Danaerys is an Awful Hypocrite

[Corvo the Crow]

She constantly calls Ned, along with other rebels, usurper's dogs Even though both Barristan and Jorah, who is an exile and hates Ned because of it, say on different occasions what an Honorable man Eddard Stark is, Barristan even saying how he tried to save her life.

 

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Ser Jorah considered that for a moment. "Robert should have been born Dothraki," he said at last. "Your khal would tell you that only a coward hides behind stone walls instead of facing his enemy with a blade in hand. The Usurper would agree. He is a strong man, brave … and rash enough to meet a Dothraki horde in the open field. But the men around him, well, their pipers play a different tune. His brother Stannis, Lord Tywin Lannister, Eddard Stark …" He spat.

"You hate this Lord Stark," Dany said.

"He took from me all I loved, for the sake of a few lice-ridden poachers and his precious honor," Ser Jorah said bitterly. From his tone, she could tell the loss still pained him. He changed the subject quickly. "There," he announced, pointing. "Vaes Dothrak. The city of the horselords."   - AGoT Daenerys IV

 

"I lived for her smiles, so I sent all the way to Oldtown for a new cook, and brought a harper from Lannisport. Goldsmiths, jewelers, dressmakers, whatever she wanted I found for her, but it was never enough. Bear Island is rich in bears and trees, and poor in aught else. I built a fine ship for her and we sailed to Lannisport and Oldtown for festivals and fairs, and once even to Braavos, where I borrowed heavily from the moneylenders. It was as a tourney champion that I had won her hand and heart, so I entered other tourneys for her sake, but the magic was gone. I never distinguished myself again, and each defeat meant the loss of another charger and another suit of jousting armor, which must needs be ransomed or replaced. The cost could not be borne. Finally I insisted we return home, but there matters soon grew even worse than before. I could no longer pay the cook and the harper, and Lynesse grew wild when I spoke of pawning her jewels.

"The rest . . . I did things it shames me to speak of. For gold. So Lynesse might keep her jewels, her harper, and her cook. In the end it cost me all. When I heard that Eddard Stark was coming to Bear Island, I was so lost to honor that rather than stay and face his judgment, I took her with me into exile. Nothing mattered but our love, I told myself. We fled to Lys, where I sold my ship for gold to keep us." - ACoK Daenerys I

 

"King Joffrey reigns," Quhuru Mo agreed, "but the Lannisters rule. Robert's brothers have fled King's Landing. The talk is, they mean to claim the crown. And the Hand has fallen, Lord Stark who was King Robert's friend. He has been seized for treason."

"Ned Stark a traitor?" Ser Jorah snorted. "Not bloody likely. The Long Summer will come again before that one would besmirch his precious honor."

"What honor could he have?" Dany said. "He was a traitor to his true king, as were these Lannisters." It pleased her to hear that the Usurper's dogs were fighting amongst themselves, though she was unsurprised. The same thing happened when her Drogo died, and his great khalasar tore itself to pieces. "My brother is dead as well, Viserys who was the true king," she told the Summer Islander. "Khal Drogo my lord husband killed him with a crown of molten gold." Would her brother have been any wiser, had he known that the vengeance he had prayed for was so close at hand?   - ACoK Danaerys II

A true knight is worth ten guardsmen. The men at the gate were taken by surprise. I rode one down, wrenched away his spear, and drove it through the throat of my closest pursuer. The other broke off once I was through the gate, so I spurred my horse to a gallop and rode hellbent along the river until the city was lost to sight behind me. That night I traded my horse for a handful of pennies and some rags, and the next morning I joined the stream of smallfolk making their way to King's Landing. I'd gone out the Mud Gate, so I returned through the Gate of the Gods, with dirt on my face, stubble on my cheeks, and no weapon but a wooden staff. In roughspun clothes and mud-caked boots, I was just one more old man fleeing the war. The gold cloaks took a stag from me and waved me through. King's Landing was crowded with smallfolk who'd come seeking refuge from the fighting. I lost myself amongst them. I had a little silver, but I needed that to pay my passage across the narrow sea, so I slept in septs and alleys and took my meals in pot shops. I let my beard grow out and cloaked myself in age. The day Lord Stark lost his head, I was there, watching. Afterward I went into the Great Sept and thanked the seven gods that Joffrey had stripped me of my cloak."

