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The tragedy of the starks


Daenerysthegreat
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On 10/21/2021 at 11:26 AM, Brynden"Bloodraven" Rivers said:

Tywin and Aerys have done much worse. They literally destroyed Duskendale because their lord rebelled against Aerys. Tywin annihilated all the small folk of Tarbeck and Reynes just because the Reynes didn’t pay their debts.

Darklin broke the custom called guest rights.  He put his king in prison and tortured him. 

On 10/21/2021 at 11:21 AM, Moiraine Sedai said:

Hoster attacked the Goodbrooks and burned their village during the rebellion. 

GB was actually the one who showed honor.  The GB stayed loyal to their king. 

On 10/21/2021 at 11:17 AM, Dreadscythe95 said:

Brandon Stark has always been such an awful person tbh. The black sheep of the Starks.

The black sheep for his generation. They are all black wolves today. 

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On 10/21/2021 at 11:26 AM, Brynden"Bloodraven" Rivers said:

Tywin and Aerys have done much worse. They literally destroyed Duskendale because their lord rebelled against Aerys. Tywin annihilated all the small folk of Tarbeck and Reynes just because the Reynes didn’t pay their debts.

But I can see why Aerys did what he did to the Darklins.  He just went too far when he also had the servants executed. 

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On 10/21/2021 at 12:21 PM, SeanF said:

Starks and Targaryens have a huge amount in common

Huge?? Pseudo magical toppled dynasty... That's about it.

 

On 10/21/2021 at 5:17 PM, Dreadscythe95 said:

Brandon Stark has always been such an awful person tbh. The black sheep of the Starks.

Based on...

In the books he's certainly hotheaded and sort of arrogant. Awful?? Not really.

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2 hours ago, frenin said:

Huge?? Pseudo magical toppled dynasty... That's about it.

 

Based on...

In the books he's certainly hotheaded and sort of arrogant. Awful?? Not really.

Both dynasties were conquerors, with connections to very ancient magic, and strange bonds with animals.

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1 hour ago, SeanF said:

Both dynasties were conquerors, with connections to very ancient magic, and strange bonds with animals.

So pseudo magical toppled dynasty. 

Most dynasties of Westerosi are pseudo magical anyway, from the Baratheons to the Martells.

I would argue than the Starks have more in common with the Martells anyway.

Edited by frenin
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On 10/23/2021 at 6:13 AM, frenin said:

So pseudo magical toppled dynasty. 

Most dynasties of Westerosi are pseudo magical anyway, from the Baratheons to the Martells.

I would argue than the Starks have more in common with the Martells anyway.

The Martells as well as the Starks are very much obsessed with revenge.
 

The Dormish are willing to sacrifice their women, old folks, and children for Dorne. How much is the North willing to sacrifice of themselves to have autonomy?  Maybe feeding their kids blood to trees.  

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On 10/23/2021 at 9:14 AM, frenin said:

Huge?? Pseudo magical toppled dynasty... That's about it.

 

Based on...

In the books he's certainly hotheaded and sort of arrogant. Awful?? Not really.

Considering that he is already a Feudal Lord, so his actions have massive impact I would call him awful.

His arrogance and actions create enemies to the Starks. Enemies cause Wars and guess who die in the wars, innocent people.

Not to mention his idiocity as a political entity in Westeros. He took a small army and went to The Red Keep to call the Prince of Westeros out to come and die. He had amazing ideas.

Yes, awful may be a heavy word for the time he lived but he annoys me a lot for some reason.

Edited by Dreadscythe95
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24 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

Considering that he is already a Feudal Lord, so his actions have massive impact I would call him awful

He's not a lord tho.

 

24 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

His arrogance and actions create enemies to the Starks. Enemies cause Wars and guess who die in the wars, innocent people.

Other's arrogant actions create enemies. The man was rightly pissed off because his baby sister had been kidnapped.

From there, there are two options, using one's head or going full Aerys.

Aerys and Rhaegar break every possible feudal convention but he's at fault?

