azor ahai, huzor amai... are they the same person?

[Falcon2909]

azor ahai, huzor amai... are they the same person?

mazor alexei is also another similar name.

its crazy to think this hero has very similar and rhyming names in nations very far from each other. asshai is at the corner of the world and a very similar/rhyming name is used all the way in sarnor for the hero who saved the world.

IMO azor ahai saved asshai from The Others, then flew all the way on his dragon to save Sarnor and thats how he is known there as huzor amai.

[Wisconsin]

Hyrkoon is another name for the hero.  The people will have their heroes.  Azor Ahai was the hero of the people whose writings and prophecies survived.  There must have been other heroes who fought the icey darkness.  Those people of Essos carried the prophecy forward through time and they have found their Azor Ahai in Dany.  Quaithe wants Dany to know this. 

[Falcon2909]

3 hours ago, Wisconsin said:

Hyrkoon is another name for the hero.  The people will have their heroes.  Azor Ahai was the hero of the people whose writings and prophecies survived.  There must have been other heroes who fought the icey darkness.  Those people of Essos carried the prophecy forward through time and they have found their Azor Ahai in Dany.  Quaithe wants Dany to know this. 

But how come these two specific heroes - azor ahai and huzor amai - sound so similar???

[Loose Bolt]

6 hours ago, Falcon2909 said:

But how come these two specific heroes - azor ahai and huzor amai - sound so similar???

May be same reason why Finnish and Japanese have surprisingly many "similar" words with totally different meaning. For example in Finnish aho is resting field (field that is not in active use). But in Japanese it is a word that means an idiot. So Esko Aho (prime minister of Finland 1991-95) became "very popular" in reason that is not directly connected policy of "his" government. 

[Falcon2909]

2 minutes ago, Loose Bolt said:

May be same reason why Finnish and Japanese have surprisingly many "similar" words with totally different meaning. For example in Finnish aho is resting field (field that is not in active use). But in Japanese it is a word that means an idiot. So Esko Aho (prime minister of Finland 1991-95) became "very popular" in reason that is not directly connected policy of "his" government. 

That's different...it is a coincidence.

In asoiaf's case it is no coincidence. Two heroes who saved the world from the long night from completely different regions having very similar names is no coincidence.

[Alexis-something-Rose]

On 10/23/2021 at 7:38 AM, Falcon2909 said:

That's different...it is a coincidence.

In asoiaf's case it is no coincidence. Two heroes who saved the world from the long night from completely different regions having very similar names is no coincidence.

I don't think it's a coincidence. Different cultures, different pronunciation. Maybe there's a little cultural appropriation coming into play as well, like how the Andals turned a bunch of figures from the Age of Heroes into knights. 

The last hero doesn't even have a name, but we find out that he wielded a sword that the Others couldn't stand against. Interestingly enough, Old Nan never seems to mention this sword to Bran or Jon Snow.

There are some really interesting things about Huzhor Amai, though. From who his mother was, to the skin cloak that he wore, to the three wives he married, specifically the one who made his armor (smithing) and the wife who drove his chariot and the 3rd wife who is a total mystery.

[Falcon2909]

20 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

I don't think it's a coincidence. Different cultures, different pronunciation. Maybe there's a little cultural appropriation coming into play as well, like how the Andals turned a bunch of figures from the Age of Heroes into knights. 

The last hero doesn't even have a name, but we find out that he wielded a sword that the Others couldn't stand against. Interestingly enough, Old Nan never seems to mention this sword to Bran or Jon Snow.

There are some really interesting things about Huzhor Amai, though. From who his mother was, to the skin cloak that he wore, to the three wives he married, specifically the one who made his armor (smithing) and the wife who drove his chariot and the 3rd wife who is a total mystery.

huzor amai's 3 just like azor ahai's 3.

are they the same person? Would the last hero really go to every affected corner of the world to defeat the others?