"Stark was a traitor who met a traitor's end."

"Your Grace," said Selmy, "Eddard Stark played a part in your father's fall, but he bore you no ill will. When the eunuch Varys told us that you were with child, Robert wanted you killed, but Lord Stark spoke against it. Rather than countenance the murder of children, he told Robert to find himself another Hand."

"Have you forgotten Princess Rhaenys and Prince Aegon?"

"Never. That was Lannister work, Your Grace."

"Lannister or Stark, what difference? Viserys used to call them the Usurper's dogs. If a child is set upon by a pack of hounds, does it matter which one tears out his throat? All the dogs are just as guilty. The guilt …" The word caught in her throat. Hazzea, she thought, and suddenly she heard herself say, "I have to see the pit," in a voice as small as a child's whisper. "Take me down, ser, if you would."  - ACoK Danaerys II

 

 

She considers Eddard Stark a traitor, even though she knows her family did harm to Starks first. I can't recall whether we ever learn if she knows what fate befell on Brandon and Rickard, but she knows that Rhaegar "kidnapped and raped" Lyanna. 

 

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Dany did not want to hear about Rhaegar being unhorsed. "But what tourneys did my brother win?"

"Your Grace." The old man hesitated. "He won the greatest tourney of them all."

"Which was that?" Dany demanded.

"The tourney Lord Whent staged at Harrenhal beside the Gods Eye, in the year of the false spring. A notable event. Besides the jousting, there was a mêlée in the old style fought between seven teams of knights, as well as archery and axe-throwing, a horse race, a tournament of singers, a mummer show, and many feasts and frolics. Lord Whent was as open handed as he was rich. The lavish purses he proclaimed drew hundreds of challengers. Even your royal father came to Harrenhal, when he had not left the Red Keep for long years. The greatest lords and mightiest champions of the Seven Kingdoms rode in that tourney, and the Prince of Dragonstone bested them all."

"But that was the tourney when he crowned Lyanna Stark as queen of love and beauty!" said Dany. "Princess Elia was there, his wife, and yet my brother gave the crown to the Stark girl, and later stole her away from her betrothed. How could he do that? Did the Dornish woman treat him so ill?"

"It is not for such as me to say what might have been in your brother's heart, Your Grace. The Princess Elia was a good and gracious lady, though her health was ever delicate."

Dany pulled the lion pelt tighter about her shoulders. "Viserys said once that it was my fault, for being born too late." She had denied it hotly, she remembered, going so far as to tell Viserys that it was his fault for not being born a girl. He beat her cruelly for that insolence. "If I had been born more timely, he said, Rhaegar would have married me instead of Elia, and it would all have come out different. If Rhaegar had been happy in his wife, he would not have needed the Stark girl."

"Perhaps so, Your Grace." Whitebeard paused a moment. "But I am not certain it was in Rhaegar to be happy."

"You make him sound so sour," Dany protested.   - ASoS Danaerys IV

 

The conversation above happens long after the events that transpired in "lamb men land" where she tried to prevent women from being raped, going as far as saying Dothraki should marry the Lhazareen.

 

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"I've told the khal he ought to make for Meereen," Ser Jorah said. "They'll pay a better price than he'd get from a slaving caravan. Illyrio writes that they had a plague last year, so the brothels are paying double for healthy young girls, and triple for boys under ten. If enough children survive the journey, the gold will buy us all the ships we need, and hire men to sail them."

Behind them, the girl being raped made a heartrending sound, a long sobbing wail that went on and on and on. Dany's hand clenched hard around the reins, and she turned the silver's head. "Make them stop," she commanded Ser Jorah.

"Khaleesi?" The knight sounded perplexed.

"You heard my words," she said. "Stop them." She spoke to her khas in the harsh accents of Dothraki. "Jhogo, Quaro, you will aid Ser Jorah. I want no rape."

The girl was trembling, her eyes wide and vague. Her hair was matted with blood. "Doreah, see to her hurts. You do not have a rider's look, perhaps she will not fear you. The rest, with me." She urged the silver through the broken wooden gate.

