Covid 19 #43: Oh Omicron, oh Omicron, how numerous are thy spike proteins.

[Mlle. Zabzie]

16 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

That’s not the case for everyone. I’m not sure what the point of that article is.

Kind of agree?  Again, my sister (vaxed and boosted) just had an asymptomatic bout with Covid….But I think the point of the article is threefold (1) someone is sharing that getting vaxed and boosted does not guarantee smooth sailing (but imagine what it would be without the immune help), (2) it allows the writer to process their bad experience and (3) it is popular because it feeds into people’s anxiety management strategies.  

 

Anyhow, wrong thread for it, given the audience, but go get vaccinated, or if you are already vaccinated, go get boosted.  Wear your mask.  Try to find rapid tests and use them wisely.  Invest in a limited number of high value social interactions, with appropriate precautions, assuming you are otherwise healthy, if and as necessary for your mental health.

[mormont]

46 minutes ago, Fury Resurrected said:

What we really need is a huge supply of free rapid home tests available to everyone. I test weekly because I work closely with the public in physical contact, but that’s not accessible to everyone (and it’s very expensive for me). If everyone were doing regular testing and testing for any respiratory symptoms, we’d be in a lot better place

It is nothing short of insane, in public policy terms, for any country not to be giving out free LFTs. Quite apart from controlling the spread, it gives you so much vital data. The cost is nothing in comparison to the value. 

Fury, you test weekly? I test like 2-3 times a week and I'm barely meeting anyone outside my close family and a handful of work colleagues. But then I can pick up a pack of 7 tests every time I go to work, and order more online. I have a couple of dozen tests in the house right now. I have my customer facing staff testing every day they come to work, and if they don't have tests we give them one when they get in.

[Zorral]

We can't find any home tests around here.  We have about 4? - 5? here, gotten quite prior to Omicron.  But slightly prior to the official arrival of Omicron we stopped all f2f socializing of all kinds, other than all being outside. Vaxxed and boosted, of course.  We're still going to buy our own groceries, but lordessa, how much longer?  With the coming of Omicron the customers and the people working at our supermarket just threw out all the protocols.

 

[Clueless Northman]

1 hour ago, Impmk2 said:

Also interesting that loss of taste doesn't appear to be as common a symptom of Omicron infection (none reported in the above). As the mechanism behind loss of taste is thought to be basically the stripping of the epithelium from around taste receptors it's possibly another data point towards decreased tissue damage / severity.

Which would be very good because it increases the odds that long-covid will be far less common as well, if indeed Omicron mostly sticks with upper tract and acts closer to the other coronaviruses that hit us frequently. I didn't expect such a jump to be made at once, but to see it more gradually over several variants and a few years - and seeing Delta, it was quite depressing because it kept being worse than other variants on all counts. Well, if Delta (and all other nasty variants around) is fully wiped out and replaced with Omicron, however violent it might actually be, I'm still going to say Good fucking riddance.

That it's more frequent and caught more often with kids and people under 30 wouldn't be a surprise if indeed it is morphing into the more common form of respiratory virus we know about. It would've been surprising if it would still be widely asymptomatic on the younger end of the age scale - as long as it's just typical mild symptoms, and I don't mean "mild" in the "not-mild-at-all" epidemiological sense obviously, I'd rate the writer of the Gothamist's article Zorral posted at "moderate" personally.

2 hours ago, rotting sea cow said:

I'm having the strong feeling that by the end of February we will largely done with this shit, but first we need to endure some few hard weeks/months and the circus that the response has become.

End of February might even be a tad pessimistic - cases will drop down before end of January, I think, though considering how high they'll be, it might indeed take a month to drop down to truly low levels. Then we'll have to hope no other variant will come knocking.

8 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

But this is all useless because as I just said, a). they’re easing restrictions during an outbreak right now before they know what we’ll happen and b). they’re doing it for the unvaccinated as well.