[Alexis-something-Rose]

12 minutes ago, Falcon2909 said:

huzor amai's 3 just like azor ahai's 3.

We know for sure that AA had the one wife that he sacrificed. If they're the same person, then Huzhor Amai's 3rd wife and what she did for him is not mentioned. I've kind of wondered if she's not the wife who was sacrificed.

Huzhor Amai also sounds like he may have been the son of a female greenseer (Fisher Queens). 

14 minutes ago, Falcon2909 said:

are they the same person? Would the last hero really go to every affected corner of the world to defeat the others?

According to Old Nan, the LN lasted a generation. I don't think we can dismiss the idea that AA had children or a child who took up their father's mantle. 

The Rhoynar have their own story about the Long Night in the World Book. The sun returned only after a hero convinced the children of Mother Rhoyne to set their bickering aside and join him in a secret song to bring back the day. I think there's a good chance that the Rhoynar migrated from Sarnor to the Rhoyne. 

[Phylum of Alexandria]

Whether it's really one person or several similar roles, collectively the character is something like a cross between Odin and Lucifer. He's like this traveling mage who brings great power and knowledge to the societies that take him in, but the great power and knowledge are almost always abused, and ruin follows. There's a cyclical aspect to it, where the solution to a problem was a major cause of the problem in the first place. 

[TheBlackSwan]

On 10/25/2021 at 12:24 PM, Falcon2909 said:

huzor amai's 3 just like azor ahai's 3.

are they the same person? Would the last hero really go to every affected corner of the world to defeat the others?

The Long Night affected the whole planet but the Others were probably not in Essos. Only the tales of the Last Hero mentions those "dead men", "cold servants", " the horses of the dead, resurrected to serve them, just as they resurrected dead men to fight on their behalf" where legends from Essos are more vague, they talk mostly of fighting the dark, the darkness or just "monsters" and "demons". If they had to face the Others, the legends would be more precise just like the ones of the Last Hero.

[Phylum of Alexandria]

On 10/24/2021 at 10:18 AM, Alexis-something-Rose said:

he last hero doesn't even have a name, but we find out that he wielded a sword that the Others couldn't stand against. Interestingly enough, Old Nan never seems to mention this sword to Bran or Jon Snow.

Not just any sword, but a "dragonsteel" sword, which connects this Northern Westerosi legend to the powers of the East. And if dragons are indeed involved, then traveling to various points across the world becomes a lot easier.

[Alexis-something-Rose]

1 hour ago, Phylum of Alexandria said:

Not just any sword, but a "dragonsteel" sword, which connects this Northern Westerosi legend to the powers of the East. And if dragons are indeed involved, then traveling to various points across the world becomes a lot easier.

Yes, it does. And I'm sure there were dragons back in the day, I just don't think that "dragonsteel" has anything to do with them per se. Starting at the very end of AGoT, in Dany's last chapter and into ACoK, the red comet is constantly associated with dragons. It's identified as the "dragon's tail" by Dany and servants in the Red Keep. Melisandre calls it dragon's breath and Old Nan's associates it with dragons. When we start stripping the propaganda that surrounds the comet then it becomes associated with three things. Dragons, swords and sacrifice. And all of this culminates with Bran thinking about Dawn and how his father told him that it was forged from the heart of a fallen star right after he has been listening to a song about the Long Night. 

And this is the conclusion I've come to and I wrote a lengthy essay on it. 

If the comet is associated with dragons and swords and sacrifice, and we are told that there is a sword that was forged from the heart of a fallen star, then wouldn't someone who lived 8,000 years simple call that sword dragonsteel?

[Phylum of Alexandria]

19 minutes ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

Yes, it does. And I'm sure there were dragons back in the day, I just don't think that "dragonsteel" has anything to do with them per se. Starting at the very end of AGoT, in Dany's last chapter and into ACoK, the red comet is constantly associated with dragons. It's identified as the "dragon's tail" by Dany and servants in the Red Keep. Melisandre calls it dragon's breath and Old Nan's associates it with dragons. When we start stripping the propaganda that surrounds the comet then it becomes associated with three things. Dragons, swords and sacrifice. And all of this culminates with Bran thinking about Dawn and how his father told him that it was forged from the heart of a fallen star right after he has been listening to a song about the Long Night. 