It was worse inside the town. Many of the houses were afire, and the jaqqa rhan had been about their grisly work. Headless corpses filled the narrow, twisty lanes. They passed other women being raped. Each time Dany reined up, sent her khas to make an end to it, and claimed the victim as slave. One of them, a thick-bodied, flat-nosed woman of forty years, blessed Dany haltingly in the Common Tongue, but from the others she got only flat black stares. They were suspicious of her, she realized with sadness; afraid that she had saved them for some worse fate.

 

Dany, who tries to save Lhazareen women from rape, calls Eddard Stark, perhaps the most honorable men to ever have inked the pages of a book, a traitor and a dog for trying to save his sister from Danaerys' rapist brother.

[Nathan Stark]

I just don't agree with this. Not that Dany isn't hypocritical, just that she isn't hypocritical regarding Ned. Dany doesn't know anything about Ned other than what her half mad abusive brother told her. She knows exactly as much as we do about what Rheagar was really like. Which is to say, nothing. You can't fault a teenager for being hypocritical about people and events of which she knows nothing.

[Corvo the Crow]

1 minute ago, Nathan Stark said:

I just don't agree with this. Not that Dany isn't hypocritical, just that she isn't hypocritical regarding Ned. Dany doesn't know anything about Ned other than what her half mad abusive brother told her. She knows exactly as much as we do about what Rheagar was really like. Which is to say, nothing. You can't fault a teenager for being hypocritical about people and events of which she knows nothing.

She does this despite Barristan and Jorah telling him of Ned, Barristan even says how Ned tried to save her life. Not just about Ned, he is also hypocritical about his brother Rhaegar. She knows that he kidnapped and raped Rhaegar but she doesn't even bat an eye while talking about this.

[Nathan Stark]

2 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said:

She does this despite Barristan and Jorah telling him of Ned, Barristan even says how Ned tried to save her life. Not just about Ned, he is also hypocritical about his brother Rhaegar. She knows that he kidnapped and raped Rhaegar but she doesn't even bat an eye while talking about this.

We don't even know that Rheagar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. Why should Dany be held to standards that we ourselves cannot meet? Plus, its not as if she's getting an unbiased account of Ned from creeper Jorah.

[Odej]

For thirteen years everything Daenerys knew about her family, Westeros, and Robert's rebellion was through Viserys who always favored the Targaryen side of the story. He taught her to hate everything connected with the rebels, that Rhaegar died for the woman he loved, Viserys never told her about the deaths of Rickard and Brandon Stark, how crazy and cruel Aerys was, and so on. Jorah and Barristan were introducing her to the truth, but a person doesn't abandon feelings and convictions cultivated since childhood overnight.

[Terrorthatflapsinthenight9]

Yeah Daenerys certainely didn't had the best accounts of Ned told to her, with Viserys and Jorah telling her that Ned was a traitor or a cold-blooded executor, though she doesn't try to listen to Barristan's more nuanced account, which is where her fault really is.

[Phylum of Alexandria]

8 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said:

She does this despite Barristan and Jorah telling him of Ned, Barristan even says how Ned tried to save her life. Not just about Ned, he is also hypocritical about his brother Rhaegar. She knows that he kidnapped and raped Rhaegar but she doesn't even bat an eye while talking about this.

Barristan does defend Ned to some extent, but he doesn't push his queen very hard, or explain the situation to her. He could have easily explained how Aerys had murdered Ned's father and brother, and that the rebellion was at least for an understandable cause, but he doesn't. He gives her truth, but it's a very guarded truth.

From Dany's perspective in AGOT, there was no indication at all that he had kidnapped or raped Lyanna:

"Her brother Rhaegar battling the Usurper in the bloody waters of the Trident and dying for the woman he loved."

As @Nathan Stark said, Dany has been going on limited information. Jorah may have given a little more context, and Barristan even more, but no one has ever really explained to her what went on and who did what...aside from Viserys.

She'll learn eventually though. It will be a tough lesson for her, but I think she'll own up to Ned Stark's decency and her father's lunacy.

