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Viserys's Gift


Lyanna<3Rhaegar
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21 hours ago, Lyanna&lt;3Rhaegar said:

Right, I think Drogo, with his entire khalasar would have a hard time conquering the 7k. Maybe if some people deflected to Dany's side but the entire 7k united in a fight against them? No chance. 

True, but Illyrio and Varys believe they can control the Game of Thrones in Westeros - the fall into chaos and civil war, and the timing. It's sort of suggested in the conversation overheard by Arya: "Nonetheless we must have time. The princess is with child. The khal will not bestir himself until his son is born. You know how they are, these savages."

20 hours ago, Lyanna&lt;3Rhaegar said:

I don't know that a Targ bride was that coveted to Drogo or the Dothraki, of course we may get more info later suggesting such but as it stands I don't know. It's a possiblity I suppose. 

It has to be a possibility.

There's another big question out there, which is what do the Dothraki do with all their wealth, their winnings? They do nothing but make war, 'sell' slaves, and collect protection money, and it's very successful - there's a belief in Pentos that Drogo lives in a palace with a hundred silver doors, served by slaves in golden collars. But in fact the Dothraki live very simply.

The only solution is the Dothraki spend enormously on prestige items and gaining face with rival khals. Portable treasures like jewels, dragon eggs, horses and wives would be in high demand. The delicate bit would be disguising the fact that they're buying, but Dany's experience in the markets shows, they don't always have to try very hard.

20 hours ago, Lyanna&lt;3Rhaegar said:

Also, why, if Drogo intended on either giving some of his khalasar to Viserys to conquer the 7k OR conquering it himself & gifting Viserys the crown, would he act as if it is so absurd when Dany suggests it? If he already intended on doing it why would he argue that it is impossible - that they cannot cross the poisoned waters, that the earth ends in Essos, that Rhaego has no need of Iron chairs? Wouldn't the conversation between them have been different if he had already intended on doing this? 

There might be a parallel with Rhaegar and the TPTWP here. Suppose Drogo sees that he's now the most powerful khal there has ever been, and his mind turns to the prophecy of the Stallion, and he thinks that's what he's become. Obviously crossing the water to conquer isn't a problem for the Stallion, because that's included in the definition - so Drogo feels free to commit to that, but when the time comes, the costs and dangers of the project are still enormous, so he delays, trying to work out a plan.

Still, the costs and dangers can't be too enormous, because at the end of the day, he decides to go for it anyway.

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40 minutes ago, LynnS said:

 What do you think Drogo gave in return?  I think Illyrio was taking out an insurance policy by purchasing Drogo's favor.

I can't recall the passage but I think I remember Drogo giving him "gifts" tapestries & such or something of that nature. I'll see if I can find it. 

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7 minutes ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said:

I can't recall the passage but I think I remember Drogo giving him "gifts" tapestries & such or something of that nature. I'll see if I can find it. 

Slaves?

Quote

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys I

There came a soft knock on her door. "Come," Dany said, turning away from the window. Illyrio's servants entered, bowed, and set about their business. They were slaves, a gift from one of the magister's many Dothraki friends. There was no slavery in the free city of Pentos. Nonetheless, they were slaves. The old woman, small and grey as a mouse, never said a word, but the girl made up for it. She was Illyrio's favorite, a fair-haired, blue-eyed wench of sixteen who chattered constantly as she worked.

 

Edited by LynnS
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22 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

True, but Illyrio and Varys believe they can control the Game of Thrones in Westeros - the fall into chaos and civil war, and the timing. It's sort of suggested in the conversation overheard by Arya: "Nonetheless we must have time. The princess is with child. The khal will not bestir himself until his son is born. You know how they are, these savages."

Oh for sure, I don't disagree Illyrio & Varys probably thought this, I just think it would have been harder than they thought. Interesting though, this passage does suggest Drogo possibly knew he was expected to invade the 7k, though I still can't wrap my mind around why he acted so opposed to it when Dany suggested it, if that is the case. 

Possibly Illyrio had a plan in play to "encourage" Drogo to invadde the 7k, but Drogo was not privvy to it yet. 

24 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

It has to be a possibility.

Agreed. 