And this is the conclusion I've come to and I wrote a lengthy essay on it. 

If the comet is associated with dragons and swords and sacrifice, and we are told that there is a sword that was forged from the heart of a fallen star, then wouldn't someone who lived 8,000 years simple call that sword dragonsteel?

I enjoyed your essay, and agree with your observations and associations. Certainly GRRM has a plan for all of these conflated concepts--dragons, swords, comets--but how exactly they all tie together and thereby affect the endgame is not clear. You might be right, but it's hard to say for sure at this point. Especially because we don't even know how Valyrian steel was made...or dragons for that matter. Comets/meteors will obviously play some role, but given GRRM's mischievous use of polysemous writing, it's hard to say exactly how.

[Egged]

Azor Ahai

Huzor Amai the amazing

Hukko

Hugor

Uthor

The amazing, the great

The Great Uthor

The Great Other

Hightower was once made of wood, and the sigil of House Hightower is a white tower with red flames above, reminiscent of a weirwood. The original tower was possibly made of Weirwood or was a weirwood, and its wood was eventually used to make a ship to sail with to the Iron Islands.

The maid bore 44 powerful sons to Hugor. They wore iron plate. There are 44 standing stones on Nagga’s hill.

The Grey King was probably Argoth Stoneskin/Argos Sevenstar. The Grey King hall had a starfish-shaped table, and his ship as made of the wood of Ygg, the demon tree. He probably left for the Iron Islands after losing Maris the Maid to Uthor Hightower.

It is also possible Uthor and Argoth are the same person, and that Uthor contracted greyscale before being known as Argoth or the Grey King. He would have left for the Iron Islands after being infected.

[TheBlackSwan]

On 11/19/2021 at 5:02 PM, Alexis-something-Rose said:

Yes, it does. And I'm sure there were dragons back in the day, I just don't think that "dragonsteel" has anything to do with them per se. Starting at the very end of AGoT, in Dany's last chapter and into ACoK, the red comet is constantly associated with dragons. It's identified as the "dragon's tail" by Dany and servants in the Red Keep. Melisandre calls it dragon's breath and Old Nan's associates it with dragons. When we start stripping the propaganda that surrounds the comet then it becomes associated with three things. Dragons, swords and sacrifice. And all of this culminates with Bran thinking about Dawn and how his father told him that it was forged from the heart of a fallen star right after he has been listening to a song about the Long Night. 

And this is the conclusion I've come to and I wrote a lengthy essay on it. 

If the comet is associated with dragons and swords and sacrifice, and we are told that there is a sword that was forged from the heart of a fallen star, then wouldn't someone who lived 8,000 years simple call that sword dragonsteel?

Martin said that the "fire" of the title refers to Dany and her dragons. He also said that, originally, there were no dragons, the Targaryen had a psionic power, pirokinesis, the abilty to control fire with their minds.

We can see that fire = dragon.
Obsidian contains fire magic, the Valyrian called it "frozen fire", in Westeros it's known as "dragonglass". We saw the effect of the obsidian on an Other but obsidian is brittle, it's not a good weapon. But  infuse fire magic into steel and you would have dragonsteel which would be great for a sword. 

And we know a sword infuse with fire magic that would melt a monster just like the obsidian did with the Other:

Quote

Lightbringer was his sword. Tempered with his wife's blood if Votar can be believed. Thereafter Lightbringer was never cold to the touch, but warm as Nissa Nissa had been warm. In battle the blade burned fiery hot. Once Azor Ahai fought a monster. When he thrust the sword through the belly of the beast, its blood began to boil. Smoke and steam poured from its mouth, its eyes melted and dribbled down its cheeks, and its body burst into flame."

