Black Crow Posted November 6, 2021 Author Share Posted November 6, 2021 Of course it could also have been a tactful euphimism for Bob being hung over after celebrating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tucu Posted November 6, 2021 Share Posted November 6, 2021 17 minutes ago, Black Crow said: Of course it could also have been a tactful euphimism for Bob being hung over after celebrating "No maiden left behind" was his personal motto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey family reunion Posted November 6, 2021 Share Posted November 6, 2021 On 11/5/2021 at 11:59 AM, Black Crow said: OK... finally got around to looking at the video, which seems a touch dodgy to me in terms of canon, but be that as it may, it looks to me as Ser Arthur was struck down by someone - not necessarily Lord Eddard - and that while he was lying wounded, Ned finished him off with a misericorde dagger Misericorde (weapon) - Wikipedia What I'd be more wary of is the statement that having polished off Ser Arthur, Lord Eddard found something in the tower... Yea, I agree the video was saying that Arthur Dayne had already been stabbed with the dagger. I don't think, however, that these are new videos for the upcoming HBO prequel series, despite the title of the videos. I think that these are extras from the HBO original series' dvd's. If you look at the artwork on the video, it shows the same ridiculously big square tower that served as the Tower of Joy in the HBO series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 On 11/6/2021 at 2:10 PM, Frey family reunion said: Yea, I agree the video was saying that Arthur Dayne had already been stabbed with the dagger. I don't think, however, that these are new videos for the upcoming HBO prequel series, despite the title of the videos. I think that these are extras from the HBO original series' dvd's. If you look at the artwork on the video, it shows the same ridiculously big square tower that served as the Tower of Joy in the HBO series. This sounds right to me. The narrator's seem to be original cast members and the artistic style is the same. So were they produced for GoT with the view that they might be used as background material for that series? Perhaps with the intention of releasing them with Winds of Winter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 26 minutes ago, LynnS said: This sounds right to me. The narrator's seem to be original cast members and the artistic style is the same. So were they produced for GoT with the view that they might be used as background material for that series? Perhaps with the intention of releasing them with Winds of Winter? How do you stab someone in the back if they are wearing plate armor? Unless, they are not fully armored. Chain Mail? Something a misericorde blade could penetrate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Crow Posted November 7, 2021 Author Share Posted November 7, 2021 16 hours ago, Frey family reunion said: I don't think, however, that these are new videos for the upcoming HBO prequel series, despite the title of the videos. I think that these are extras from the HBO original series' dvd's. If you look at the artwork on the video, it shows the same ridiculously big square tower that served as the Tower of Joy in the HBO series. Yes I noticed that and it's another reason why I doubted whether this can be regarded as canon. Its also worth remembering after all the arguments and posturing over the old watchtower, that GRRM has never said anything about Lord Eddard finding anything or anyone inside. The fight and the discovery of a dying Lyanna are clearly associated in the dream, but as GRRM was at pains to point out, dreams are not literal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 I guess the question is how much weight do we want to give to these background addendum? Are they canon, semi-canon? I recall looking at some of these histories when Blood Moon was in development and I seem to recall Martin discussing the series in an article where he said the Wall dated back 10,000 years. I'll see if I can find it again. I don't imagine that any of these histories released with the dvd's were developed by anyone other than Martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Crow Posted November 7, 2021 Author Share Posted November 7, 2021 18 minutes ago, LynnS said: How do you stab someone in the back if they are wearing plate armor? Unless, they are not fully armored. Chain Mail? Something a misericorde blade could penetrate? Misericorde blades are very strong, sometimes triangular in section like early bayonets, and are designed to be forced through mail or the gaps between steel plates. The flat disk at the top of the pommel is there to help this thrust or even to aid it being hammered in. Traditionally the eye slit in a close-helm was regarded as a good place to drive it in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 4 minutes ago, Black Crow said: Misericorde blades are very strong, sometimes triangular in section like early bayonets, and are designed to be forced through mail or the gaps between steel plates. The flat disk at the top of the pommel is there to help this thrust or even to aid it being hammered in. Traditionally the eye slit in a close-helm was regarded as a good place to drive it in That's interesting. My guess is that Arthur was only wearing chain mail and he was stabbed in the back. Possibly by Howland to stop Arthur from killing Ned. That seems probable to me given what Ned said about Howland. [I'm also conscious that Arya's sword is designed to do the same thing as a misericorde blade.] I'm also of the mind that nobody else was at the tower of joy. How do we reconcile the information that there is a family tree somewhere that reveals that Lyanna died at the ToJ? Arthur says "now it