25 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

There's another big question out there, which is what do the Dothraki do with all their wealth, their winnings? They do nothing but make war, 'sell' slaves, and collect protection money, and it's very successful - there's a belief in Pentos that Drogo lives in a palace with a hundred silver doors, served by slaves in golden collars. But in fact the Dothraki live very simply.

The only solution is the Dothraki spend enormously on prestige items and gaining face with rival khals. Portable treasures like jewels, dragon eggs, horses and wives would be in high demand. The delicate bit would be disguising the fact that they're buying, but Dany's experience in the markets shows, they don't always have to try very hard.

I assumed they used the things they took to trade with other cities, like the stuff Drogo gave Illyrio, they use it to get wives, sell for money to buy things at market or maybe trade at market etc. There is also the Dosh Khaleen to consider, they leave statues & such of cities they have conquered there & must funnel some of the wealth into it else the Dosh Khaleen would have no food or anyway to live. 

28 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

There might be a parallel with Rhaegar and the TPTWP here. Suppose Drogo sees that he's now the most powerful khal there has ever been, and his mind turns to the prophecy of the Stallion, and he thinks that's what he's become. Obviously crossing the water to conquer isn't a problem for the Stallion, because that's included in the definition - so Drogo feels free to commit to that, but when the time comes, the costs and dangers of the project are still enormous, so he delays, trying to work out a plan.

Still, the costs and dangers can't be too enormous, because at the end of the day, he decides to go for it anyway.

Definitely possible. I suppose the language barrier is something to be considered also. Supposing this is true, that he comes to believe he is the Stallion & is trying to work out the details, doesn't this mean that prior to believing he was the stallion he had no intention of invading though? & so logically follows that he had not promised Illyrio to give the 7k to Viserys? 

Another thing to think about is that the Dosh Khaleen specifically told him his son is the Stallion. This is prior to his agreement to invade Westeros. Why would he think he was the Stallion when his "wise women" told him it was his son? 

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@LynnS I found it, not tapestries & yes some slaves:

 

aGoT Chapter 11:

"Illyrio could afford to be lavish. He had collected a fortune in horses and slaves for his part in selling her to Khal Drogo." 

I thought there were other things, but I must've been mistkaken. 

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9 minutes ago, Lyanna&lt;3Rhaegar said:

@LynnS I found it, not tapestries & yes some slaves:

aGoT Chapter 11:

"Illyrio could afford to be lavish. He had collected a fortune in horses and slaves for his part in selling her to Khal Drogo." 

I thought there were other things, but I must've been mistkaken. 

Don't worry about it.  Slaves, horses and other accumulated treasures makes sense.  

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34 minutes ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said:

Another thing to think about is that the Dosh Khaleen specifically told him his son is the Stallion. This is prior to his agreement to invade Westeros. Why would he think he was the Stallion when his "wise women" told him it was his son? 

Absolutely, Drogo's belief in himself as Stallion would just collapse as soon as the Dosh Khaleen fixed on Rhaego. And probably before that his self-belief was draining away a bit in the face of the Westeros problem - but at the time of the marriage negotiations, he could have felt like the Stallion. He had never once been defeated, after all.

It does require that the Stallion myth is well known, but that's ok. Jorah knows it, he was the one who told Dany.

ETA

(I assume his agreement to invade Westeros happened in Pentos.)

Edited by Springwatch
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2 hours ago, Springwatch said:

Absolutely, Drogo's belief in himself as Stallion would just collapse as soon as the Dosh Khaleen fixed on Rhaego. And probably before that his self-belief was draining away a bit in the face of the Westeros problem - but at the time of the marriage negotiations, he could have felt like the Stallion. He had never once been defeated, after all.

It does require that the Stallion myth is well known, but that's ok. Jorah knows it, he was the one who told Dany.

ETA

(I assume his agreement to invade Westeros happened in Pentos.)

I gotcha, so you think maybe Drogo originally believed he was the stallion & this is why he agreed to gift Viserys the IT? But then upon hearing his son was it changed his mind, until the attempt on Dany's life? 

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Regarding the stallion, Drogo never mentions it. Him and Dany seemed to have a good marriage where their love transgresses disagreements and they wind up talking most things through together, Drogos injury, all the slaves, all the rape and destruction, etc. Neither mince words, so if Drogos actually this fundamentalist but who sees Jesus everytime he looks in the mirror, well I think we would have heard about that.