 

26 minutes ago, Dreadscythe95 said:

Not to mention his idiocity as a political entity in Westeros. He took a small army and went to The Red Keep to call the Prince of Westeros out to come and die. He had amazing ideas.

He didn't have an army and he called Rhaegar out because he wanted to duel him. Anyone not a paranoid would have understood this.

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On 10/18/2021 at 10:26 PM, Jaenara Belarys said:

Poor little guy. What's going to happen to his poor cats? 

Here’s my hope for Tommen. Arya in disguise enters the keep with murder in her heart. Tommen’s cats react to the wrong smell coming from Arya. This is enough to alert the guards and Arya is caught and unmasked. 

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1 hour ago, Laren Dorr said:

Here’s my hope for Tommen. Arya in disguise enters the keep with murder in her heart. Tommen’s cats react to the wrong smell coming from Arya. This is enough to alert the guards and Arya is caught and unmasked. 

And why is Arya going to kill Tommen? She wants to kill Cersei, not Tommen. 

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16 hours ago, Jaenara Belarys said:

And why is Arya going to kill Tommen? She wants to kill Cersei, not Tommen. 

Tommen and the people around the primary target are collateral damage. Arya is perfectly okay with killing people who are not enemies of the Starks. She killed the insurance man and he had never been an enemy of the Starks. 

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18 hours ago, Laren Dorr said:

Tommen and the people around the primary target are collateral damage. Arya is perfectly okay with killing people who are not enemies of the Starks. She killed the insurance man and he had never been an enemy of the Starks. 

The only reason Arya killed the insurance broker was because the Faceless Men ordered her to.  If he hadn't been a Faceless Men target, she would have had no interest in him. 

And one of the (few) useful things she is learning from them is that collateral damage is bad.  Kill only your target.  Harm no one else.  Tommen is in no danger.  Neither, I think, is Cersei.  She has no reason to visit Kings Landing, and has yet to seek out a target. 

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3 minutes ago, Nevets said:

The only reason Arya killed the insurance broker was because the Faceless Men ordered her to.  If he hadn't been a Faceless Men target, she would have had no interest in him. 

And one of the (few) useful things she is learning from them is that collateral damage is bad.  Kill only your target.  Harm no one else.  Tommen is in no danger.  Neither, I think, is Cersei.  She has no reason to visit Kings Landing, and has yet to seek out a target. 

He is a Dany's worshipper who hates the Stark, don't bother answering him.

He sees Arya as a Stark version of Joffrey "Baratheon".

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19 hours ago, Laren Dorr said:

Tommen and the people around the primary target are collateral damage. Arya is perfectly okay with killing people who are not enemies of the Starks. She killed the insurance man and he had never been an enemy of the Starks. 

When you are in a war you need to do certain things to survive. Arya did the same. The other alternative was staying under the goat. No woman wants to stay with the bloody mummers in charge. That's a basic guarantee of rape. 

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  • 9 months later...
On 10/19/2021 at 7:17 PM, Jaenara Belarys said:

The Darrys definitely deserve that, after all they've suffered. Plus, Hoster (and the rest of STAB) come off as a bunch of ambitious lords who wanted in on the Lannister-Martell-Targaryen trio. 

Well when a power bloc forms and you are not in it, the best political action you can take is to join or create a power bloc of your own. So they're is a chance that the STAB bloc came to begin with when the LMT bloc started becoming a thing. Sure it is not perfect (look at WWI IRL) but it is natural, especially for the Tully's who hold the lands where the figthing always takes place.

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Yes the story of house Stark in the main series is a real tragedy, though there's no doubt that they'll survive and come through harder and stronger in the end. 

This is one of the reasons why I love the leimotif composed for the Starks by Ramin Djawadi in GOT, whose music was truly the only solid pillar of the show which always stayed great, it really carries well the sense of the tragedy endured by the family and a sense of melancholy about better and happier times when their family was whole and the children were mostly innocent and full of ideals before the game and the world's uglyness caught up with them.

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