US Politics: Manchin Shin Drinks the Blood and Cracks the Bone

[A True Kaniggit]

Yep. My old elementary school is still messed up. 18 years later. Damn former Confederacy. 
 

https://www.usnews.com/education/k12/louisiana/herndon-magnet-school-232459

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

2 hours ago, The Great Unwashed said:

This shit is honestly hilarious - but go on, I’ll continue letting you tell me not to believe what’s actually happening.

Are all moderate Democrats responsible for the actions of a few?

[A True Kaniggit]

8 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Are all moderate Democrats responsible for the actions of a few?

Are all moderate Republicans responsible for the actions of a few?

The older I get, the more I think yes.

You are from the South as well. Unless you've been amazingly lucky, you have been involved in some of the same uncomfortable situations I have been in.

(They lean in, "It's not that I don't like black people, I don't like N******. You know the difference between the two. Right? Right?")

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

5 minutes ago, A True Kaniggit said:

Are all moderate Republicans responsible for the actions of a few?

The older I get, the more I think yes.

You are from the South as well. Unless you've been amazingly lucky, you have been involved in some of the same uncomfortable situations I have been in.

(They lean in, "It's not that I don't like black people, I don't like N******. You know the difference between the two. Right? Right?")

Peoplw who say shit like that are fucking racists.

 

[A True Kaniggit]

6 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

People who say shit like that are fucking racists.

 

Well yeah.

And there is a high proportion of them in the South.

Where we are from.

[Jaxom 1974]

18 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Are all moderate Democrats responsible for the actions of a few?

Maybe?  Maybe not?  But that's likely all irrelevant when one says a negative word against St. Bernie...never mind he was never the one to carry the banner of the Progressive Movement, regardless whether he's the godfather of it or not.  

[A True Kaniggit]

Dammit other U.S.A citizens. How hard is it to understand?

We currently exist in a two party system.

When an entire region of the country that fought a bloody civil war to own other human beings votes one way in near unison, you better vote the other way.

 

Take 20 damn minutes of your life to look at the voting patterns of the former Confederacy since 1860, separate from the rest of the nation.

That shit is fucked up.

[Zorral]

3 hours ago, Ormond said:

Perhaps not, but I will wait to evaluate that when it looks like any of them has any real chance at getting the nomination

Come on, fer pete's. All intelligent informed people have had more than enough to evaluate these jerkwaddies: they are evil, toxic, dysfunctional, white supremacist, anti-woman, bigots who wish authoritarian rule for everybody who isn't a big white CIS male with lots and lots and LOTS of money and power, and additionally think they can declare wars and win them just by saying so -- and want to.  Plus, you know, that thing of them actively killing people by screaming against vaccinations, boosters, masks and distance.  Ya, just like the orange shoggoth.

[A True Kaniggit]

8 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Come on, fer pete's. All intelligent informed people have had more than enough to evaluate these jerkwaddies: they are evil, toxic, dysfunctional, white supremacist, anti-woman, bigots who wish authoritarian rule for everybody who isn't a big white CIS male with lots and lots and LOTS of money and power, and additionally think they can declare wars and win them just by saying so -- and want to.  Plus, you know, that thing of them actively killing people by screaming against vaccinations, boosters, masks and distance.  Ya, just like the orange shoggoth.

Lol. This scene. 
 

https://youtube.com/watch?v=Qyt0BGAV5rY&feature=share

 

[IFR]

10 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I recommend this book:

https://www.lawfareblog.com/why-we-wrote-after-trump

Thanks for the recommendation! It may be some time before I get to it. Right now I'm reading Shogun and Strange Glow: The Story of Radiation. I have about a dozen books after that on my immediate reading list.

Does the book address what will happen when due to the political inaction of normalcy, scarcity of land and resources drive millions of desparate immigrants to the US, war starts sprouting all over the world, other countries edge towards increasing despotism, and financial stratification becomes a life or death matter?

[Week]

7 hours ago, IFR said:

Does the book address what will happen when due to the political inaction of normalcy, scarcity of land and resources drive millions of desparate immigrants to the US, war starts sprouting all over the world, other countries edge towards increasing despotism, and financial stratification becomes a life or death matter?

Scarcity of land and resources? Do you mean impacts of rising seas and limited water? I have a hunch (from reading the synopsis) that it's thesis is a bit more constrained in scope. Though increasing despotism would likely be addressed as that is fairly central to returning the Executive to a co-equal branch of government.

[Larry of the Lawn]

13 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Student debt relief would overall be a good thing, especially for people of color, but every time this subject comes up it seems like the real problem is glossed over, the exploding cost of getting a four year degree (not to mention grad school), and I'm sorry, but free community college for two years is like a drop in a bucket when it comes to solving that issue.