 

A strong possibility is Illyrio doesn't know what he's doing. More like, shooting baskets with his eyes closed. He's got these Targaryens in his backyard and some Dothraki on his porch, maybe they can help Young Griff? It can't hurt. (Lol of course it does)

They're supposed to show up to the GC like Young Griff is calling in the banners, how could Viserys or those who may owe Viserys loyalty expect to do that?

Dothraki see the world in favors and honor and stuff, not some medieval call to arms like, so I don't think Illyrio really had a concert plan.

 

What did Drogo think, idk. He certainly knew Viserys was a king, king cart was his nickname after all. If I were to guess, it was on Drogos to do list but he probably didn't want to because Viserys was so annoying and he seemed to think Westeros is the size of Dragonstone and not really a priority or anything difficult that needs to be addressed thoroughly.

 

(iirc jorah killed 2 of Drogos bloodriders? Idk about the third but I'm pretty sure they're all dead. Danys current bloodriders were the ones tasked with bringing her to the widows old folks home but changed their minds pretty quickly)

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56 minutes ago, Hugorfonics said:

if Drogos actually this fundamentalist but who sees Jesus everytime he looks in the mirror, well I think we would have heard about that.

How would you tell?? The Stallion's programme of killing/destroying/enslaving everything is not so different to any other khal's. Drogo just happens to be better at it than anyone else at the time. He might confide in Dany sometimes, maybe, but I never thought of it - he seems the strong, silent type to me. Actually, he makes me think of the samurai in the book 'Shogun' - they always projected strength and certainty, hid pain and doubt, saved face constantly, and never truly confided in anyone.

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24 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

How would you tell?? The Stallion's programme of killing/destroying/enslaving everything is not so different to any other khal's.

Sure it is;

"As swift as the wind he rides, and behind him his khalasar covers the earth, YadaYadaYada Fierce as a storm this prince will be. His enemies will tremble before him, YadaYadaYada, and the milk men in the stone tents will fear his name."

.

The Stallion will invade Westeros.

27 minutes ago, Springwatch said:

Drogo just happens to be better at it than anyone else at the time. He might confide in Dany sometimes, maybe, but I never thought of it - he seems the strong, silent type to me. Actually, he makes me think of the samurai in the book 'Shogun' - they always projected strength and certainty, hid pain and doubt, saved face constantly, and never truly confided in anyone.

Idk they seemed close. They like actually talked things out wich is more then any couple can say, Ned and Cat kinda, they seemed to frustrate each other. 

But Drogo doesn't want to invade milked men in stoned tents, he's not silent about that

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On 4/11/2022 at 10:19 AM, frenin said:

They aren't honour bound to follow a weak leader tho. And since the Dothraki, per the text, followonly strenght, any scheme in which a blood rider is taking Viserys's orders is moot. Perhaps that's when Jorah comes in play, it's much more easier seeing the blood riders following Jorah. Drogo himself afterwards makes it clear he has no intention of crossing the narrow sea and only changes his mind after Dany is the target of an assasination attempt.

Btw, Illyrio does tell Tyrion he expected Dany to die. Yeah that plan sounds messier the more thoughts you give it.

They are honor-bound to obey their khal. They aren't following Viserys. They cant even talk to Viserys. They will follow whatever bloodrider or general Drogo sends to lead the army. And he doesn't have to "take orders" from Viserys. They are just going there for plunder, and since Viserys knows the land and where all the good plunder is, they'll stick with him -- until he blows it. Remember, Illyrio doesn't need the Dothraki to put Viserys on the Iron Throne -- that's fAegon's role -- just to stir up the continent. Once they land on Westerosi soil, Illyrio doesn't care what happens to Viserys. All he wants is for Drogo to provide Vis with this army, and he wouldn't give away two Targaryens and three dragon eggs if he wasn't certain that's what he'll get in return.

If I'm not mistaken, Drogo says he no longer cares about the iron throne after he kills Viserys. So by then it was a moot point, to him, only until the attempt on Dany is made.

Of course Illyrio expected Dany to die. She's a meek, shy 13yo girl and he just sent her off with a band of savages as the bride to their bloodthirsty king. Who wouldn't expect her to die? And there is no mess in this as far as Illyrio is concerned. All he wants is the army for Viserys.

