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UK Politics: Gray's Anatomy


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15 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Watch and learn:P

 

Oh, and “Cultural Secretary” Nadine Dorries bravely decided to give an interview half-cut on something.

 

Wow. Is she actually drunk?

 

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7 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

Get ourselves a little bit of that old fashioned Parliamentary representation and maybe we'll just need to send the whole kit and caboodle back the mother ship, eh?   Maybe solve a few problems...  :P

In all seriousness, parliamentary democracy is significantly better in almost every way than having a President along with a cabinet. One of the biggest is that in theory you can have multiple parties.

I'm not sure that the way that the UK does it is best (I still think that New Zealand is pretty much the absolute rock star for their system of governance) but it is definitely better than what we have, especially for dealing with leadership that is horrible.

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One of the latest allegations is apparently about Carrie Johnson and her friends holding what's described as an Abba-themed victory party after Dominic Cummings left, which I think might be the most ridiculous detail yet.

In other news, Liz Truss has announced she tested positive for Covid just after attending today's statement in Parliament and Boris' meeting with all his MPs.

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25 minutes ago, williamjm said:

One of the latest allegations is apparently about Carrie Johnson and her friends holding what's described as an Abba-themed victory party after Dominic Cummings left, which I think might be the most ridiculous detail yet.

In other news, Liz Truss has announced she tested positive for Covid just after attending today's statement in Parliament and Boris' meeting with all his MPs.

Naturally Liz was sitting on the front bench sans mask cheering as Johnson told us all COVID  was over, all the while being rancid with it.

1 hour ago, Kalibuster said:

Wow, it's so quaint to see a country that has a leader beset by scandal and the expectation is that the leader has to go

So neat

Very nice

You'd find more reassuringly familiar the procession of Tory MPs tonight telling the press and their Twitter followers that they talked to the PM and they're sure that he's really learned his lesson this time, this time he really means it, and we should now just let him get on with the job and focus on the real issues.

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1 hour ago, Kalibuster said:

I'm not sure that the way that the UK does it is best (I still think that New Zealand is pretty much the absolute rock star for their system of governance) but it is definitely better than what we have, especially for dealing with leadership that is horrible.

 


The way the UK does it fucking sucks because despite having three theoretical branches of government in practice the Lords have very little power and the monarchy none, meaning far too much power is concentrated in the office of the PM and in a situation like this despite the expectation being that he go, the practice being that we're reliant on his party members all of whom have bought into him to do so. 

(really, the fact that basically all political power in the UK rests in the Commons causes all sorts of issues - I really dislike that the MP you vote for for local representation is the same person as a representative on national issues and is also essentially voting for the PM. Those should be separate things.). 

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3 minutes ago, polishgenius said:

 


The way the UK does it fucking sucks because despite having three theoretical branches of government in practice the Lords have very little power and the monarchy none, meaning far too much power is concentrated in the office of the PM and in a situation like this despite the expectation being that he go, the practice being that we're reliant on his party members all of whom have bought into him to do so. 

(really, the fact that basically all political power in the UK rests in the Commons causes all sorts of issues - I really dislike that the MP you vote for for local representation is the same person as a representative on national issues and is also essentially voting for the PM. Those should be separate things.). 

By comparison, in the US your local rep is responsible for determining which party you will get for the next 10 to 20 years, and you have only the choice of which person from the same party you want.

So yeah, I feel ya, but even that stupid UK system is better.

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1 hour ago, polishgenius said:

 


The way the UK does it fucking sucks because despite having three theoretical branches of government in practice the Lords have very little power and the monarchy none, meaning far too much power is concentrated in the office of the PM and in a situation like this despite the expectation being that he go, the practice being that we're reliant on his party members all of whom have bought into him to do so. 

(really, the fact that basically all political power in the UK rests in the Commons causes all sorts of issues - I really dislike that the MP you vote for for local representation is the same person as a representative on national issues and is also essentially voting for the PM. Those should be separate things.). 

Parliament is sovereign in the UK isn't it?

That the Tories are too craven/opportunistic to oust the PM, that is more a problem of political culture than of the system itself.  The systenatuc problem is more the election system that make those majorities of one party in parliament way too easy.

