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Star Trek: Strange New Gorns


SpaceChampion

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7 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

Rewatching TOS right now I only now realized how much the first movie is just a rehash of 'The Changeling'. And, man, when they remastered TOS why couldn't they remove Nomad's wire. At times it is glaringly obvious.

Hence it’s joke-title; ‘Where Nomad Has Gone Before’.

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3 minutes ago, DaveSumm said:

Hence it’s joke-title; ‘Where Nomad Has Gone Before’.

Did really nobody tell Gene that they have told that story before?

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17 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Sure enough, but it seems clear that Khan Noonien Singh and the crew of TOS thought it qualified as a name in 'Space Seed'.

In Space Seed he calls himself Khan because he doesn't want them to know he's Noonien Singh, and most of the crew would have no reason to be experts in whatever weird names were popular back in the 20th century. And it probably amuses him to get them all to effectively refer to him as Lord.

17 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

I could see the guy taking on the name 'Khan' once he became the Khan of whatever empire he carved out for himself ... but since it is Turkish/Mongolish title it is most definitely not a name/title the other augments would go with.

"Project Khan" suggests that the title wasn't his idea, and could have been given to all the augments created by the project.

17 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Frankly, if you think about it the chances that an American mad scientist like Evil Soong would go with 'Khan' as the code name for his project is not very likely.

Was it his project, or just a project he worked on? He would have been a more junior scientist back then, and his later solo work wasn't a great success (without Q not even Kore would have survived). Despite his passion for genetics, he seems to be better at engineering, with his shielding tech being world-changing in the Confederation timeline.

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1 minute ago, felice said:

In Space Seed he calls himself Khan because he doesn't want them to know he's Noonien Singh, and most of the crew would have no reason to be experts in whatever weird names were popular back in the 20th century. And it probably amuses him to get them all to effectively refer to him as Lord.

I'm not sure how you know what he wants there, nor why you think he would have thought it would be a good idea for him to go with the name 'Khan'. If I wanted to obscure my true identity I'd not go with my actual first name or title.

He certainly must have thought that calling himself 'Khan' would neither tip the crew of nor make them overly suspicious.

1 minute ago, felice said:

"Project Khan" suggests that the title wasn't his idea, and could have been given to all the augments created by the project.

Was it his project, or just a project he worked on? He would have been a more junior scientist back then, and his later solo work wasn't a great success (without Q not even Kore would have survived). Despite his passion for genetics, he seems to be better at engineering, with his shielding tech being world-changing in the Confederation timeline.

Certainly that's possible. I was going with the idea that we got that final scene there because the writers play around with the idea to do a show on the Eugenics Wars in the very near future, turning Evil Soong into the guy who creates the augments and begins the war. I mean, why else would they have had that entire plot and especially that ominous ending for his plotline in the last season of Picard?

Why also have a descendant of Khan's in SNW and Pike talk about the Eugenics Wars? This feels as if the writers do have plans for that era.

And there is just no way that in the Confederation timeline there was a devastating Eugenics War in the 1990s. I mean, Soong would not even try to clone folks if that had been the case, nor would anyone even consider funding his research projects.

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I didn't mind this episode. Sure it was the weakest of the 3 episode of SNW, but I still view it as light years better than Discovery and Picard's best. It hit all the right story beats, of a classic Trek story and gave me something to think about. It also told a very character driven story, which I'll always prefer to a plot driven story.

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Catching up on the last two episodes.  The dynamic of giving E terrine a sleeker look, while still having it be reminiscent of the 60s (when such polish wasn't really possible). Though at times, the ship feels...too big...a double decked sick bay? The engineering section looking like it came from the Kelvin ship. The bridge is a little spread out...

Oddly...I'm not as bothered by this, as I was by the monstrosity that was the Kelvin Enterprise. There's enough to give me a sense that this could be the ship Kirk will command in a few years...though I think the stories, thus far, being so reminiscent of what one thinks of as Star Trek helps.

And as a side note, is the Sam Kirk character supposed to have that Sam Rockwell from Galaxy Quest look...?

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6 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

And as a side note, is the Sam Kirk character supposed to have that Sam Rockwell from Galaxy Quest look...?

Could be intentional, if they make him the recurring punching bag, like "these aliens almost killed Sam!  those bastards!!"

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20 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

Catching up on the last two episodes.  The dynamic of giving E terrine a sleeker look, while still having it be reminiscent of the 60s (when such polish wasn't really possible). Though at times, the ship feels...too big...a double decked sick bay? The engineering section looking like it came from the Kelvin ship. The bridge is a little spread out...