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9 minutes ago, John Suburbs said:

They are honor-bound to obey their khal. They aren't following Viserys.

If Drogo gives Viserys a part of his Khalassar they are following Viserys.

 

10 minutes ago, John Suburbs said:

All he wants is for Drogo to provide Vis with this army, and he wouldn't give away two Targaryens and three dragon eggs if he wasn't certain that's what he'll get in return.

Why not? He would need to anyway or Pentos gets sacked, the marriage was as much as a way to get Drogo (hopefully) on board as it was a bribe to get him to spare Pentos. Dany and Viserys are obviously worth that, besides that the Targs by the time Illyrio allows them in worthed nothing. The dragon eggs i assume are more valuable but they are very rare stones, a rich fella like Illyrio could afford to lose them.

 

14 minutes ago, John Suburbs said:

If I'm not mistaken, Drogo says he no longer cares about the iron throne after he kills Viserys. So by then it was a moot point, to him, only until the attempt on Dany is made.

No, he doesn't say that he no longer cares about it, he says that he's desinterested in it. Drogo never gave any kind of impression that he had any intention to humor an invasion idea until Dany's targeted, which is what despaired both Dany and Viserys.

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On 4/11/2022 at 11:27 AM, Lyanna&lt;3Rhaegar said:

I don't know that a Targ bride was that coveted to Drogo or the Dothraki, of course we may get more info later suggesting such but as it stands I don't know. It's a possiblity I suppose. 

Indeed that's the question, what is Illyrio's plan? Illyrio wanted Viserys to stay with him while Dany traveled with the Dothraki, did he think Drogo was going to bring part of his army back to them? Illyrio smirks at Viserys regularly, Dany sees that. I have a hard time believing Illyrio thought it would be of benefit to him for Viserys to lead any army, in fact, I can't seem him wanting Viserys to obtain the IT at all. 

A poster above suggested maybe Dany & Viserys were meant as sacrifices for the eggs to be hatched, intending on giving them to Aegon. It's possible. 

Right, I know they are honor bound until a stronger khal comes along but we don't have any thing setting any precendence for trading or gifting of armies. If Drogo tells them to listen to Viserys - something I find highly unlikely  - first & foremost Drogo is a proud man, Dothraki are a proud people, they call Viserys cart king, they make fun of him, they see him as weak & useless. What kind of Khal would Drogo be to tell his screamers to follow the useless, weak, cart kings, command? I think telling them to do so would likely make them deflect looking for a better khal. This seems in direct opposition to the Dothraki way. 

Also, why, if Drogo intended on either giving some of his khalasar to Viserys to conquer the 7k OR conquering it himself & gifting Viserys the crown, would he act as if it is so absurd when Dany suggests it? If he already intended on doing it why would he argue that it is impossible - that they cannot cross the poisoned waters, that the earth ends in Essos, that Rhaego has no need of Iron chairs? Wouldn't the conversation between them have been different if he had already intended on doing this? 

Of course he coveted a Targaryen bride. If he didn't want it he wouldn't have married her. She is blood of the dragon. His line can only be enhanced, if only in people's imaginations, by fathering sons on her.

Yes, Illyrio has been dealing with Dothraki, and probably Drogo in particular, for quite some time. He would not do this if he wasn't absolutely sure that Drogo would deliver. He didn't get to where he did in life by being trusting or foolish.

Especially now that the fAegon plot has been revealed, why would anyone think Illyrio's plan for Viserys was to make him king? And even before that, we can see that Illyrio is pretty contemptuous of him. Viserys is not hard to read, and again, Illyrio would not be where he is today if he was not a good judge of character.

As I mentioned above, Viserys is not leading this army. He can't even speak to it. They will follow whatever bloodrider Drogo chooses, and their primary objective will be plunder. Viserys is the only one among them who knows where the good plunder is and who can find allies on the continent. And when it all goes tits up and they end up killing him in short order, well, that's all to the good because now there is a horde of Dothraki running amok in Westeros that fAegon can conquer. I honestly think that what's tripping you up is the idea that Illyrio wanted to put Viserys on the throne, but that idea has been eliminated. All Illyrio needs is to get the Dothraki to Westeros.

