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How was Tywin going to sort out the inheritance issue?


Falcon2909
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- His eldest son Jaime is a sworn member of the KG so he cannot succeed Tywin and inherit casterly rock

- Cersei being a woman cannot inherit casterly rock

- He explicitly tells Tyrion he won't inherit the rock

 

This man, who is concerned about his legacy...who did he decide it was going to?

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Tywin never gave up on Jaime.

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You have important letters, yes.” Tyrion rose on unsteady legs, closed his eyes for an instant as a wave of dizziness washed over him, and took a shaky step toward the door. Later, he would reflect that he should have taken a second, and then a third. Instead he turned. “What do I want, you ask? I’ll tell you what I want. I want what is mine by rights. I want Casterly Rock.” His father’s mouth grew hard.

“Your brother’s birthright?”

 

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No doubt his will (if he had a written one) would have left almost everything he had to Jamie. Everyone would promptly laugh at it and him before begrudgingly handing it over to Tyrion since legally he was the heir even if Tywin never recognised it.

To be honest once's Tywin's dead his own plans for succession matter less than what is capable of happening both by the law and by the power of the individuals involved. Tywin really wanted Jamie to inherit Casterly Rock. But unless upon Tywin's death someone was willing to break you know the formal precedent that the Kingsguard serve for life again (and Jamie seems keen on that incident being a one off) and Jamie was willing to have a go at being Lord of the Westerlands (that again would be a no) then it wouldn't happen.

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Tywin was the quintessential grandiose narcissist, he would do whatever it took to make him/his legacy look good. And that could mean trying to get Jaime to quit the KG again and forcing him to marry, or leave the Rock to one of Tommen and Margery's children. He would adapt as needed to make himself look good.

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Being  a woman does not automatically prevent Cersei from assuming Casterly Rock. Being the Queen makes it politically unwieldly, but she was perfectly eligible under the rules of primogeniture as it appears the Lannisters practice.  She would just fall in line behind her male siblings, but ahead of her father's brothers. 

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After Tywin died, no one tried to stand in Cersei’s way of claiming Casterly Rock; Kevan even urged her to take up her seat. Tywin was in denial that Jaime wouldn’t succeed him, and hadn’t done much of anything to change that in the twenty years since he joined the Kingsguard. If Tywin had died before Joffrey, CR would have passed to Tyrion and no one would have stopped it from happening.

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9 hours ago, Terrorthatflapsinthenight9 said:

He was still hoping that Jaime would leave the Kingsguard, it was only during Jaime's return in KL during ASOS when Jaime made it clear that he was a knight of the Kingsguard above all that Tywin finally realized that Jaime wasn't going to leave the Kingsguard and disavowed him.

 

9 hours ago, Arthur Peres said:

Tywin never gave up on Jaime.

 

How was Jaime going to leave the KG anyway? Its a sacred oath , its a lifelong duty like the NW.  I think perhaps the only way to make him leave the KG would be Tywin asking the High Septon's permission 

Edited by Falcon2909
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4 hours ago, Daena the Defiant said:

Being  a woman does not automatically prevent Cersei from assuming Casterly Rock. Being the Queen makes it politically unwieldly, but she was perfectly eligible under the rules of primogeniture as it appears the Lannisters practice.  She would just fall in line behind her male siblings, but ahead of her father's brothers. 

If she inherit the rocks then she becomes the lady of CR and the head of the house. and if she re-marries someone (like a marbrand) and has kids, would her children carry the lannister name or marbrand name?

4 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

After Tywin died, no one tried to stand in Cersei’s way of claiming Casterly Rock; Kevan even urged her to take up her seat. Tywin was in denial that Jaime wouldn’t succeed him, and hadn’t done much of anything to change that in the twenty years since he joined the Kingsguard. If Tywin had died before Joffrey, CR would have passed to Tyrion and no one would have stopped it from happening.

good point!

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Twyin was in denial. He still seemed stuck to Jaime being his heir despite the fact that Kingsguard serve for life. And Barristan's release gave him the chance he wanted. 

After Jaime every possible choice could be considered: Tommen, a Cersei-Willas child since he said he would give Tyrion Winterfell if he had a child with Sansa.

