Blackfyre & Dark Sister

[The Answer]

Good Evening from Philadelphia!

First post in over 5 years but couldn't resist getting a little Dark Sister/Blackfyre whereabouts conversation ignited after finishing Fire & Blood. It's been discussed before but I didn't see a thread which had not been archived, so here we are..

Blackfyre

I'm convinced it's in Young Griff's possession and I'm excited about it. I'm excited because I like to think he is actually Aegon and honestly depending upon how he does it l, wouldn't mind seeing him run the show when all is said and done. 

Dark Sister

I'm convinced it's in the cave with Bloodraven and Bran. Possible landing spots for DS I would love to see in order:

1. BR > Bran > Jon > Arya

2. BR > Bran > Jon (Longclaw given to either Jorah, Tormund, Mance, or Ed)

3. BR > Meera

I don't see Dany/Dark Sister happening, but if it did, my dream wildcard would be:

Dany > Barristan

I suppose this is actually a slim possibility if Meera were given the sword and fell in battle either against the White Walkers, or in a 7 kingdoms battle(Ramsay). If Dany/Barristan were to align with Jon for a common cause, Barristan could get his hands on DS after all.

Would love to hear any new/recycled theories!

 

[The hairy bear]

I think that it's not unlikely that Jon ends with Blackfyre and Dany ends with Dark Sister.* Specially if the two become a couple and lay a claim to the Iron Throne.

*I'm aware a Valyrian steel word would be lost on a non-fighter like Dany, but in terms of propaganda the optics would be amazing, and that would be more important than some edge in battle.

[TheLastWolf]

@Curled Finger Good ol' days huh? Miss the old crowd.

Spoiler

Rightfully it must come from 10 yr experienced members, not 1.something, but hey, I spent so much time here then I practically lived here

CF is the authority on Valyrian steel and I'm just a giddy fanboy, but IMO these can be clarified only if/when Winds/Dream come out

[Alexis-something-Rose]

I don't think YG has Blackfyre and I think that Dark Sister has been hidden away in Winterfell's crypts.

[Jaenara Belarys]

6 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

I don't think YG has Blackfyre and I think that Dark Sister has been hidden away in Winterfell's crypts.

So we can have the magical unveiling of the "twu heir" born of Rhaegar and Lyanna's "twu wuv"? :\

 

It's more likely that it's at the Wall or in BR's cave. 

[The Answer]

I'm trying not to overthink things and hope GRRM is giving us very subtle yet obvious hints that will bear fruit. 

There's a ton of room for error with any Blackfyre prediction, but I'm going with Young Griff based on the conversation Tyrion overheard where "sword" was mentioned in another language.. and calling it a day. Plus it's last known whereabouts was in Essos.

Dark Sister seems more obvious, no? GRRM confirmed Bloodraven took Dark Sister to The Wall. The only way I could have seen it staying at The Wall is if BR entrusted Aemon with it, but he would have mentioned something to Sam before his death.  

I'm thinking the highest likelihood is Bran recieves it as a parting gift from BR when his training is complete, either to give to Jon or Meera. Where it ends up from there is to be determined. 

Oh no.. a terrifying landing spot for Dark Sister could be The Night King after defeating BR in a battle while he was Ranging with the NW.

 

[The hairy bear]

6 hours ago, The Answer said:

Oh no.. a terrifying landing spot for Dark Sister could be The Night King after defeating BR in a battle while he was Ranging with the NW.

 

The Night King doesn't exist in the book series. Is an invention of the tv monstruosity.

[The Answer]

2 hours ago, The hairy bear said:

The Night King doesn't exist in the book series. Is an invention of the tv monstruosity.

I've always envisioned the NK lurking up beyond the wall in the books, I find it hard to believe there's no leadership amongst those creatures.

For the sake of this thread being DS and Blackfyre specific, I'll change that NK wielding DS to any White Walker that was present and defeated Lord Commander Brynden Rivers during his ranging.

