVA came into existence at some point (in time?) We know that because of the information we're given about its origins. But Loki is at least 1,000 years old. So variant Lokis may have existed before the TVA came into being. Of course, the TVA can then go back along the timeline and eliminate them at their point of origin, and presumably must do so in most cases, but Loki being who they are, they may have already escaped into the timeline, ambushed the TVA team, or otherwise eluded the pruning.

As I noted above, the implication with Sylvie is that this happened very early and so the likeliest explanation is that someone rescued or moved Sylvie, but we know many variant Lokis exist or existed and trouble or have troubled the TVA, so we must assume they weren't all pruned quickly or easily.

[Underfoot]

On 6/28/2021 at 7:17 AM, Corvinus85 said:

Sylvie says that when she was in agent C-20's head, she had to dig deep for a memory that was hundreds of years ago. Considering that the memory indicated modern times, no older than the 70s I think, I wondered what her frame of reference was when she said hundreds of years. If she was using 2077, knowing when Lamentis-I is destroyed, that's only about 100 years. But if she was using her own, native time as the frame of reference, then Sylvie is from the future. I maintain she is Loki's daughter. 

Agreed on all counts. I thought it was fairly obvious that she was a Loki from a future point in time where "our" Loki wouldn't have known about her, and the hints in the last episode were too strong for me to assume she's anything other than "our" Loki's daughter. 

It is headache inducing for me to think that the TVA is dealing with variants from any {past, our present, future} period in time concurrently in their little isolated quantum space or whatever the TVA is, but it makes more sense somehow than that their pocket of time is running concurrent to history. /Shrug

[DaveSumm]

8 hours ago, Underfoot said:

It is headache inducing for me to think that the TVA is dealing with variants from any {past, our present, future} period in time concurrently in their little isolated quantum space or whatever the TVA is, but it makes more sense somehow than that their pocket of time is running concurrent to history. /Shrug

Indeed, there’s clearly some form of time that the TVA operate under because the agents leave for the mall in 2050, then Sylvie drops all the canisters she’s been collecting, and then the TVA experience all these branches happening. So there’s a chronology there for those agents at headquarters, colleagues leave - 2050 - branches happen. Even though obviously it isn’t 2050 (or potentially any definable year) for them.

[mormont]

Before we get to tomorrow's episode: thoughts on the theory that most of the last episode's events were in fact taking place in Loki's head?

It could make sense - fits well with Sylvie's actions/dialogue when she tries to enchant Loki. I'm not completely sold on it, though.

[Kalbear]

16 minutes ago, mormonte said:

Before we get to tomorrow's episode: thoughts on the theory that most of the last episode's events were in fact taking place in Loki's head?

It could make sense - fits well with Sylvie's actions/dialogue when she tries to enchant Loki. I'm not completely sold on it, though.

Both incredibly shitty, and very unlikely

[DaveSumm]

18 minutes ago, mormonte said:

Before we get to tomorrow's episode: thoughts on the theory that most of the last episode's events were in fact taking place in Loki's head?

It could make sense - fits well with Sylvie's actions/dialogue when she tries to enchant Loki. I'm not completely sold on it, though.

I think if you’re gonna pull that stunt, you have to have the reveal at the end of the episode. Leaving it hanging a week is just poor form.

[briantw]

7 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

I think if you’re gonna pull that stunt, you have to have the reveal at the end of the episode. Leaving it hanging a week is just poor form.

Yeah, and it would be especially poor form in a series that only has six episodes, as it would completely invalidate one of those episodes. 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Now… that was more interesting and gave some weight to the previous episode.  Do all the “pruned” end up like that?

[Poobah]

Another very good episode, I don't think they've hit a dud so far.

[Winterfell is Burning]

This might have been the best one yet.

There is an after-credits scene, for those of you that didn't stick around.  And it's quite something.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

13 minutes ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

This might have been the best one yet.

There is an after-credits scene, for those of you that didn't stick around.  And it's quite something.

The Marvel streaming shows are very consistent in offering end credit scenes at the mid or end point of their series.

[Corvinus85]

Well damn, that went in an interesting direction. Definitely the best episode yet.

[Kalbear]

Guess the wizard of oz thing wasn't too hard to figure out, but still I appreciate them not fucking around and getting right to it. 

Loved the scene with sylvie and b15 at the end of the world. 

[sifth]

The Time Keepers looked dumb, I'm glad they were fake, lol

Even though, I was almost certain they were.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

So, is Mobius… “gone”… or just gone like MCU mainline Loki was “gone”?

[Werthead]

On 6/28/2021 at 3:55 PM, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

This whole discussion has made me question the viability of simply putting the stones back where they were found.  

Particularly the Mind stone.  If Cap puts the scepter before he picks it up… there are two scepters there.  If he drops it next to his unconscious body he leaves open a timeline where either the Shield Strike team thinks he is Hydra… or… the Shield Strike team knows he knows about Hydra.  How can he return the scepter to where it was found without creating further disruptions?

I get the impression that when they said repairing or restoring the timeline, by returning the Stones to when they were taken (or just after), they literally merge the timelines and all memories or signs or evidence of the variation basically vanishes: so Peter waking up on Morag, going "That's weird" and getting the Stone from the temple five seconds later, is a "wrinkle" in time that subsequently vanishes - i.e. the timeline gets smoothed over and later on Peter remembers only landing on Morag, doing his funky dance and getting the stone, as we see in GotG.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

14 minutes ago, Werthead said:

I get the impression that when they said repairing or restoring the timeline, by returning the Stones to when they were taken (or just after), they literally merge the timelines and all memories or signs or evidence of the variation basically vanishes: so Peter waking up on Morag, going "That's weird" and getting the Stone from the temple five seconds later, is a "wrinkle" in time that subsequently vanishes - i.e. the timeline gets smoothed over and later on Peter remembers only landing on Morag, doing his funky dance and getting the stone, as we see in GotG.

Maybe.  But that seems a tad handwavey for my taste.  

Cap knowing about Modern Hydra hidden in SHIELD is a huge plot point and SHIELD’s interaction with Cap has to change based upon their knowledge of that knowledge.

I don’t see how Cap can get Rumlow the staff without duplicating the staff in order to prevent having to reveal his knowledge of Hydra.

[Argonath Diver]

42 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

So, is Mobius… “gone”… or just gone like MCU mainline Loki was “gone”?

He popped up on a beach with three parked jet skis, one Owen and one Christopher Walken and they all said "Wow" a bunch of times, then took off on a sweet run around the harbor.

[Corvinus85]

The blue fake Time-Keeper whose head came off was supposed to be Kang? I'm not familiar with the character, but since he's already been cast for Ant-man I wonder if he'll actually show up.