B is totally stupid as far as I'm concerned: unvaccinated still face a higher risk. On the other hand, as a soon-to-be-boosted person, I'm pretty pissed off to still see alleged obligations of isolation or test in case of "close contact", lengthy quarantine in case of covid, no matter the presence of symptoms or their length, and numerous testing obligations. Seriously, fuck that, specially considering that PCR-test can label you as "infectious" for weeks even though you never were a threat to any vaccinated person. As soon as I'll get my 3rd dose, I'll consider having done my civic duties for this pandemic and be fully over with them, at least until a nastier vaccine-evading variant pops up. I've masked all along (as soon as I could get some), I've social-distanced, I missed 2 aunts' funerals because of this fucking mess, I've worked from home for months and it nearly cost me my health, I've booked my 3 doses as soon as I could get them. I've done my part as a honest and law-abiding citizen. After the 4th of January, I'll be fully done with this crap and I'll merely stick to the reasonable and realistic measures - masking in stores, public transport, theatres, museums, and self rapid test at home in case of cold-like symptomes and official testing if I gets nastier symptomes like serious fever, heavy nasty cough or breathing issue. For the rest, the authorities will have to go fuck themselves and mess with the unvaxxed, for once, if they want to be useful at long last, something they've never been back in February or October 2020.

[Varysblackfyre321]

10 hours ago, Clueless Northman said:

As for unvaccinated, they obviously have to be subjected to harsher restrictions than any vaccinated person, as far as I'm concerned there's just no debate to be had on that point. I've always been for mandatory vaccines and as far as I'm concerned I would put them all under house arrest until twice vaccinated, and if this is legally not possible in some countries, then go for vaccine pass everywhere, not just restaurants but all public transports, places and all stores. They've been fucking us up since March 2020 never complying with any measure or restriction, so I'm done playing nice with them.

True. If your jackass won’t bite a carrot to get moving time to whip it’s ass.

The only way many people are going to act responsibly for themselves and others is for them to be mandated to, to be threatened with exclusion. There will be whining but the jackasses for the most part will get moving.

[kairparavel]

So great!

Quote

Washington, D.C., is experiencing a major pandemic surge — making it the highest-risk place for COVID-19 infection in the nation.

D.C. experienced an average of 1,192 new cases per day over the past seven days, and 169 cases per 100,000 people as of Monday, according to data from the Center for Systems Science and Engineering at Johns Hopkins University.

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/28/1068417547/the-nations-capital-is-the-worst-place-for-covid-19-infections-right-now

DC started handing out rapid tests at 8 public library branches beginning last Wednesday - 2 lots per person per day, DC residents with ID only. So there's that I guess. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Clueless Northman said:

B is totally stupid as far as I'm concerned: unvaccinated still face a higher risk. On the other hand, as a soon-to-be-boosted person, I'm pretty pissed off to still see alleged obligations of isolation or test in case of "close contact", lengthy quarantine in case of covid, no matter the presence of symptoms or their length, and numerous testing obligations. Seriously, fuck that, specially considering that PCR-test can label you as "infectious" for weeks even though you never were a threat to any vaccinated person. As soon as I'll get my 3rd dose, I'll consider having done my civic duties for this pandemic and be fully over with them, at least until a nastier vaccine-evading variant pops up. I've masked all along (as soon as I could get some), I've social-distanced, I missed 2 aunts' funerals because of this fucking mess, I've worked from home for months and it nearly cost me my health, I've booked my 3 doses as soon as I could get them. I've done my part as a honest and law-abiding citizen. After the 4th of January, I'll be fully done with this crap and I'll merely stick to the reasonable and realistic measures - masking in stores, public transport, theatres, museums, and self rapid test at home in case of cold-like symptomes and official testing if I gets nastier symptomes like serious fever, heavy nasty cough or breathing issue. For the rest, the authorities will have to go fuck themselves and mess with the unvaxxed, for once, if they want to be useful at long last, something they've never been back in February or October 2020.

This is preciously why the virus is going to win. Now the people who've done everything right, like you and I, are starting to give up. I felt a bit guilty booking an eight day trip to Cali for Thanksgiving. When I got back I was ready to book another shorter trip to LA and then a week in Hawaii. You only live once, right? I work in a fucking hospital, do you not think I am beyond sick of this shit? 

But the truth is there's a very good chance the virus is going to continue to spread and mutate, immunities from vaccines and boosters will probably have diminishing returns and it's possible that because of our inaction we're going to eventually be met with a strain that we can't mitigate or control at all. People cannot just throw up there hands and just say whatever happens, happens. Vigilance is important and we'll still need to be willing to accept some sacrifices. Frankly that last sentence brings me back to a question I've asked myself for a long time: Could those today handle the rations required during WW2? My guess is no. 