Imagine a late chapter of WoW ending with a POV character getting an up close encounter, possibly fighting a WW who has DS 

[Alexis-something-Rose]

11 hours ago, Jaenara Belarys said:

So we can have the magical unveiling of the "twu heir" born of Rhaegar and Lyanna's "twu wuv"? :\

I really hate these sorts of reply. Jon already has his own sword. And no, it's really got nothing to do with that. The Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North when BR is Lord Commander of the NW is a man whose mother was a Blackwood, so there are blood ties here. The sword would have been left there for safekeeping. 

And when BR leaves on his last ranging, he's a 77 year old man. I'm not sure that he was planning on returning to the Wall. The sword serves no purpose there.

[Jaenara Belarys]

2 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

I really hate these sorts of reply. Jon already has his own sword. And no, it's really got nothing to do with that. The Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North when BR is Lord Commander of the NW is a man whose mother was a Blackwood, so there are blood ties here. The sword would have been left there for safekeeping. 

 

Note that I did provide two alternate places for Dark Sister to be, as well. Also, I highly doubt the sitting Lord Stark would've been permitted to keep the last Targaryen ancestral sword, no matter the blood ties. 

2 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

And when BR leaves on his last ranging, he's a 77 year old man. I'm not sure that he was planning on returning to the Wall. The sword serves no purpose there.

True. Which makes it more likely it's in the cave IMO. 

[The Answer]

1 hour ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

The sword would have been left there for safekeeping. 

There's a whole lot of certainty in those words. 

1 hour ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

And when BR leaves on his last ranging, he's a 77 year old man. I'm not sure that he was planning on returning to the Wall. The sword serves no purpose there.

Imagine being one of the poor rangers accompanying LC BR on the range only to find out he left his piece at home.  Regardless of age, VS always serves a purpose.

[Curled Finger]

On 11/9/2021 at 11:41 AM, Alexis-something-Rose said:

I don't think YG has Blackfyre and I think that Dark Sister has been hidden away in Winterfell's crypts.

Interesting.   How do you reckon DS got to the crypts and why?   Go ahead amaze me like you always do.  

[Curled Finger]

On 11/8/2021 at 6:04 PM, The Answer said:

Blackfyre

I'm convinced it's in Young Griff's possession and I'm excited about it. I'm excited because I like to think he is actually Aegon and honestly depending upon how he does it l, wouldn't mind seeing him run the show when all is said and done. 

Dark Sister

I'm convinced it's in the cave with Bloodraven and Bran. Possible landing spots for DS I would love to see in order:

1. BR > Bran > Jon > Arya

2. BR > Bran > Jon (Longclaw given to either Jorah, Tormund, Mance, or Ed)

3. BR > Meera

I don't see Dany/Dark Sister happening, but if it did, my dream wildcard would be:

Dany > Barristan

I suppose this is actually a slim possibility if Meera were given the sword and fell in battle either against the White Walkers, or in a 7 kingdoms battle(Ramsay). If Dany/Barristan were to align with Jon for a common cause, Barristan could get his hands on DS after all.

Would love to hear any new/recycled theories!

 

I think we have a really good idea about YG having or finding out he has Blackfyre and it's hard to think beyond it.   After all this is a great idea and makes all sorts of thematic sense.    So what is Blackfyre?  The sword of Targaryan Kings or pretenders?  Where would it logically be if not back in Essos?  Unlikely as it seems, if YG does not in fact have BF I hope it shows up somewhere in the Red Keep.  It could even be Dragonstone, but why?  I will laugh myself silly if DS ends up in the icy crypts as noted above and BF is found under it's own castle of fire.  

I like what you've done explaining how your pieces end up with your heroes.  We largely agreee DS is in that creepy cave but we don't know this.   We only know DS went to the Wall with BR.   Is Bran's wanting to be a knight merged with Hodor foreshadowing or a red herring?  Of course, I only recently came around to the idea Arya would wield anything other than Needle and assumed Brandor would be a thing.   We win either way.  I like both scenarios.   

Last time I was posting we were talking about the curiosity that is Longclaw and one of our posters really got me seeing how this thing really could be ancestral Ice.  The only thing I am certain of is that Jorah will not get Longclaw back.  Circles back to Blackfyre and what it represents--the king or the mummer?  

