Daylight saving time sucks donkey balls… final thread?

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

NPR just reported that the US Senate has voted… unanimously… to stay on DST from this point forward.  Will this be the last thread bemoaning the horror that is the circadian torture we suffer every Spring?

Edited March 15, 2022 by Ser Scot A Ellison

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Say it's so, Scot! 

[kiko]

I love daylight saving time. Can't wait for the extra hour of light.

The one hour time difference is also not a biggy. Who has ever heard of people complaining about jet lag when they just went to neighbor time zone?

Shame about the cows though.

[Fez]

13 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

NPR just reported that the US Senate has voted… unanimously… to stay on DST from this point forward.  Will this be the last thread bemoaning the horror that is the circadian torture we suffer every Spring.

No, you'll get one more. The bill says that the November 2023 switch won't happen and that's when we'll stay on DST forever.

The bill was by Marco Rubio and Sheldon Whitehouse and had the craziest line-up of 17 co-sponsors I've ever seen. But the House still needs to pass the bill; which is no guarantee yet. They've sat on a couple bills the senate has passed over the past year.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Just now, Fez said:

No, you'll get one more. The bill says that the November 2023 switch won't happen and that's when we'll stay on DST forever.

The bill was by Marco Rubio and Sheldon Whitehouse and had the craziest line-up of 17 co-sponsors I've ever seen. But the House still needs to pass the bill; which is no guarantee yet. They've sat on a couple bills the senate has passed over the past year.

Why???  Why have one more shift???

Just stop.

[Fez]

2 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Why???  Why have one more shift???

Just stop.

Presumably to give plenty of time for all the clock software in the US to be changed. There's usually delays in changes like this.

When Juneteenth became a holiday last year, and took effect immediately rather than waiting a year, it ended up being pretty chaotic; e.g., parents needing to all of a sudden arrange child care since school was suddenly closed, businesses not knowing if they should be open or closed that day, etc. At the time, I and many others pointed out that the past times new holidays were formally created there was a delay to get ready for the change.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

5 minutes ago, Fez said:

Presumably to give plenty of time for all the clock software in the US to be changed. There's usually delays in changes like this.

When Juneteenth became a holiday last year, and took effect immediately rather than waiting a year, it ended up being pretty chaotic; e.g., parents needing to all of a sudden arrange child care since school was suddenly closed, businesses not knowing if they should be open or closed that day, etc. At the time, I and many others pointed out that the past times new holidays were formally created there was a delay to get ready for the change.

Fair enough.

[Larry of the Lawn]

I still don't know which is DST and which is Standard and I don't care to learn. 

These semi annual threads are boring and stuffy compared to twitter:

Amazing how many people are hung up on their kid being outside in the semi dark to either go to or from school.   There's only so manybhiurs of daylight.  Your kid is going to be exposed to some darkness for a few weeks when there's only 8 hours of it.  

Also, apparently not supporting having it light afterwork is ableist against people with seasonal affective disorder.  Apparently we all work the same shift?

Eta: not the only one who doesn't know the difference, apparently:

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Larry of the Lake

[IheartIheartTesla]

I was curious why Marco Rubio was so interested in DST. After all, the closer to the equator you are the less impact DST has on your life, and much of Florida is on the same latitude as northern India, which doesnt follow DST at all.

And then a bit of digging unearthed that Florida had already passed a permanent DST bill in 2017, but for reason of some government arcane-ity, needed the US House (or Senate or both, who cares) to pass either the same bill or a similar bill. Hence Rubio's involvement.

[BigFatCoward]

When the clocks go forward us long suffering parents of prick kids that don't sleep get a couple of weeks of benefit. Can't fucking wait. 

[The Anti-Targ]

Permanent DST surely makes winter an absolute nightmare, sunrise at 9:30AM even at latitudes well outside the arctic / antarctic circles. It's hard enough for a lot of people to get going in the mornings, the sun not making an appearance until almost morning tea time makes it even harder.

I'm fine with ending the time switch, but I don't agree with the permanent setting being DST.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

4 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Permanent DST surely makes winter an absolute nightmare, sunrise at 9:30AM even at latitudes well outside the arctic / antarctic circles. It's hard enough for a lot of people to get going in the mornings, the sun not making an appearance until almost morning tea time makes it even harder.

