Why did Robert hate Stannis?

[Brynden"Bloodraven" Rivers]

1 hour ago, James Steller said:

Personally, I think the tragedy of Stannis is that he fails to realise that he's actually better than Robert. One of the big reasons for that is the way Stannis has evolved and changed across the story so far. He starts out with a reputation for being brittle and utterly rigid in his determination, but thanks to men like Davos and Jon Snow, Stannis has learned to temper this bitter edge and re-focus his motivation. He's never going to be a people-person like Robert, but he is just as efficient as Robert when it comes to military command, and with Melisandre at the Wall, Stannis only burns people at the request of his own followers, and even then he won't do it except with those who would be executed anyway (ie the cannibals).

And even with such a brittle, introverted personality, Stannis does inspire incredible loyalty. Davos Seaworth is just the main example. Those 1500 men endured all kinds of hardships under Stannis' command, and they are all still utterly devoted to him and his cause. I brought this up in an earlier chat, but one of the things I loved about ADWD is getting to know the diverse knights in his army, and how even though none of them ordinarily like each other, they are all completely loyal to Stannis. Even a misogynistic bully like Clayton Suggs risks his life for his king. That speaks to Stannis' abilities as a commander. 

I don't know what depths Stannis will plunge in the future novels (and I really hope GRRM changes his mind and alters what happened in the abomination) but from what I've read, he's one of the most fascinating characters of the story, and at his best, I think he was worth five of Robert.

Stannis the mannis for fucking life dude. The most deserving of the five kings and the best king now. Another thing I like about Stannis is that he judges people based on ability not birth. Davos, Rolland, Jon and Sallhador

[frenin]

7 hours ago, Lord Lannister said:

In their youth Robert was a bully, plain and simple.

Come on now, calling him a bully just for mocking Stannis's bird is incredibly harsh don't you think.

Do you people not have siblings?? You have never fought with them, teased them etc etc??

Because either you have an incredibly rare relationship with your siblings or you expect nothing but perfection from characters that are supposed to be regular humans.

 

 

2 hours ago, Minsc said:

How was Robert a bully, plain and simple?  At worst, we know he once teased him about a bird.  However, seeing how that is fully in-line with all of the Baratheon brothers' sense of "humor" (including Stannis) does it constitute him being a bully.

Yeah, that is simple banter between siblings lol.

It's like calling Stannis a bully because he teased Jon about having a fisher woman as mother because he haggled like one.

We all understand it's a joke. Yet...

The Proudwing incident is just yet another instance in which Stannis is trying to imitate Robert with disastrous results.

I do not remember where did I read that Stannis's type of bird is not fit for hunting. Yet because he wanted it to be like Robert's, which never missed it mark, he kept forcing it to a role that didn't suit him and ditching a percectiy good bird... Melisandre anyone??

2 hours ago, James Steller said:

and I really hope GRRM changes his mind and alters what happened in the abomination

He will do not worry, not only will Stannis kill his child, he will become an ice zombie as reward. Hehehehe

[Rondo]

People don't get to choose their brothers.  Robert and Stannis are as different as brothers could be.  It wasn't hate but a dislike.  

[WhatAnArtist!]

I personally subscribe to the theory that others have mentioned in this thread that Robert was secretly, and perhaps almost subconsciously, envious of Stannis. Sure, Robert made no secret of his love for drinking, wenching and partying, but I'm sure that part of him yearned for the reputation of being truly just and honourable like Ned and Stannis were. People aren't just defined by their outward actions and behaviour; sometimes it can be at odds with what they truly want, as difficult as it might be for them to admit. I mean, there's a reason why Robert so deeply trusted men like Jon Arryn and Ned Stark to run his kingdom, and Jon and Ned were far closer to Stannis in temperament and behaviour than they were to Robert. Robert may enjoy his hedonistic lifestyle, but part of him knew deep down that things like duty, honour and restraint were good values, he was just.... built differently. He couldn't achieve those things personally, but he acknowledged and respected those that could. 

I think the explanation of "Robert was a big dumb brute and bully" is far too simplistic. Sibling relationships are far more complex than that.

[Canon Claude]

9 minutes ago, WhatAnArtist! said:

I mean, there's a reason why Robert so deeply trusted men like Jon Arryn and Ned Stark to run his kingdom, and Jon and Ned were far closer to Stannis in temperament and behaviour than they were to Robert.

Except that he apparently didn’t trust them. Not enough, anyway. He never seems to have taken Stannis or Jon’s advice on anything during his time as king. And Ned couldn’t do anything meaningful either. He couldn’t prevent the Hand’s tourney from taking place, and he couldn’t convince Robert to not make Jaime the Warden of the East (which still doesn’t make sense, but anyway).

[frenin]

1 hour ago, Canon Claude said:

Except that he apparently didn’t trust them. Not enough, anyway. He never seems to have taken Stannis or Jon’s advice on anything during his time as king. And Ned couldn’t do anything meaningful either. He couldn’t prevent the Hand’s tourney from taking place, and he couldn’t convince Robert to not make Jaime the Warden of the East (which still doesn’t make sense, but anyway).

You can trust people and still refuse to listen to their advices. 

As any western teenager would tell you. Robert not listening isn't the same as him not trusting them. 

I wouldn't say that Stannis doesn't trust Davos because he didn't listen his, good advice, when it came to Melisandre.