[Moiraine Sedai]

31 minutes ago, Corvo the Crow said:

She constantly calls Ned, along with other rebels, usurper's dogs Even though both Barristan and Jorah, who is an exile and hates Ned because of it, say on different occasions what an Honorable man Eddard Stark is, Barristan even saying how he tried to save her life.

 

 

She considers Eddard Stark a traitor, even though she knows her family did harm to Starks first. I can't recall whether we ever learn if she knows what fate befell on Brandon and Rickard, but she knows that Rhaegar "kidnapped and raped" Lyanna. 

 

 

The conversation above happens long after the events that transpired in "lamb men land" where she tried to prevent women from being raped, going as far as saying Dothraki should marry the Lhazareen.

 

 

Dany, who tries to save Lhazareen women from rape, calls Eddard Stark, perhaps the most honorable men to ever have inked the pages of a book, a traitor and a dog for trying to save his sister from Danaerys' rapist brother.

Ned Stark is one of Usurper’s dogs. The Stark family was plotting a marriage which would undermine Targaryen rule. Aerys had a right to stop them. Ned was old enough to know of his father and best friend’s plans, and did nothing to stop them.  I think Ned knew that Lyanna ran away on her own and yet, kept his mouth shut to protect the honor of the other dogs in his family. Truthfully, Lyanna broke her engagement, a dishonorable act, and ran away. Ned and his family hid this to protect their reputation and allowed Robert to believe that Lyanna was raped. For all we know, Lyanna went to bed willingly with Rhaegar, Mance,  Arthur, even her own brother Brandon.  Ned was hiding something to protect Lyanna’s and his family’s honor. So yes, Ned deserves to be disliked by Daenerys. 

[EggBlue]

Dany grew up with  the things Viserys had told her about their family. what she knows is that her splendid brother fell in love with some girl one day and rescued her from her terrible fiance' and barbaric family. then the girl's treacherous brother came to king's landing demanding the good guy's head. of course in Dany's version the excursion of Brandon and Rickard is not wrong! and afterwards, the fiance' turns into a usurper and a kinslayer unjustly killing Dany's brother and stealing her father's throne , while his dogs , Ned and Tywin helped him in his war and slaughtered Dany's innocent family. ... and you expect Dany to take the testimony of a guy who once fought on "the wrong side of the war" and one who served the usurper for 15 years and change her opinion about Ned- a beast from her childhood's bed stories whom she has never met?!!!

 

[Corvo the Crow]

Well, my fault for being less clear than it could be, yes, all she has been told about Ned were bad things, but this isn't just about Ned. Rhaegar kidnaps and rapes Lyanna and all she has to say about this is whether if the Dornish women treated him bad.

17 minutes ago, Nathan Stark said:

We don't even know that Rheagar kidnapped and raped Lyanna.

We DO know that rhaegar "kidnapped and raped" Lyanna. Rhaegar may not have raped her, she may have went with him willingly, but to anyone in Planetos' knowledge, including Dany, who herself says Rhaegar stole Lyanna from her betrothed, Rhaegar kidnapped and raped Lyanna. Only a select few know the truth of the matter and most of them are long dead. 

[Lord Lannister]

Dany is an entitled child going off limited and flawed information, sure. She definitely has flaws, but I think the OP is taking it way too far.

As at least one other post in this thread has shown, haters come in all flavors and types. 

[Corvo the Crow]

1 minute ago, Lord Lannister said:

Dany is an entitled child going off limited and flawed information, sure. She definitely has flaws, but I think the OP is taking it way too far.

As at least one other post in this thread has shown, haters come in all flavors and types. 

It is not what information she goes on, it is that she tries to save Lhazareen from rape while condoning her brothers "actions".

Her being an entitled child is also another thing related to this: She tries to rescue some "lowly sheep women" while also expecting a noble family, one of the most powerful ones on Westeros no less, whose highborn maiden daughter was kidnapped, not to raise because it was her princely brother who is doing the raping. Same expectation goes for Robert too, whose betrothed was kidnapped... by his own cousin no less.