The Last Hero and the dragonsteel sword = Azor Ahai and Lightbringer

[Egged]

I think George wrote a lot of the lore with the idea that dragons didn't actually exist, only fire-wielding psionic powers, and then added dragons, without rewriting the whole lore. Similarly the Others could use ice.

[Fun Guy from Yuggoth]

In Hindi nisa nisa means "eternal night" and "demoness of night" and aho means "day"

asura means "demon" and ahi means "serpent, dragon"

So azor ahai / asura ahi means "demon lord of the serpents" / "Vishnu's bed of Serpents"

and the word ahi is on the same page as ahriman "the Devil" and aheran "anvil" and aha "exclamation of pleasure, pain" and ahan means "to strike"

So Nisa Nisa is a personification of the Long Night, and Azor Ahai is a greenseer on a bed of serpents that married the Darkness, that is, caused the Long Night.  When the Day (aho) married the Night (nisa), Dawn no longer came, until he killed his wife with a flaming sword comet.  And Ahi is associated with being a Smith/anvil, and cries of anguish and ecstasy.  

and Ahi / Azhi Dahak is a three-headed dragon, and the Asura Ahi was Vritra, who stopped the flowing of rivers, and the Rhoyne stopped flowing during the Long Night.

 

Mazor Alexi

I just found out that mazar means "tomb, grave, shrine" and a-lok means "the other world, invisible, deserted, alone" and a-lakhsya means "invisible, unobserved" and a-laksani means "ill-fated, unlucky person" and a-lakh means "invisible, the ultimate being"  and a-lekh means "unknowable (like a deity)" and alokna means "to illuminate"

 

So the name "Mazor Alexi" suggests a greenseer hidden in a grave in the Other World all alone, and he is a god, and he brings the Light. 

But also, the Second Moon of planetos is Yuggoth / Yagalla / The Stranger / Nisa Nisa, and it is literally the Other World that is invisible because it absorbs all light, and it is a giant floating grave, as the names Yuggoth and Yagalla comes from the Gaelic word for "grave" uagh / uaige.  And in Hindi Yog means "conjunction of planets"

 

Huzor Amai

In Hindi user means "remembering with regret" and ami means "sweet one, darling"

User is on the same page as usra means "a ray of light, a bull" and usha (~Asha) means "dawn" and ushas means "dawn personified"

Which that all points to Ashara Dayne, a love lost who is remembered with regret, whose name is synonymous with Dawn.

 

If anyone is interested this website has a good hindi dictionary with phonetic english pronunciation.

[Vaith]

Some theories are that, if Huzor Amai lived later, he was trying to emulate the legacy of Azor Ahai or a multitude of mythological ancestors, by claiming descent from the Fisher Queens and being said to marry the daughters of the most important three tribes of Central Essos.

Another theory (that is not mutually exclusive) is that there is some linguistic connection. Bringing up Great Empire of the Dawn theory, Azor Ahai is often speculated to be from the proto-Valyrian or proto-Asshai'i culture (Azor Ahai does sound similar to Asshai itself!) And so there's a theory that the Sarnori were descendants of a tribe or clan who fled west after the Long Night and adopted the symbolism of the Fisher Queens and indigenous Central Essosi peoples. Some fans believe that the Sarnori may share an ancestral culture with the Dothraki and Jogos Nhai, with the Dothraki said in-verse to have come over the Bone Mountains, and the Jogos Nhai still living there. In any case, they may have all been part of the same realm, or stem from an ancestral culture.

[Sandy Clegg]

On 3/22/2022 at 3:12 PM, By Odin's Beard said:

When the Day (aho) married the Night (nisa), Dawn no longer came, until he killed his wife with a flaming sword comet. 

This fascinates me as a concept. I was wondering whether “day marrying the night” might be a poetic way of describing mists, which we find mentioned a lot connected with the city of Braavos. Could there be some connection there?