If the plan was to hatch eggs with D & V, then why did he give all of this away to the Dothraki? That just means these rabid, mongol horselords now have dragons. The entire continent would burn. He has all the ingredients to hatch these eggs himself, so why wouldn't he just do it?

Drogo only rejected the idea of he himself conquering the 7K and giving Dany the Iron Throne, and only after Viserys was dead. Once that happened, the deal was off and Drogo no longer had any skin in this game -- until the attempt was made on Dany.

So in short, I think your confusion rests on two false assumptions:

-That Illyrio's plan was to put Viserys on the throne

-And that he got conned by Drogo into getting his bride

Neither of these is born out by the facts in the text.

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25 minutes ago, frenin said:

If Drogo gives Viserys a part of his Khalassar they are following Viserys.

 

Why not? He would need to anyway or Pentos gets sacked, the marriage was as much as a way to get Drogo (hopefully) on board as it was a bribe to get him to spare Pentos. Dany and Viserys are obviously worth that, besides that the Targs by the time Illyrio allows them in worthed nothing. The dragon eggs i assume are more valuable but they are very rare stones, a rich fella like Illyrio could afford to lose them.

 

No, he doesn't say that he no longer cares about it, he says that he's desinterested in it. Drogo never gave any kind of impression that he had any intention to humor an invasion idea until Dany's targeted, which is what despaired both Dany and Viserys.

No, they are not following Viserys. Few of them will ever even see him. They follow Drogo's general, and by extension, Drogo. As far as they are concerned, Viserys is just showing them where to plunder. And they cannot refuse to go, or else Drogo will slaughter them all and chop their bodies into little pieces and scatter them on the ground so they cannot ride the nightlands. That's all Illyrio needs, to get the Dothraki to Westeros. After that, Viserys is expendable.

Drogo would not even know Illyrio had Dany if he didn't offer her up. He's been paying off the Dothraki with far less than a Targaryen bride for years, so why would he even let him know he had her when he could just pay him off as usual? And if he is giving them both away just to prevent Pentos from being plundered, then why does he think he's getting an army out of the deal?

Dany is blood of the dragon. How could that do anything but enhance Drogo's bloodline, even if only in people's imaginations? 

Doesn't care vs "disinterested", that's pretty much the same thing. Semantics aside, we barely hear Drogo speak about anything until he kills Viserys. Viserys is upset because it's not happening fast enough, but this is no surprise to Illyrio because he knows Drogo has to take Dany to VD, give her the test, get the word from the DK . . .  Again, Illyrio didn't get to where he is in life by being trusting or foolish with has valuables. He would not make this deal unless he was absolutely sure he benefits in return. There is no reason to think Drogo would have gone back on his word had Viserys not threatened his unborn son. That's pretty much a deal-breaker.

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1 hour ago, Hugorfonics said:

Sure it is;

"As swift as the wind he rides, and behind him his khalasar covers the earth, YadaYadaYada Fierce as a storm this prince will be. His enemies will tremble before him, YadaYadaYada, and the milk men in the stone tents will fear his name."

.

The Stallion will invade Westeros.

Idk they seemed close. They like actually talked things out wich is more then any couple can say, Ned and Cat kinda, they seemed to frustrate each other. 

But Drogo doesn't want to invade milked men in stoned tents, he's not silent about that

Could be Qartheen, but it's a fair point anyway - the Stallion mounts the world. Doesn't rule out Drogo though, because in the event the Stallion actually arrived, his early career would look much like Drogo's.

It's true he doesn't like the look of a campaign in Westeros. But I think @John Suburbs is right saying we only see Drogo speaking against the idea when Viserys is dead. And obviously, if Rhaego is the Stallion, then Drogo knows he himself is not - so he doesn't even have destiny on his side.

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9 hours ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said:

I think the question is why would Drogo be looking to marry a woman with Valyrian ancestry? Surely, if he is hip on the dragon stuff he knows they died a long time ago & that no one has been able to successfully hatch more eggs. Maybe Illyrio convinced him he knows how? But that leads us back to the question, why did Drogo not mention it? Not tell Dany to do whatever it was Illyrio thought would hatch them? 