[Corvo the Crow]

13 minutes ago, EggBlue said:

Dany grew up with  the things Viserys had told her about their family. what she knows is that her splendid brother fell in love with some girl one day and rescued her from her terrible fiance' and barbaric family. then the girl's treacherous brother came to king's landing demanding the good guy's head. of course in Dany's version the excursion of Brandon and Rickard is not wrong! and afterwards, the fiance' turns into a usurper and a kinslayer unjustly killing Dany's brother and stealing her father's throne , while his dogs , Ned and Tywin helped him in his war and slaughtered Dany's innocent family. ... and you expect Dany to take the testimony of a guy who once fought on "the wrong side of the war" and one who served the usurper for 15 years and change her opinion about Ned- a beast from her childhood's bed stories whom she has never met?!!!

 

For Ned, or Robert what you say is true, but for Lyanna?

She says herself that Rhaegar stole her. And yet she is rather ok with it.

[Corvo the Crow]

20 minutes ago, Moiraine Sedai said:

Ned Stark is one of Usurper’s dogs. The Stark family was plotting a marriage which would undermine Targaryen rule. Aerys had a right to stop them. Ned was old enough to know of his father and best friend’s plans, and did nothing to stop them.  I think Ned knew that Lyanna ran away on her own and yet, kept his mouth shut to protect the honor of the other dogs in his family. Truthfully, Lyanna broke her engagement, a dishonorable act, and ran away. Ned and his family hid this to protect their reputation and allowed Robert to believe that Lyanna was raped. For all we know, Lyanna went to bed willingly with Rhaegar, Mance,  Arthur, even her own brother Brandon.  Ned was hiding something to protect Lyanna’s and his family’s honor. So yes, Ned deserves to be disliked by Daenerys. 

 You forgot Aerys. He must've burned Rickard and strangled Brandon so they couldn't take away his newest toy.

[Aejohn the Conqueroo]

I think you might be overstating it a bit, but I do wish you posted this about a month and a half ago.

[Khal Rhaego Targaryen]

Oh no! Another post desperately trying to make Dany look like a bad person... IMAGINE HOW TIRED WE ARE!

[Jaenara Belarys]

@Corvo the Crow, by now it just seems like you're trying to get a reaction from people.....

 

Anyway. What else do you think Dany's going to think? The onlt things she knows about them are from fucking Viserys  of all people. You think Viserys is going to tell both sides of the story? Would he even know what all happened? I don't blame Dany for regurgitating what her brother told her. 

1 hour ago, Aejohn the Conqueroo said:

I think you might be overstating it a bit, but I do wish you posted this about a month and a half ago.

What happened a month and a half ago? 

[Lord Lannister]

27 minutes ago, Jaenara Belarys said:

@Corvo the Crow, by now it just seems like you're trying to get a reaction from people.....

Between this thread and the thread about Ashara being a transgendered Barristan, I'm inclined to agree with this.

[EggBlue]

3 hours ago, Corvo the Crow said:

For Ned, or Robert what you say is true, but for Lyanna?

She says herself that Rhaegar stole her. And yet she is rather ok with it.

remember the situation in which she thought he stole Lyanna at sword point. it was when she was comparing herself and Dario with Rhaegar and Lyanna. this hardly suggests she thinks of it as "abduction" and "rape", rather it implies that she thinks Rhaegar "saved" Lyanna -with her consent- from her unpleasant duty for their mutual love.

[Arthur Peres]

6 hours ago, Nathan Stark said:

I just don't agree with this. Not that Dany isn't hypocritical, just that she isn't hypocritical regarding Ned. Dany doesn't know anything about Ned other than what her half mad abusive brother told her. She knows exactly as much as we do about what Rheagar was really like. Which is to say, nothing. You can't fault a teenager for being hypocritical about people and events of which she knows nothing.

Not true at all. Like said already at the thread, Barristan and Jorah both told her she was wrong, she also know that what Viserys told her was bs, like the talk about people willing to fight for him, but she keeps putting weight on his words over Barristan or Jorah, keeping her tunnel vision for no reason whatsoever.

I don't think she is awful, and she has legit reasons to hate Ned, is just the way she does it is very annoying to read, and makes her look too much imature for the role GRRM want us to belive she will play.