[Larry of the Lawn]

17 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

This is preciously why the virus is going to win. Now the people who've done everything right, like you and I, are starting to give up. I felt a bit guilty booking an eight day trip to Cali for Thanksgiving. When I got back I was ready to book another shorter trip to LA and then a week in Hawaii. You only live once, right? I work in a fucking hospital, do you not think I am beyond sick of this shit? 

But the truth is there's a very good chance the virus is going to continue to spread and mutate, immunities from vaccines and boosters will probably have diminishing returns and it's possible that because of our inaction we're going to eventually be met with a strain that we can't mitigate or control at all. People cannot just throw up there hands and just say whatever happens, happens. Vigilance is important and we'll still need to be willing to accept some sacrifices. Frankly that last sentence brings me back to a question I've asked myself for a long time: Could those today handle the rations required during WW2? My guess is no. 

What's the bolded based on?  

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

17 minutes ago, Lermo T.I. Krrrammpus said:

What's the bolded based on?  

For the first line, we need to face the reality that we're probably going to have to get multiple shots each year for the foreseeable future, and I've heard a lot of doctors say there's a real chance they'll become less effective over time. For the second, please include that I said possible, because I do think it's possible we encounter a strain that's deadlier than what we've seen so far. Hopefully not, but it is possible. 

[The Anti-Targ]

9 hours ago, Fury Resurrected said:

What we really need is a huge supply of free rapid home tests available to everyone. I test weekly because I work closely with the public in physical contact, but that’s not accessible to everyone (and it’s very expensive for me). If everyone were doing regular testing and testing for any respiratory symptoms, we’d be in a lot better place

Depends on your reason for testing, but weekly is not nearly often enough to control spread, esp with Omicron where you can catch it the day you test yourself, be infections less than 2 days later and be going about spreading it for 5 days before your next test. If you want to not be a person who has spread omicron you basically have to test daily.

First omicron leak out of quarantine here (in Auckland, so not here where I live) today. A person who arrived in the country on 16 Dec, was released from quarantine on 26 December per usual, but was required to self-isolate until their day 9 test result came through. But they went out partying the day they got out. They are fully vaxed so they qualified to enter bars and nightclubs with a vax pass, which will be the most crowded social places in Auckland. Fortunately as long as there were no cheaters or the venue operators were not being slack, everyone they possibly exposed will have been vaxed. But still, with enough people exposed it will not prevent breakthrough infection in a few people. They were negative on day 3 and 5 of their quarantine stay. There is some speculation that they might have been exposed to omicron while in quarantine.

Very selfish to have flouted the self-isolation requirement, govt might need to rethink allowing a short period of self-isolation if people can't be trusted. But then again, if this infection happened while in quarantine then someone will eventually get infected late in their stay, no matter how long they are in quarantine and bring omicron into the community.

[The Marquis de Leech]

Aforementioned self-isolation violator is... an international DJ, brought in for summer festivals.

Only in New Zealand.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

CDC Director Walensky was interviewed this morning and she addressed some of the topics addressed over the last few days. My takeaway from it was basically YOLO, full honor system after you test positive and there's no plan going forward to test aggressively like other countries are.

[DireWolfSpirit]

Michigan had a testing center at at least one rest area that I passed on its major North/South Interstate (I-75).

Great location, great timing to catch a lot of holiday travel and help limit virus spread.

[Larry of the Lawn]

53 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

CDC Director Walensky was interviewed this morning and she addressed some of the topics addressed over the last few days. My takeaway from it was basically YOLO, full honor system after you test positive and there's no plan going forward to test aggressively like other countries are.

Absolutely hilarious in a "people are going to keep dying" kind of way that Biden is pretty much just Trump when it comes to covid response.  

[rotting sea cow]

6 minutes ago, Lermo T.I. Krrrammpus said:

Absolutely hilarious in a "people are going to keep dying" kind of way that Biden is pretty much just Trump when it comes to covid response.  

Don't you have elections next year? Then, Biden definitively want this to be over by Easter, like a miracle. Doing something, anything will only prolong the pandemic. Maybe doing nothing will do the job?

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Lermo T.I. Krrrammpus said:

Absolutely hilarious in a "people are going to keep dying" kind of way that Biden is pretty much just Trump when it comes to covid response.  

The continued need to appease those who are exacerbating the problem is astonishing. These half measures are just eyewash.

[Jaxom 1974]

1 hour ago, Tywin et al. said:

The continued need to appease those who are exacerbating the problem is astonishing. These half measures are just eyewash.