begins." Ned says "now it ends." So whatever was driving Eddard ended with the death of the 3KG, the only remaining hold-outs of the last regime. The end of the war is the point where it ends regarding Lyanna as far as Ned is concerned. It's the point where he can actually grieve for her. He doesn't do that until he returns to Robert after the ToJ. So the ToJ is where she 'died' for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asongofheresy Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 I don't think the video information should be taken as book canon, not until TWOW is released and we have more information about ToJ, but they can be count as show canon maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alienarea Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, asongofheresy said: I don't think the video information should be taken as book canon, not until TWOW is released and we have more information about ToJ, but they can be count as show canon maybe. Show canon is about as canon as my crackpots. Maybe less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 Interesting opinion about the cancellation of Bloodmmon/The Longest Night: No dragons prior to 5,000 years past? Game of Thrones: George R.R. Martin reveals 5 new facts about HBO's prequel | EW.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 Game of thrones prequel - House Stark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 House Stark prequel #2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asongofheresy Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 2 hours ago, alienarea said: Show canon is about as canon as my crackpots. Maybe less. I seperate show from books, like how I would seperate a manga from anime adaptation, the information from the video may make sense based on show universe, but it may not mean much for the books. Unrelated but I have found out there is a religion/deity in asoiaf called Pattern, the importance of patterns in the book is definitely shown this way. An edit, remember Daenerys' Mysha scene? She is called "mother" in different languages, Aelalla, Maella, Tato, and one is Qathei, I just realised how the last one resembles Quaithe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 This might speak to the question posed in the OP: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 I can't find anything else on Bloomoon; except for this bit... which makes me laugh, ever since Frey Family Reunion found it: Quote Westeros isn't on Earth—it may be a little larger, George R.R. Martin has speculated—but it does have a single moon, similar to ours. In the A Song of Ice and Fire books, the moon over Westeros goes through phases, like ours, and casts pale moonlight. In Qarth, where Daenerys visited the House of the Undying in Game of Thrones Season 2, many believe that there were once two moons, until the dragons hatched from the second of the planet's satellites. But there's nothing in ASOIAF lore about a bloodmoon. 'Game of Thrones' Prequel Series Starts Filming, But What's a Bloodmoon? (newsweek.com) Of course there is a blood moon in DwD: Quote A Dance with Dragons - Tyrion VIII Only the brightest stars were visible, all to the west. A dull red glow lit the sky to the northeast, the color of a blood bruise. Tyrion had never seen a bigger moon. Monstrous, swollen, it looked as if it had swallowed the sun and woken with a fever. Its twin, floating on the sea beyond the ship, shimmered red with every wave. "What hour is this?" he asked Moqorro. "That cannot be sunrise unless the east has moved. Why is the sky red?" I still get a kick out of this find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey family reunion Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 5 hours ago, LynnS said: This sounds right to me. The narrator's seem to be original cast members and the artistic style is the same. So were they produced for GoT with the view that they might be used as background material for that series? Perhaps with the intention of releasing them with Winds of Winter? I could be wrong but I think that youtube channel is just a fan channel. I don't think it's officially tied in with either GRRM or HBO. Someone is just uploading HBO's extras from the original series. So I think it's cannon as much as the original series was. Which is to say, not really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LynnS Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 26 minutes ago, Frey family reunion said: I could be wrong but I think that youtube channel is just a fan channel. I don't think it's officially tied in with either GRRM or HBO. Someone is just uploading HBO's extras from the original series. So I think it's cannon as much as the original series was. Which is to say, not really. Yah I don't know how much weight to give it. You realize that you were the only person to recognize a blood moon in the books! Apparently, according to the article I quoted; no such thing has shown up in the books. What follows the blood moon eclipse is the 'longest night'... This really makes me chuckle when I think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asongofheresy Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 I have tried to look for word play from the name of Qauithe before, and applying the same logic to a similar word, Qathei, gives me the qai now unfortunately qai has no meaning in English, but its one of the ways to write a Turkic tribes name, Kayı tribe is one of the 24 Oghuz Turkish tribes, the word means wory, and its symbol is IYI with the Turkic runes, the symbol shows a ceremony where the person in middle are presented with two cups, as Daenerys was told in Qarth, these could be cups of ice and fire in our story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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