 

This is all true, but why is this the one issue that needs to be completely solved?  Why can't this one be tackled bit by bit, instead of in one fell swoop?  Or are you just pointing that out?  

eta: the point of free community college isn't to make a Bachelor's degree cheaper.  It's to give people a free two year degree.  Those are related but totally distinct things.  And the fact that a free two year degree doesn't solve the ridiculous cost of a four year degree shouldn't be used to argue against it. 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

31 minutes ago, Week said:

Scarcity of land and resources? Do you mean impacts of rising seas and limited water? I have a hunch (from reading the synopsis) that it's thesis is a bit more constrained in scope. Though increasing despotism would likely be addressed as that is fairly central to returning the Executive to a co-equal branch of government.

By “returning the Executive to a co-equal branch of government” you mean weaking the “Imperial Presidency”, don’t you?

[Week]

27 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

By “returning the Executive to a co-equal branch of government” you mean weaking the “Imperial Presidency”, don’t you?

I do, yes. Avoidance of a second reign of Chancellor Trumpatine would be my preference.

ETA-- Along with voting rights and Senate reforms ... If I was going to be greedy enough to try to fix the current milieu.

[IFR]

53 minutes ago, Week said:

Scarcity of land and resources? Do you mean impacts of rising seas and limited water? I have a hunch (from reading the synopsis) that it's thesis is a bit more constrained in scope. Though increasing despotism would likely be addressed as that is fairly central to returning the Executive to a co-equal branch of government.

I admit I was being a bit sarcastic. I feel like Ser Scot, like many in congress, simply doesn't accept the full gravity of what we are in for in the future. It has been a very long time since there has been actual worldwide upheaval, so we become complacent and it's hard to conceive of a world so dramatically different than we are accustomed.

Climate change is still a boogeyman to a lot of people. Even some of those who think it concerning do not consider the future will be nearly as bad as portrayed in my post.

I'm suggesting that while Ser Scot is working to beat out a small bush fire, there is a raging forest fire coming down on all of us.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

16 minutes ago, IFR said:

I admit I was being a bit sarcastic. I feel like Ser Scot, like many in congress, simply doesn't accept the full gravity of what we are in for in the future. It has been a very long time since there has been actual worldwide upheaval, so we become complacent and it's hard to conceive of a world so dramatically different than we are accustomed.

Climate change is still a boogeyman to a lot of people. Even some of those who think it concerning do not consider the future will be nearly as bad as portrayed in my post.

I'm suggesting that while Ser Scot is working to beat out a small bush fire, there is a raging forest fire coming down on all of us.

So, you are go for a full on dictatorship so long as the dictator is doing what you want them to do?  If so, I hope you realize that is how Trumpanistas justify Trump’s actions.

:|

[Larry of the Lawn]

11 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

So, you are go for a full on dictatorship so long as the dictator is doing what you want them to do?

Yeah, that's a very accurate and charitable interpretation of what she said.  

 

eta: to wit, that was a cheap rhetorical (and likely hypocritical) point on my part.  the quagmire of a legislative branch born from first past the post voting, the electoral college, and the undemocratic nature of the Senate have created a situation where the legislature is unable to actually work on problems that we face.  if you don't want the executive branch to do what they can when Congress is fucking useless, I'm not sure what the point of a democratically elected executive is.  Assuming all that, it seems to me (and could very well be wrong) that while reducing executive power is good, it's also taking away the only tool left in the tool box to actually do anything.  I'd suggest instead expanding the house of reps, voting rights legislation, etc.  Because a government that can't respond to problems is also a big fucking problem.  Also, we survived Trump.  Biden has been completely innefectual.  Not exactly a strong case for the omnipotent executive.  

eta2: and they both had the trifecta of Presidency,/ Senate/ House for their first terms

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

7 minutes ago, Lermo T.I. Krrrammpus said:

Yeah, that's a very accurate and charitable interpretation of what she said.  

I know it isn’t charitable.  I find the imperial Presidency to be a problem whether I like the abuse of executive authority or not.  

If you give the power to the President you like the President you don’t like will have that power.

[IFR]

5 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

So, you are go for a full on dictatorship so long as the dictator is doing what you want them to do?  If so, I hope you realize that is how Trumpanistas justify Trump’s actions.

:|

I wouldn't be shocked if the US became a dictatorship if future circumstances are dire enough.

As I see it, we are confronted by a congress who is too corrupt to act in any effective way to deal with a very real crisis, one which is very time sensitive. Not acting is acting, with very deleterious effects. Giving congress more power to not act to me seems profoundly damaging.

Risking more power to a president who may be another Trump could also be very damaging. But there would also be a chance for an effective president who is willing to deal with the crisis of our world, and had the capability of acting. 

I'm not sure what else reasonably can be done.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

1 minute ago, IFR said:

I wouldn't be shocked if the US became a dictatorship if future circumstances are dire enough.

As I see it, we are confronted by a congress who is too corrupt to act in any effective way to deal with a very real crisis, one which is very time sensitive. Not acting is acting, with very deleterious effects. Giving congress more power to not act to me seems profoundly damaging.

Risking more power to a president who may be another Trump could also be very damaging. But there would also be a chance for an effective president who is willing to deal with the crisis of our world, and had the capability of acting. 

I'm not sure what else reasonably can be done.

Not become a Dictatorship.