I'm fine with ending the time switch, but I don't agree with the permanent setting being DST.

I agree.  I prefer standard time.  However… this is a compromise I can live with.

[Fez]

6 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Permanent DST surely makes winter an absolute nightmare, sunrise at 9:30AM even at latitudes well outside the arctic / antarctic circles. It's hard enough for a lot of people to get going in the mornings, the sun not making an appearance until almost morning tea time makes it even harder.

I'm fine with ending the time switch, but I don't agree with the permanent setting being DST.

Purge the fifth columnist! We must show unity in the face of big clock.

More seriously, where in the mainland US is sunrise currently 8:30AM in the winter? Maybe a bit of far western North Dakota, but why should the rest of us suffer for a few thousand people? Needs of the many and all that.

Plus, if all this convinces school boards to move back the start time of the school day, that would only be a good thing.

[Ormond]

2 hours ago, IheartIheartTesla said:

I was curious why Marco Rubio was so interested in DST. After all, the closer to the equator you are the less impact DST has on your life, and much of Florida is on the same latitude as northern India, which doesnt follow DST at all.

And then a bit of digging unearthed that Florida had already passed a permanent DST bill in 2017, but for reason of some government arcane-ity, needed the US House (or Senate or both, who cares) to pass either the same bill or a similar bill. Hence Rubio's involvement.

State legislatures get to opt in or out of Daylight Savings Time already, which is why Arizona and Hawaii do NOT observe it. I believe this bill will allow any state that wants to keep on DST year round, but it will not mandate that and still allow individual state legislatures to opt in or out. 

[DMC]

59 minutes ago, Ormond said:

State legislatures get to opt in or out of Daylight Savings Time already, which is why Arizona and Hawaii do NOT observe it. I believe this bill will allow any state that wants to keep on DST year round, but it will not mandate that and still allow individual state legislatures to opt in or out. 

Under current law, states can opt out of observing daylight savings but are not allowed to observe permanent daylight savings time.  I expect the new bill will similarly require states to opt out of permanent daily savings rather than opt in.

  

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Fez said:

More seriously, where in the mainland US is sunrise currently 8:30AM in the winter? Maybe a bit of far western North Dakota, but why should the rest of us suffer for a few thousand people? Needs of the many and all that.

They're saying it could be as late as 9am here in Minny, but I'm very skeptical that will happen. Personally I'll trade in missing the sun rise on some days so that it won't be pitch black when I leave work at 5pm in January. 

Quote

Plus, if all this convinces school boards to move back the start time of the school day, that would only be a good thing.

Debatable. I used to work with kids struggling in school and too much free time beforehand was a factor in a number of cases. Parents be raising their kids on their screens and that's not a good thing before school. 

[DMC]

7 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Debatable. I used to work with kids struggling in school and too much free time beforehand was a factor in a number of cases. Parents be raising their kids on their screens and that's not a good thing before school.

Well, I don't know what Fez was referring to but I remember my high school started around 7:30 - albeit it was just homeroom which I never went to, I think first period started around 7:50.  And middle school was like a half hour earlier IIRC.  If school started an hour later I definitely would've just, ya know, slept an hour later.

If you're referring to younger children (which kinda sounds like you are), I think the elementary school I went to started around 9, which is when I think it should be.  Weirdly, pretty sure my primary school (kindergarten-2nd) started at 8 though, when it shoulda been 9.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, DMC said:

If you're referring to younger children (which kinda sounds like you are), I think the elementary school I went to started around 9, which is when I think it should be.  Weirdly, pretty sure my primary school (kindergarten-2nd) started at 8 though, when it shoulda been 9.

Yes, I am talking about younger children (I worked with 5th and 7th graders). Reducing screen time in the mornings was one of the things we could point to and say it was clearly benefiting the kids. If I had to guess delaying starting time would probably increase said screen time, especially if the parents had to leave first. Personally I think the later starts would be more beneficial for HS students, but we're getting pretty off topic at this point.

[DMC]

6 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Yes, I am talking about younger children (I worked with 5th and 7th graders). Reducing screen time in the mornings was one of the things we could point to and say it was clearly benefiting the kids.

Definitely way off topic, but I guess my point is I don't think school should start before 9 for all kids, K-12.  If a school already starts at 9 then no, they shouldn't change it to ten just because of daylight savings.

[SpaceChampion]