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33 minutes ago, Falcon2909 said:

 

How was Jaime going to leave the KG anyway? Its a sacred oath , its a lifelong duty like the NW.  I think perhaps the only way to make him leave the KG would be Tywin asking the High Septon's permission 

No doubt that Tywin thought he could have given him a pardon or have Joffrey give him one. After all Jaime was pardonned for having violated his oath by betraying and killing Aerys.

Besides it wouldn't have been the only time that Jaime broke this sacred oath when he attacked Ned Stark and went to join his father to attack the Riverlands.

And sacred never mattered much to Tywin anyway, how can you expect someone who did the actions that he did directly or indirectly such as the Rains of Castamere, the sack of King's Landing, Tysha's gang rape and ruin of her marriage with Tyrion and the Red Wedding to care about sacred oaths ?

Edited by Terrorthatflapsinthenight9
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1 hour ago, Falcon2909 said:

If she inherit the rocks then she becomes the lady of CR and the head of the house. and if she re-marries someone (like a marbrand) and has kids, would her children carry the lannister name or marbrand name?

5 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

It depends on the husband I guess, someone equal to her like a Tully or Arryn would keep his name, but a vassal would probably take her name, this has already happened. The Lannisters were a house of first man, until Joffrey Lyden married the only heiress and took her name, making House Lannisters an andal house.

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1 hour ago, Falcon2909 said:

How was Jaime going to leave the KG anyway? Its a sacred oath , its a lifelong duty like the NW.  I think perhaps the only way to make him leave the KG would be Tywin asking the High Septon's permission 

 So it is the guest right, and marriage and Tywin was more than fine with violating it senseless by helping the Freys plan it and raping his daughter in law. He does not care about rules sacred or man made, only his wishes.

 

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19 hours ago, Arthur Peres said:

 So it is the guest right, and marriage and Tywin was more than fine with violating it senseless by helping the Freys plan it and raping his daughter in law. He does not care about rules sacred or man made, only his wishes.

 

Tywin definitely did whatever he wanted and encouraged his children to do the same. Or encouraged Jaime to, while the other two merely took notes.

Jaime does do what he wants, mainly Cersei, but the reputation that Jaimes his fathers kind of care free psychopath is solely based off of kingslaying. So Tywin doesn't understand why Jaime follows rules, after all he's not just a care free Lannister but a care free kingslayer Lannister.

His upbringing and reputation thusly mixes into something hysterical. Jamie will follow the rules because he wants to, not because he respects them. He will save KL and refuse it's justification, hand the IT to Ned and laugh in his face, pushes a kid for Cersei and refuses to war on the kids family, because he wants to. Despite of, or really because of, who he his, Jaime naturally refuses all logic and at the height of Lannister power and at a time nearest it's extenction Jaime will manage the affairs of the West while refusing to ever becoming it's lord. Because he wants to.

 

Tywin never planned for twins so until Jaime grew yay tall it was easier to treat the kids the same. But one day they handed Jaime a sword and like a dress to Cersei, this is kind of a big deal because that sword killed Aerys. 

Cersei too, does whatever she wants. Mainly Jaime. After all, Jaime doing whatever Jaime wanted has worked wonders! House Lannister is now stronger then ever, stronger even then Tywins do whatever he wants approach. So she doubles down. She takes the throne. Twice. And it's around time for number three. 

This time it'll be different. This time she won't have hair, although there may be some other startling differences. Cersei used to use spies, then she realized they're pretty bad. She used to use Hands, that didn't work out either. For now Cersei has a king, we'll see if she continues too in the future. But the present is now and the lack of Tywins presence has presently presented Cersei an unprecedented present. A Lordship. Despite Cerseis overwhelming treason not one member of the Lannister inner circle or it's Westeros neighbors has questioned the Lady's control of the Rock.

 

 

When Jaime got the blood colored, err, golden sword, Cersei got like needle and thread or something. I would be curious what Tywin gave the other kid, if I wasn't so sure it was nothing. No swords, no needles. So he watches his father, his brother and his sister. He sees what works and what does not, and Tyrion most certainly learned is that he can do, whatever. he. wants.

 

It's unwise to create a monster when you should be creating an heir, Tywin created three. Whether house Lannister falls to Cersei or Tyrion or to it's death it will be because of Tywin.

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