Covid-19 #39: Shooting the Messenger

[briantw]

5 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Glad I don't have to cape for this guy anymore.

@briantw

Better late than never!

[DireWolfSpirit]

3 hours ago, lessthanluke said:

Fact is none of you know shit about their reasons or what they do in their personal life. You just want to act superior.

I must admit I haven't been able to imagine what the reason(s) would be for healthy people to refuse to vaccinate (outside the medically exempt).

Give the reasons, so I can weigh whether they make any sense? Whether they outweigh the risk they are putting the innocent in?

 

Fwiw, Wiggins is still currently free to travel and play with the team on the road. Also the NBA has turned down a religious exemption for him.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

4 hours ago, lessthanluke said:

Not really. Its just sport. I accept I'm in the minority on this forum but when someone doesn't want to take the vaccine, as long as they aren't encouraging others not to get it and are accepting of the fact it may limit them I don't see the need to insult them but you continue to call people dicks and feel better about yourselves.

Not really anymore. When an upstart 18 year old can go from no one to maybe being worth $100M in just the course a few months, it ceases being just about sports.

And as far as not taking the vaccine goes, there are very few valid arguments supporting such a stance.

3 hours ago, larrytheimp said:

It's a colloquial expression for rich people.  

Duh

3 hours ago, Starkess said:

Actually this is not the case, water flossing should be used in conjunction with traditional floss!

I do both, you Nazi!

59 minutes ago, briantw said:

Better late than never!

And you can have an extra helping of fuck you, with a side of suck my balls. 

Wiggins, ugh, talk about me being wrong. 

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

The fact that literally every other player on the team has been vaccinated makes no impression on this person? He can shove a basket ball up his ass for all I care. 

In this province, some hospitals are rationing care and the military will be tasked with transporting overflow to neighboring provinces. Oh, you had a heart attack? Car accident? It'll be two hours to Vancouver. 'Hope you don't die on the runway.

We are averaging 14 deaths per day and climbing. And as bad as that is, it's a drop in the bucket compared to whats happening south of the border, let alone in other countries.

The other day I looked up which country had the highest per capita mortality from Covid. 'Turns out it's Peru, a country that I don't think has ever been mentioned on these threads. It certainly hasn't been on my radar at all in the last two years. They've seen 5,939 deaths/million people in 18 months. Relative to the U.S. population base, that's equivalent to 2 million dead Americans, in 18 months. For context, the leading cause of death in the US is heart disease, which kills 650k Americans a year.

[Spockydog]

1 hour ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

I must admit I haven't been able to imagine what the reason(s) would be for healthy people to refuse to vaccinate (outside the medically exempt).

Well, my friend, the rock 'n roll tour manager, is a mid-fifties, lifelong smoking, cheese-loving chonky boi, who could probably do with losing about 50lbs. He refused the vaccination because Covid is a ploy, enacted by 'them' in order to control us. And, depending on whatever shite he and his wife have most recently ingested from Facebook, the vaccine is either the delivery mechanism for some kind of evil Bill Gates biotech, or just some kind of deadly dangerous, untested poison. I know this because this is what he told me.

Anyway, with the live music industry gradually spluttering back into life, he's been working pretty much non-stop for the past few weeks. Six people connected to shows he worked on have tested positive for Delta.

And now so has he. He has a bad cough, but says he's had worse man flu. When we last spoke on Friday afternoon, he said he was feeling a bit better, but his wife, who has recently recovered from Cancer, was showing symptoms and feeling pretty bad.

According to whatsapp, neither have been online since about 11pm on Friday. 

Even though they are both on the Vitamin C and Ivermectin, I am deeply worried.

[Clueless Northman]

42 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

In this province, some hospitals are rationing care and the military will be tasked with transporting overflow to neighboring provinces. Oh, you had a heart attack? Car accident? It'll be two hours to Vancouver. 'Hope you don't die on the runway.

That's the main issue.

Idiots costing us billions in healthcare when they could've avoided it all with a cheap vaccine is already annoying and frustrating, but that's just money.

Idiots flocking to ICUs and forcing hospitals to stop running normally, cancelling plenty of surgeries and treatments, pushing back patients somewhere else, this means that these idiots are directly harming many people, and are downright killing some of them.