[Alexis-something-Rose]

On 11/10/2021 at 9:57 AM, The Answer said:

There's a whole lot of certainty in those words. 

Just speculating like everyone else. If BR knew he wasn't going back to the Wall and there are no plans for Bran to leave if we go by what Coldhands told Sam ("The world believes the boy is dead," his rescuer had said as they parted. "Let his bones lie undisturbed. We want no seekers coming after us.) then why take Dark Sister with him at all if it's going to stay dormant. 

Aegon had three sons and one of them was a soldier. So what

On 11/10/2021 at 9:57 AM, The Answer said:

Imagine being one of the poor rangers accompanying LC BR on the range only to find out he left his piece at home.  Regardless of age, VS always serves a purpose.

I think one of those poor suckers may be Coldhands. Wouldn't the sword have served a purpose if he had been allowed to carry it when he was escorting Bran to the cave? If Valyrian steel does in fact work against the Others and Bran is this really important piece of the puzzle, then why not arm the guy sent to get him?

2 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

Interesting.   How do you reckon DS got to the crypts and why?   Go ahead amaze me like you always do.  

It's nothing complicated, really. I think it's just there for safekeeping. BR left it in the care of his kinsman. Also, it's been a while. Hope you're well

On 11/10/2021 at 9:56 AM, Jaenara Belarys said:

Note that I did provide two alternate places for Dark Sister to be, as well. Also, I highly doubt the sitting Lord Stark would've been permitted to keep the last Targaryen ancestral sword, no matter the blood ties. 

Egg had three sons. And he could have given the sword to any of them. But for some reason, he allowed BR, a man he sent to the Wall, to take the last Valyrian steel sword to the Wall. The Targaryens don't need to know anything about the sword. All they know is that BR left the Wall on a ranging and never returned and would assume that the sword was lost with him. 

Anyway . . .

[TheLastWolf]

4 hours ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

7 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

Interesting.   How do you reckon DS got to the crypts and why?   Go ahead amaze me like you always do.  

It's nothing complicated, really. I think it's just there for safekeeping. BR left it in the care of his kinsman. Also, it's been a while. Hope you're well

Historically after the Conquest, the GoT has been played the least by the North, especially the Starks. Simple 'savages'. Torren didn't bend the knee to Aegon by being hot headed. No recklessness barring Brandon the fool. So if Darksister might cause unwanted trouble being left with anybody else, and as LC of NW, BR would surely have kept the blade in the crypts. That is if he was anti-White Walker/Wights/Others. But my personal theory is that he became pro-COTF and all things beyond the Wall

[BlackLightning]

On 11/10/2021 at 5:52 AM, The Answer said:

I've always envisioned the NK lurking up beyond the wall in the books, I find it hard to believe there's no leadership amongst those creatures.

I agree.

Especially in light of the Night's King story in which the 13th Lord Commander of the Watch married an Other (which means the Others are not sexless) and the two proceeded to rule as king and queen for a time

Then again, if there is no leadership, then the Others must be operate off of a hive mind

I seriously doubt that the Others would be necromantic, icy, super-powered versions of Orcs

On 11/10/2021 at 5:52 AM, The Answer said:

For the sake of this thread being DS and Blackfyre specific, I'll change that NK wielding DS to any White Walker that was present and defeated Lord Commander Brynden Rivers during his ranging.

Imagine a late chapter of WoW ending with a POV character getting an up close encounter, possibly fighting a WW who has DS 

On the real, I always thought that the prologue, epilogue or last few chapters of Winds will feature Stannis and/or Brienne going toe-to-toe with an Other at the Nightfort or something right before the Wall falls

I think Daenerys might not end up with Dark Sister. I think Dark Sister is beyond the Wall in the cave.

I think Daenerys will end up with Rhaenys' missing Valyrian steel sword which was lost in Dorne. I think this is the case because I think Daenerys and most of her forces will establish a beachfront for their invasion/rescue-mission in Dorne rather than Dragonstone.