Standup Comedians - past, present, future

[Heartofice]

11 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

making being trans out to be absurd is exactly the problem. Especially when you try to imply inhumanity. 

The problem is that ‘gender Self ID’ and ‘Being trans’ are being too intrinsically linked by certain people. It goes to explain why you have a very particular interpretation of what he said, what Gervais is saying, what Chappelle is saying, which doesn’t align with how some other people see the issue.
 

Almost all of the conversations would be a lot healthier if the two things were able to be separated in peoples heads.

[polishgenius]

9 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

How many of you either pro or against the Gervais special have actually watched it?  

 

Spoilering this because, well, it's incredibly offensive and some people may just not wanna read it just like that, but: what context could possibly be added to this that would make it not horribly transphobic?

 

Spoiler

Gervais continues, “And now the old-fashioned ones say, ‘Oh, they want to use our toilets.’ ‘Why shouldn’t they use your toilets?’ ‘For ladies!’ ‘They are ladies — look at their pronouns! What about this person isn’t a lady?’ ‘Well, his penis.’ ‘Her penis, you fucking bigot!’ ‘What if he rapes me?’ ‘What if she rapes you, you fucking TERF whore?'”

 

(per this Variety article)

 

[DaveSumm]

15 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

I’m not sure what other interpretation there's even supposed to be. 

Then you just aren’t trying very hard at all. 

[Heartofice]

2 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

 

Spoilering this because, well, it's incredibly offensive and some people may just not wanna read it just like that, but: what context could possibly be added to this that would make it not horribly transphobic?

 

  Hide contents

Gervais continues, “And now the old-fashioned ones say, ‘Oh, they want to use our toilets.’ ‘Why shouldn’t they use your toilets?’ ‘For ladies!’ ‘They are ladies — look at their pronouns! What about this person isn’t a lady?’ ‘Well, his penis.’ ‘Her penis, you fucking bigot!’ ‘What if he rapes me?’ ‘What if she rapes you, you fucking TERF whore?'”

 

(per this Variety article)

 

You don’t think for a second that the joke is about the people policing gender pronouns.. not trans people? 
 

didn’t think so.

[polishgenius]

Your premise only works if you think that a person only becomes trans once they've had bottom surgery, and the premise of the joke only works 

Spoiler

if you think that a trans person trying to take a piss and a man trying to rape people are in any way correlated.

 

 

[Heartofice]

17 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

Your premise only works if you think that a person only becomes trans once they've had bottom surgery, and the premise of the joke only works 

  Reveal hidden contents

if you think that a trans person trying to take a piss and a man trying to rape people are in any way correlated.

 

 

Again, disagree. You’d only think that if you really didn’t understand the point of the joke. 
 

But really the issues discussed here are really the ( possible purposeful) misunderstanding of the gender critical position, which really is about the problems with gender Self ID. Gervais , and Chappelle are almost entirely making jokes at the expense of people who want to enforce the self  ID ideas on people and their behaviour when people don’t go along with it. 

[DireWolfSpirit]

See this thread has risen from the dust bin.

I shall reiterate my vote for Sarah Silverman, even though she's been less prominent than say, the Obama years. Her delivery and deadpanning was crafty and she's fond of taunting the type of people that believe creepy stuff like "The Jews killed Jeebus". What's not to love?

Eta: Also under the general heading of- these ladies make laugh- Tina Fey and Julia Louis Dreyfus.

 

[HouseBastard]

1 hour ago, polishgenius said:

 

I made a post about Gervais' position on trans people and dude responded to it with 'you can claim to be an animal if you want'. He's defended it by saying it was reductio ad absurdium - which isn't a defense at all because making being trans out to be absurd is exactly the problem. Especially when you try to imply inhumanity. 

 

I'm not sure what other interpretation there's even supposed to be. 

Yeah I think this forum is a little too much of an echo chamber for me if such a bland turn of phrase is going to cause such drama. Best wishes and goodbye.

[BigFatCoward]

2 hours ago, polishgenius said:

 

Spoilering this because, well, it's incredibly offensive and some people may just not wanna read it just like that, but: what context could possibly be added to this that would make it not horribly transphobic?