If unvaccinated never used up more than, say, 20% of ICUs in any place, it would be annoying but manageable and wouldn't be a national issue or an emergency crisis. If they wouldn't fill up more than that share of beds, I would actually stop caring about vaccination rates and the fate of unvaccinated people - whether they're fine or end up dying would be the last of my worries. When their stupid behaviour directly harms others, that's where I draw my red line and expect the State, the government, to act against them, restore order and ensure the safety and well-being of the sensible majority of the people.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

Look at these fucking Hosers.

Ah, Dr. Deena Henshaw; the very picture of charisma. She could tell you an atomic bomb just went off or she's popping out for a case of beer and it wold still be the same drowsy, deadpan... zzzzzzzzz. Put some stink on it, woman. Drop an "F" bomb and see what happens. There are lives at stake here.

[The Anti-Targ]

Support for lockdowns continue here, but with conditions.

Quote

A new survey of New Zealanders shows general support for lockdowns to eliminate COVID-19, but has warning signs about the population's patience for future restrictions and mandatory vaccinations.

The results were overwhelming when Research New Zealand asked Kiwis about what we should be doing to manage COVID-19, with 70 percent saying they support lockdowns. For many people, however, that willingness only extends to when the vaccination target has been reached.

Research NZ surveyed 1000 people over the age of 18 from September 17 to 20, asking them two questions - whether they thought the country should continue using lockdowns as an elimination tool, and if vaccination should be mandatory for certain groups.

...

Of the 70 percent who support lockdowns, 47 percent support them only until the vaccination target has been reached. The support also varied by region. If you compare Auckland to the rest of the country there's a lower level of support for a continuation of lockdown. In Auckland, it's 66 percent, in comparison to Wellington where it's 79 percent for example.

Nineteen percent of those surveyed were against lockdowns but still wanted some precautions, according to the survey.

"Whilst they say they don't want to continue with lockdowns, many of them want to have strict rules around mask-wearing, testing and MIQ," he said.

When it comes to opening New Zealand's borders, 79 percent of those surveyed thought they should only be opened to those with vaccination passports and a recent negative COVID-19 test.

As to mandatory vaccinations, results varied widely depending on who was being talked about. When it comes to health and quarantine frontline workers, 85 percent said they should be required.

But when it came to other sectors such as teachers and childcare workers, 78 percent said vaccination should be mandatory.

The results generally left a core of about 10-15 percent who did not want any mandatory vaccinations,

Still 66% support for lockdowns in Auckland, not bad considering Auckland had been locked down for a month at the time the survey was conducted.

[Fragile Bird]

The US has distributed about 82M more vaccine shots than it has administered.

[A True Kaniggit]

42 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

The US has distributed about 82M more vaccine shots than it has administered.

How many of these were were wasted because they expired do you think?

Edir: A quick search says America has thrown away at least 15 million doses since March. 

[Fragile Bird]

1 hour ago, A True Kaniggit said:

How many of these were were wasted because they expired do you think?

Edir: A quick search says America has thrown away at least 15 million doses since March. 

Can I find the story again, that popped up on Facebook? No, of course not. Nor do my searches come up with it. Maybe the numbers will be widely discussed tomorrow .

[Luzifer's right hand]

Thawing and throwing away vaccines was already common in parts of the USA when I saw a documentary about the low uptake in mostly Repuplican areas a few months ago. I have seen the 15 million doses as a low end too.

[The Anti-Targ]

6 hours ago, A True Kaniggit said:

How many of these were were wasted because they expired do you think?

Edir: A quick search says America has thrown away at least 15 million doses since March. 

In an undertaking of this scale with how fragile the vaccines are wastage is going to happen. It's unfortunate, What's the wastage as a % of total vaccine distribution. That's really the stat that should be looked at in terms of whether it's a significant problem or just need to be accepted as a kind of collateral damage.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

9 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

In an undertaking of this scale with how fragile the vaccines are wastage is going to happen. It's unfortunate, What's the wastage as a % of total vaccine distribution. That's really the stat that should be looked at in terms of whether it's a significant problem or just need to be accepted as a kind of collateral damage.

No, this is an outrage, plain and simple.

We are tossing vaccines in the bin, which are desperately needed elsewhere, and up here some jerkwaddies refuse to get vaccinated for reasons and thus make life more miserable than it has to be for everybody else. It's quite a bit like food waste.

[The Anti-Targ]

1 hour ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

No, this is an outrage, plain and simple.