You can thank momentum, who thought giving Corbyn another shot was a good idea, and Corbyn himself for that.

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3 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Watch and learn:P

 

Oh, and “Cultural Secretary” Nadine Dorries bravely decided to give an interview half-cut on something.

 

I think her attempts to speak on channel 4 were the most laughable, unfortunately can't find a good link of it but it genuinely came across like a late night sketch. Who thought it was a good idea to put her in front of the camera?

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1 hour ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I think her attempts to speak on channel 4 were the most laughable, unfortunately can't find a good link of it but it genuinely came across like a late night sketch. Who thought it was a good idea to put her in front of the camera?

Maybe she was the only one willing to put their head above the parapet and do an interview? I guess she realises no sane PM is ever going to give her a cabinet job.

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6 hours ago, Kalibuster said:

In all seriousness, parliamentary democracy is significantly better in almost every way than having a President along with a cabinet. One of the biggest is that in theory you can have multiple parties.

I'm not sure that the way that the UK does it is best (I still think that New Zealand is pretty much the absolute rock star for their system of governance) but it is definitely better than what we have, especially for dealing with leadership that is horrible.

Insofar as all partisan democracies are dysfunctional, ours might be one of the least broken, though I lack the information to be able to make any kind of credible claim in that regard. If it is true, I would credit that not so much to the parliamentary system or any one party, but rather to the, so far, absolute commitment of the Electoral Commission to ensuring everyone who wants to vote and is eligible to vote gets to vote, and putting in place systems and processes to achieve that end with minimal effort required on the part of the voter. And we have basically no meaningful evidence of any voter fraud that would substantially impact the election. Hence we have relatively decent voter participation in national elections consistently getting over 80%, and sometimes into the 90s, with no compulsion at all. In the last 30 years our highest turnout was 93.7% and our lowest was 74.2% with 9/15 elections achieving over 80% participation. But as soon as a party can get in and find a way to effectively corrupt the Electoral Commission and systematically suppress votes, it'll be all over for our democracy too. I'll leave people to guess as to which ideological bent is more interested in suppressing the vote.

Back to the UK, even with all this I wonder what the odds are of the conservatives being returned to power at the next election? Probably 50/50, and even not terrible odds if there is an electoral pact between the Lib Dems, and Labour.

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We’ve got 92%. Mandatory voting rocks. 
 

Also love preferential voting and an upper house that is proportional. The upper house has fixed seats by state, so people have mixed views on that. 

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10 hours ago, Which Tyler said:

 

I guess the Chief Constable's character arc hit a bit close to home?

Spoiler-tagged explanation of arc below.

Spoiler

In the very first episode, a counter-terror operation goes wrong and an innocent man is shot dead. By the end of the series, the officer in overall command of that operation and the subsequent cover-up is the Chief Constable of the entire police force.

 

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I love what is apparently the party line now that Johnson can't comment on whether he was at a party in his own house because 'you don't comment on an ongoing police investigation'.

That's the advice your lawyer gives you if you're worried about incriminating yourself. The police are normally only too happy for you to say publicly whether you've committed a crime. 

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28 minutes ago, mormont said:

I love what is apparently the party line now that Johnson can't comment on whether he was at a party in his own house because 'you don't comment on an ongoing police investigation'.

That's the advice your lawyer gives you if you're worried about incriminating yourself. The police are normally only too happy for you to say publicly whether you've committed a crime. 

Normally.   But if said when in parliament would it then be protected by parliamentary privilege?  I'm not sure of just how much this covers.

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Musing on what has been going on between Johnson and the Tory party I can't help thinking that what is going on mostly in public now probably closely parallels what happened in private between Johnson and some of his exes. Johnson's behaviour has been beyond the pale and they are finally working up to making the decision to throw him out. Johnson sees this coming and turns on the persuasion, saying anything, promising anything, so as to stop them reaching that point of decision. Anything to kick the can down the road, weaken their resolve, give the memory of the unacceptable behaviour time to fade, make them acquiescent to it, even complicit.

But having that insight makes me feel unclean somehow. :stillsick:

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