Oddly...I'm not as bothered by this, as I was by the monstrosity that was the Kelvin Enterprise. There's enough to give me a sense that this could be the ship Kirk will command in a few years...though I think the stories, thus far, being so reminiscent of what one thinks of as Star Trek helps.

And as a side note, is the Sam Kirk character supposed to have that Sam Rockwell from Galaxy Quest look...?

I like that engineering is bigger. I would think a warp core should be huge considering how much power it requires. But I agree about the Abrams verse ships. Abrams decided he needed a full water treatment and power plant inside his ships.

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1 hour ago, Corvinus85 said:

I like that engineering is bigger. I would think a warp core should be huge considering how much power it requires. But I agree about the Abrams verse ships. Abrams decided he needed a full water treatment and power plant inside his ships.

Nothing is as bad as Discovery's turbolift void. The SNW Enterprise interior is nice, but too big and too glossy.

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Finished Discovery season four. Huge improvement in terms of being less...sappy and having people constantly tell Micheal how great she is. She is pretty great, too! I love the performance. I do hope season five is less serialized. Or at least DS9 style serialized.

Now I have to decide if I want to start Strange New Worlds or re-watch season two of Discovery first.

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22 minutes ago, RumHam said:

Finished Discovery season four. Huge improvement in terms of being less...sappy and having people constantly tell Micheal how great she is. She is pretty great, too! I love the performance. I do hope season five is less serialized. Or at least DS9 style serialized.

Now I have to decide if I want to start Strange New Worlds or re-watch season two of Discovery first.

So far only one episode of SNW has had a connection to Discovery, so it's honestly up to you if it's worth it.

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This last episode was pretty good. Who knew that all those little character featurettes released before the show were a foreshadowing to character focused episodes. 

Spoiler

I greatly enjoyed the swerve into a submarine hunt story with the brown dwarf. The black hole part was kinda iffy though.

 

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I enjoyed how they dealt with

Spoiler

the Gorn and La'an's story with them. The name is known in TOS, but it is a surprise to learn that they look like reptiles. It is kind of reminiscent of how Enterprise depicted the Romulans.

If I would have to guess how this story continues we are likely to see La'an overcome her issues and play a crucial role in negotiating the first Federation-Gorn treaty, ending the hostilities we get right now.

In TOS Federation settlers seem to have ventured unknowingly/unintentionally into Gorn space, causing the latter to destroy the colony.

I'm also getting even more pissed about that stupid Klingon War in Discovery since literally nothing indicates the Klingons nearly destroyed the Federation only a decade ago. They even reference a battle about twenty years before TOS which couldn't have happened now, thanks to Discovery claiming, the Federation didn't have contact with the Klingons for ages.

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27 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

I could have sworn the first mention/appearance of the Gorn is in TOS.  Having them in SNW is a retcon then...?

Think of TOS as more of a suggestion than canon. Or an alternate timeline. Please? This TOS stuff will drive us all mad. Mad, I tells ya. 

-

Shifting gears, Sam Kirk also did not appear in this episode. However, it's fair to say he definitely got knocked around a bit during the Gorn encounter. So I'm calling it: his perfect record of SNW episode trauma continues. 

By the end of the season he'll be a nervous wreck. Jitters, night terrors, loss of bowel/bladder control. He will be truly messed up. 

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19 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Think of TOS as more of a suggestion than canon. Or an alternate timeline. Please? This TOS stuff will drive us all mad. Mad, I tells ya. 

Nope. This is the hill I'm going to die on. They can do this show and still fit established canon. 

Well. They could.

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21 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

Nope. This is the hill I'm going to die on. They can do this show and still fit established canon. 

Well. They could.

Canon is archaic technology. They're using for more advanced technology by the 23rd century. Retroactive canons are a thing now. Also, with time travel possible...anything is possible. 

 

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1 hour ago, fionwe1987 said:

Canon is archaic technology. They're using for more advanced technology by the 23rd century. Retroactive canons are a thing now. Also, with time travel possible...anything is possible. 

 

:agree:

Seriously, with all the time travelling hoo-ha that takes place in this mythology, does anyone seriously think the timeline gets perfectly restored, every, single, ah, time? No threads left hanging? No? Jesus Christ, Seven of Nine got chased by the cops before engineering a prison break for crying out loud. They even left a guy back there because, aw, help yourself. I'm sorry, but suspension of disbelief will only take me so far.

Shit, James Kirk is probably his own grandmother by now. The in-universe characters probably can't keep it straight because their brains are half strawberry jam. And you humans are going to quibble about star dates? How dare you. How dare you, Sir or Madam.

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