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The future of Catholicism


Darzin

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On 8/20/2021 at 2:45 AM, Free Northman Reborn said:

Evangelicals are the Church as it existed in its earliest incarnation in the first and second centuries, driven by personal belief in God and a passionate commitment to the cause of spreading the Faith above all else. Before the religion became institutionalised under the corruption of the Roman Catholic Church.

It is a return to Christianity’s roots. That’s why it is the fastest (perhaps the only) growing sector of the Christian community.

Are they growing because they're actually getting converts, or are they growing cause they have the most kids? Cause only the former would mean that "a return to Christianity's roots" (lol) is why they are the fastest growing sector of Christianity. (Also pretty sure Mormon's and Jehovah's Witnesses are up their too. Are they "Christianity's roots"?)

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1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

If we’re just asking questions here, did that Jesus fella have a birth certificate, or was the 25th day of December arbitrarily picked long after he supposedly died? I’m sure it has nothing to do with preexisting pagan celebrations of the winter solstice…

No, he didn't for obvious reasons. Scot, didn't you teach sunday school? So, if my memory is a bit flimsy on the details, feel free to correct.

José and Maria were traveling back to their home state because of a census, ordered by President Octavian (aka August(us)). The local governor, a fellow known as Herod, was in charge of things there. Think of him as some some sorta ancient version of Greg Abbott of Texas (and of the the parents of baby Jesús as Mexians to make it work). Now then, Herod heard rumours that baby Jesús would succeed him as governor, so he decided to kill all the newborn, before he could reach voting age (simpler times, now he has to do baby shit like voter supression). So ofc José and Maria went into hiding, leaving Jesús without a birth certificate. Since it was a homebirth (well stable birth, but that's splitting hairs), and didn't take place in a hospital there were no documents. Not even a short form birth certificate, which wouldn't qualify anyway.

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2 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

No, he didn't for obvious reasons. Scot, didn't you teach sunday school? So, if my memory is a bit flimsy on the details, feel free to correct.

José and Maria were traveling back to their home state because of a census, ordered by President Octavian (aka August(us)). The local governor, a fellow known as Herod, was in charge of things there. Think of him as some some sorta ancient version of Greg Abbott of Texas (and of the the parents of baby Jesús as Mexians to make it work). Now then, Herod heard rumours that baby Jesús would succeed him as governor, so he decided to kill all the newborn, before he could reach voting age (simpler times, now he has to do baby shit like voter supression). So ofc José and Maria went into hiding, leaving Jesús without a birth certificate. Since it was a homebirth (well stable birth, but that's splitting hairs), and didn't take place in a hospital there were no documents. Not even a short form birth certificate, which wouldn't qualify anyway.

That seems fairly reasonable. Just don’t tell me that Jose wasn’t getting it in with Maria.

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For medieval Christians it was important to the the conception date to March 25th, which was the vernal equinox under the original Julian calendar (Though this date drifts quickly due to the inaccuracies or that calander). This date coincides with other events detailed in the Bible. Add 9 months you get Dec 25th

As for the RCC it will endure as all orthodox Christian churches will. It will no longer have the Constantinian dominance that the Church enjoyed for many centuries. But that is ok. States and business do a nice job of corrupting the Church so a period of living in a non Christian nation and world won t be all negative.

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14 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

That seems fairly reasonable. Just don’t tell me that Jose wasn’t getting it in with Maria.

Actually, when you think about it, that's the most fucked up bit in Christian religion.

I mean, God impregnated a woman with baby Jesús. Putting aside, that Jesús being god, thus making god god's own father and so on and so forth. No, what often gets ignored there (if we were to accept those premises) is really, that Maria did not consent to it. Thus making the Christian god essentially a rapist (of his own mother on top). Fortunately there was no #metoo movement some 2.000 years ago (give or take), and today nobody really questions it anymore. A more cynical observer would draw line from there, to the rapey priests of today.

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12 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Actually, when you think about it, that's the most fucked up bit in Christian religion.

I mean, God impregnated a woman with baby Jesús. Putting aside, that Jesús being god, thus making god god's own father and so on and so forth. No, what often gets ignored there (if we were to accept those premises) is really, that Maria did not consent to it. Thus making the Christian god essentially a rapist (of his own mother on top). Fortunately there was no #metoo movement some 2.000 years ago (give or take), and today nobody really questions it anymore. A more cynical observer would draw line from there, to the rapey priests of today.

Not to mention the age difference and ‘power’ imbalance.

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1 hour ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Not to mention the age difference and ‘power’ imbalance.

God at this point in the story was also a serial killer several times over, right?

But he loves you? 

I'm going to come out and say it, the Judeo-Christian God is a problematic asshole.

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23 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

God at this point in the story was also a serial killer several times over, right?

But he loves you? 

I'm going to come out and say it, the Judeo-Christian God is a problematic asshole.

There was the flood, Sodom and Gammorrah.

Making the Egyptians keep the Israelites as slaves so he could keep hitting them with plagues and drowned a bunch when he unparted the sea.
 

Helped wipe out the Canaanites when the Israelites moved in. After forcing the Israelites to spend 40 years in the desert.

He wiped out half of Jerusalem, for some reason, when King David started to csrry out a census (...why...?)

Wiped out Job’s family as part of a bet with Satan.

Washed his hands of the Israelites and let them get conquered and exiled.

Missing a few genocides probably.

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1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

God at this point in the story was also a serial killer several times over, right?

But he loves you? 

I'm going to come out and say it, the Judeo-Christian God is a problematic asshole.

Just as well the Bible ain't supposed to be interpreted literally. ;)

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1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

God at this point in the story was also a serial killer several times over, right?

But he loves you? 

I'm going to come out and say it, the Judeo-Christian God is a problematic asshole.

"serial killer" seems a little generous.

"serial genocidist" would be more like it.

 

ETA: I see Derfel beat me to it

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1 hour ago, The Marquis de Leech said:

Just as well the Bible ain't supposed to be interpreted literally. ;)

Reminds me of my youth when I told my Rabbi that the Book of Genesis was utter nonsense. Thankfully I grew up in a liberal-reform sect and that kind of critical thinking was encouraged. 

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2 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

There was the flood, Sodom and Gammorrah.

Making the Egyptians keep the Israelites as slaves so he could keep hitting them with plagues and drowned a bunch when he unparted the sea.
 

Helped wipe out the Canaanites when the Israelites moved in. After forcing the Israelites to spend 40 years in the desert.

He wiped out half of Jerusalem, for some reason, when King David started to csrry out a census (...why...?)

Wiped out Job’s family as part of a bet with Satan.

Washed his hands of the Israelites and let them get conquered and exiled.

Missing a few genocides probably.

You missed breaching the walls of Jericho so the Hebrews could slaughter the people and conquer the land.

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4 minutes ago, Zorral said:

You missed breaching the walls of Jericho so the Hebrews could slaughter the people and conquer the land.

I was including that in the bit where the Israelites entered what was then Canaan and wiped out the locals.

He also laid a curse on whoever rebuilt the walls of Jericho, which comes up much later.

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5 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Thus making the Christian god essentially a rapist (of his own mother on top).

I will not stand for this slander.  Just because god got Maria pregnant does not mean there was any sexual assault.  Based on the documentary Dogma, when Alannis Morissette-as-god impregnates Linda Fiorentino, there's barely any contact at all.  Unfortunately.

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The early church did not accept that Jesus was divine. That is why they fought over doctrine and the winners, hundreds of years later, came up with the idea of the Trinity as an answer to awkward questions. The Emperors of Rome were already considered to be divine, so they needed to one up it. 
 

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