If, by "eyewash", you mean jalapeno juice...then yes...

 

[Fury Resurrected]

18 hours ago, mormont said:

It is nothing short of insane, in public policy terms, for any country not to be giving out free LFTs. Quite apart from controlling the spread, it gives you so much vital data. The cost is nothing in comparison to the value. 

Fury, you test weekly? I test like 2-3 times a week and I'm barely meeting anyone outside my close family and a handful of work colleagues. But then I can pick up a pack of 7 tests every time I go to work, and order more online. I have a couple of dozen tests in the house right now. I have my customer facing staff testing every day they come to work, and if they don't have tests we give them one when they get in.

Oh I know and I’d like to test more however unless I have time to drive 20 minutes each way before work (I don’t), these tests in the US are expensive (about $30 for a box of 2) and in such low supply they are hard to obtain. Hence my complaint that this country doesn’t even contain enough tests for people to be testing responsibly much less have them and have them freely accessible. I am also the only one of my colleagues who is testing any time other than when having respiratory symptoms. My sister is a nurse and she is not even provided with testing. And that’s why shits so fucked here.

[Clueless Northman]

15 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

This is preciously why the virus is going to win. Now the people who've done everything right, like you and I, are starting to give up.

Well, it's been clear for a long time that the real reaslitic end-game was this coronavirus going the way of the other, becoming just another cold that screws up upper respiratory tract for a few days, and it's over. Omicron with vaccinated people is basically this, though the current wave will bring a lot of trouble and disruptions obviously, and hospitals are still half-full with unvaxxed hit with Delta.

15 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

a question I've asked myself for a long time: Could those today handle the rations required during WW2? My guess is no. 

Unvaxxed wouldn't, that's obvious. But that's the thing: it is a prisoners' dilemma: vaxxed people have done all the sacrifices for 20 months, now fuck the sociopathic freeloaders, it's time to throw them under the bus. They've been playing the WW2 collaborationist game with this pandemic for too long while most of the people suffered silently under trestrictions that were mostly there due to these scumbags. We would handle WW2 rationing if everybody played fair, but our treacherous political leaders made sure the unvaxxed wouldn't have to account for their anti-social behaviour.

18 hours ago, mormont said:

It is nothing short of insane, in public policy terms, for any country not to be giving out free LFTs. Quite apart from controlling the spread, it gives you so much vital data. The cost is nothing in comparison to the value. 

That would've been my strategy when LFTs first became widely available. Nowadays though, it really seems that a lot of Omicron cases aren't detected by LFTs and are only found out by PCR testing - even cases with symptoms like runny noses or moderate fever. Previously, testing made a lot of sense, but right now, I fear it won't help much anymore. So many PCR tests would be required, it's probably best not to give much weight to negative LFTs and to prioritize PCRTs for vulnerable, older, immuno-suppressed or unvaccinated people - granted, the latter might already cover too wide a scope in some places.

[Mlle. Zabzie]

8 minutes ago, Fury Resurrected said:

Oh I know and I’d like to test more however unless I have time to drive 20 minutes each way before work (I don’t), these tests in the US are expensive (about $30 for a box of 2) and in such low supply they are hard to obtain. Hence my complaint that this country doesn’t even contain enough tests for people to be testing responsibly much less have them and have them freely accessible. I am also the only one of my colleagues who is testing any time other than when having respiratory symptoms. My sister is a nurse and she is not even provided with testing. And that’s why shits so fucked here.

1.  I have had good luck at Walmart.com.  It has been my most reliable source - earlier this month I was able to get Binax now for $14/2 test kit.  Everything is obviously backed up now.

2.  You are absolutely 1,000% right.  The number of people I know right now with asymptomatic infections in NYC is staggering.  They tested because they were notified of an exposure, and then boom, found out they were positive.  They would have had NO IDEA that they were a carrier without a test.  On the one hand, this shows that Omicron (because it is very likely to be omicron) is incredibly contagious.  It also shows that vaccines do, in fact work!  (This is a highly vaccinated, self-selecting subset).  But if we had good access to testing, I bet a bunch more positives would pop up.

3.  This is why I am thinking absent a full PRC-style lockdown, I do not see how we do anything at this point, at least in major metro areas, other than tap the brakes a little, and frankly, I think it’s probably too late to tap the brakes, at least in NYC.  It’s going to be a bad two weeks.  That’s not giving up - it’s just facing facts.