We are tossing vaccines in the bin, which are desperately needed elsewhere, and up here some jerkwaddies refuse to get vaccinated for reasons and thus make life more miserable than it has to be for everybody else. It's quite a bit like food waste.

Not really, it's only a little bit like food waste, and you are never going to completely eliminate either. So, it's all about determining what an acceptable wastage is and making sure you don't exceed that. If you think it is possible to achieve zero waste you are simply mistaken.

People choosing not to get vaccinated is not really a relevant factor.

[A Horse Named Stranger]

2 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Not really, it's only a little bit like food waste, and you are never going to completely eliminate either. So, it's all about determining what an acceptable wastage is and making sure you don't exceed that. If you think it is possible to achieve zero waste you are simply mistaken.

People choosing not to get vaccinated is not really a relevant factor.

Obviously there is never going to be zero waste. The amount of vaccines simply expiring is an outrage.

I disagree. Obviously, you know more about goverment planning and logistics than I do. However, the amount of vaccine you have to have as a reserve to make an offer for the unvaccinated population seems somehow correlated to the size of the, well, unvaccinated population. So there's a difference between having to have vaccines for 20m people, and 100m.

If our goverments were to say, we'Ve waited long enough, you don't want to get vaccinated fine, but don't start crying if you have to wait 6 weeks for an appointment, we're shipping much more of the vaccines abroad. Then the number of unvaccinated people become irrelevant.

[Fragile Bird]

4 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

In an undertaking of this scale with how fragile the vaccines are wastage is going to happen. It's unfortunate, What's the wastage as a % of total vaccine distribution. That's really the stat that should be looked at in terms of whether it's a significant problem or just need to be accepted as a kind of collateral damage.

If 82M more doses of vaccine have been distributed than used in the US to date, I’d say a helluva a lot more than 15M have been wasted so far.

[lessthanluke]

18 hours ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

I must admit I haven't been able to imagine what the reason(s) would be for healthy people to refuse to vaccinate (outside the medically exempt).

Give the reasons, so I can weigh whether they make any sense? Whether they outweigh the risk they are putting the innocent in?

 

Not replying to anything else as I can't be fucked but I'll respond to this one.

My partner is unvaccinated. She's a Pro athlete in a niche sport (meaning money is low) we rely on her comp performances to help pay our bills. She saw me unable to train for a month after getting vaccinated and decided the risk to her season wasn't worth it (if she has 4 weeks off her season is done), she's not anti vax, she'll probably get it after the year is done. Would she probably be fine and not get ill? Sure. Is it worth the risk to us? She has decided its not. 

[DireWolfSpirit]

5 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

 

If our goverments were to say, we'Ve waited long enough, you don't want to get vaccinated fine, but don't start crying if you have to wait 6 weeks for an appointment, we're shipping much more of the vaccines abroad

This is exactly what Biden just did recently when he announced he was increasing our vaccine donation by 500 million to 1.1 billion doses.

We are back to a waiting game for doses here too now because many who want boosters are being told we are not old enough or are jobs aren't dangerous enough. Even though we know they have the doses they will not administer them to all people willing to get them currently.

It's bs that I cannot get a shot even though its on hand locally, but in such circumstances if the govt isn't letting me get a booster, I prefer they increase the foreign supply as Biden said he will do.

The moment I'm eligible I will Castanza right over anyone's back to get my shot, without a moments hesitation.

I am long over any moral dilemma of what order this should go.

My order for me, is the moment I'm elgible, I don't make those calls anyway so I'm not consternating it.

My realistic best bet and hope will be that I may get the booster by about Christmas or maybe not till January.

But I will not pass by my chance when I am eligible. I feel those type of actions or nonactions as it were, would be contributing to the waste in the system.

[DireWolfSpirit]

11 minutes ago, lessthanluke said:

Not replying to anything else as I can't be fucked but I'll respond to this one.

My partner is unvaccinated. She's a Pro athlete in a niche sport (meaning money is low) we rely on her comp performances to help pay our bills. She saw me unable to train for a month after getting vaccinated and decided the risk to her season wasn't worth it (if she has 4 weeks off her season is done), she's not anti vax, she'll probably get it after the year is done. Would she probably be fine and not get ill? Sure. Is it worth the risk to us? She has decided its not. 

I see your dilemma, actually from reading your past posts I had a decent idea you were faced with some difficulties over the vaccination but I wasn't completely sure why.

I am sorry if my posts or namecalling offended anyone.