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Gervais continues, “And now the old-fashioned ones say, ‘Oh, they want to use our toilets.’ ‘Why shouldn’t they use your toilets?’ ‘For ladies!’ ‘They are ladies — look at their pronouns! What about this person isn’t a lady?’ ‘Well, his penis.’ ‘Her penis, you fucking bigot!’ ‘What if he rapes me?’ ‘What if she rapes you, you fucking TERF whore?'”

 

Jim Jefferies (before he became a shouty old drunk) did an excellent bit about how comedy sounds when read, rather than seen in person.

[Teng Ai Hui]

On 5/26/2022 at 2:23 AM, DireWolfSpirit said:

See this thread has risen from the dust bin.

I shall reiterate my vote for Sarah Silverman, even though she's been less prominent than say, the Obama years. Her delivery and deadpanning was crafty and she's fond of taunting the type of people that believe creepy stuff like "The Jews killed Jeebus". What's not to love?

Eta: Also under the general heading of- these ladies make laugh- Tina Fey and Julia Louis Dreyfus.

 

I'd like to add Ali Wong to this list.  Her new special, Don Wong, was very good.  I also remember enjoying her other comedy specials, her book, and Always Be My Maybe.

[DaveSumm]

I watched the Ricky Gervais special, it was pretty funny but not as good as Humanity I don’t think. It had a feel to it of ‘I’ve been paid to put a special together so I’ll throw some material together I guess’, rather than a comedian who’s evolved or has anything particular to say. 

[Heartofice]

On 5/28/2022 at 3:07 PM, DaveSumm said:

I watched the Ricky Gervais special, it was pretty funny but not as good as Humanity I don’t think. It had a feel to it of ‘I’ve been paid to put a special together so I’ll throw some material together I guess’, rather than a comedian who’s evolved or has anything particular to say. 

I would think Gervais would be pretty open about doing this stuff just for the money, I don't think he's ever been especially enthusiastic about doing stand up.. mainly because hes not really that good at it. 

I think it's been clear all this time that it was Stephen Merchant who was the comedic genius behind Gervais' career, for some reason though it's been Gervais who has gotten most of the credit. 

[cock_merchant]

Super Nature was brilliantly funny but the reactions to the special was on another level of hilarious!

Comedy remains the last frontier against the woke cancel mob. Long may Gervais and Chappelle lead the charge.  

[Week]

Bigotry > Humor is a take.

[Raja]

Ah yes, the old 'live and let live' whilst we discriminate against you & make laws that make it harder to be you.

Why didn't we think of 'live and let live' before? Really onto something here.

Also, 'last frontier'

[DaveSumm]

Rotten Tomatoes currently has it at 14% (critics) and 92% (audience), that’s quite the disparity.

[mormont]

We'll live and let live when the other side stop telling people how to live.

[Week]

1 hour ago, DaveSumm said:

Rotten Tomatoes currently has it at 14% (critics) and 92% (audience), that’s quite the disparity.

Pretty typical for his specials - even more poorly rated by critics because well, not very funny. Are you really credulously reporting this like you haven't ever seen transphobes and bigots rally around their 'culture' online? Are we seriously talking about ethics in stand up journalism here?

[baxus]

@Week Just out of curiosity, why would 14% critics score be seen as an accurate one and 92% as the one that's been artificially increased by "transphobes and bigots"? Why are critics by default seen as the ones who are right? Would it be the first time critics were wrong?

[Week]

14 minutes ago, baxus said:

@Week Just out of curiosity, why would 14% critics score be seen as an accurate one and 92% as the one that's been artificially increased by "transphobes and bigots"? Why are critics by default seen as the ones who are right? Would it be the first time critics were wrong?

I can watch (parts of -- the dearth of humor is a train wreck only worth watching briefly) and then read reviews by critics and (alleged) audience viewers ("not transphobic at all dur dur durr!"). 7 critic reviews vs 250+ audience reviews.

Eta- of course, critical thinking skills, basic respect for others, and recognition of punching down at a marginalized and villified group.