Well, legends die hard, histories and tales are passed on orally by unlettered people.  Whey wouldn't the Dothraki have their own tales, stories, superstitions and prophecies about the Valyrians? The Valyrians were mighty and powerful, they rode dragons, they disintegrated in a fiery hell. Surely that is remembered and preserved in one form or other, hazy as it may be. The Targs tried again and again to hatch eggs as Stannis reminded us, and Rhaegar, an educated man, believed in prophecy, why not Drogo or the Dothraki? Daenerys handmaidens told her about the legend of Qarth, a tale presumably much older than Old Valyria, Jorah had heard the Stallion prophecy. If he was aware of it then Drogo must have been, though why he never mentioned it to his wife, I do not know. Perhaps they simply had too few words. Dany was the one doing her best to learn the Dothraki language. 

I had another read of the relevant chapters and came across this passage. You can really feel the anticipation and tension after Dany successfully finishes with the heart and everyone is waiting for the proclamation of the one-eyed crone of the dosh khaleen:

Quote

As the smoke ascended, the chanting died away and the ancient crone closed her single eye, the better to peer into the future. The silence that fell was complete. Dany could hear the distant call of night birds, the hiss and crackle of the torches, the gentle lapping of water from the lake. The Dothraki stared at her with eyes of night, waiting. Khal Drogo laid his hand on Dany’s arm. She could feel the tension in his fingers. Even a khal as mighty as Drogo could know fear when the dosh khaleen peered into smoke of the future. At her back, her handmaids fluttered anxiously. Finally, the crone opened her eye and lifted her arms. “I have seen his face, and heard the thunder of his hooves,” she proclaimed in a thin, wavery voice.

There is a hightend sense of expectancy here. Dany had successfully devoured the heart but was that enough? Drogo is nervous and tense, there is complete silence. The reader doesn't know what's coming next but Drogo's tension reveals that whatever the crone does or says next is of great importance to him personally. I also find it interesting that Daenerys is allowed to name the child. It's a pity we don't know more about Dothraki customs. Drogo seemed well pleased with Dany's choice after she explains Rhaego is named after her warrior brother. 

 

9 hours ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said:

What makes the Dothraki sea the best place to hatch dragons? Far away from other eyes, sure but why would it need to be in the midst of a strong Khal who never lost a battle? 

Besides the element of secrecy, there's the question of security, should dragons actually hatch. We later find out that the Yunkai lust for dragons and can imagine that there are many the world over who would like to own such a beast and who would be prepared to fight a war over ownership as well. A strong khal with a great khalasaar, one personally invested in the prophecy would be a better guarantee against such threats than say Illyrio hatching dragons in his backyard. The khalasaar disbanded after Drogo's death but before the three dragons saw the light of the world. Only a paltry few remained with Dany. What would have happened had the dragons hatched prior to that? More bloodshed, I imagine, with differing motives. 

8 hours ago, Springwatch said:

It's sort of suggested in the conversation overheard by Arya: "Nonetheless we must have time. The princess is with child. The khal will not bestir himself until his son is born. You know how they are, these savages."

In the event that Illyrio led Viserys into thinking he would receive an army in return for his sister, I wonder if Illyrio lied to Varys about the army as well. If so, why? Possibly because he knew that revealing any plot to hatch dragons might alienate Varys? Varys must have been familiar with Targ attempts to raise dragons and probably also knew that sorcery was involved. He hated sorcery and magic because of his own first hand experience with it and might not have approved at all. 

Whatever the details, I think the idea that Illyrio concieved a plan to hatch dragons and deluded Viserys to get him to part with his sister for an army has merit. GRRM usually gives a hint or two regarding hidden plots within the story. How about this one:

This is Viserys talking to Daenerys shortly before she meets the Khal:

Quote

Khal Drogo has never lost a fight. He is Aegon the Dragonlord come again, and you will be his queen.”

Viserys compares Drogo to Aegon the Dragonlord. Not Aegon the Conqueror but Aegon the Dragonlord. I searched all five books. "Aegon the Dragonlord" appears only once. He is otherwise always spoken of as Aegon the Conqueror. 

 

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9 hours ago, Lyanna&lt;3Rhaegar said:

Why? The dragons are small & fairly harmless when they hatch & this is ultimately what happens - dragons hatch in Essos & it doesn't appear to be suicidal for anyone. 

Well, first off they are small and harmless for a while. But between now and when they become city destroyers they are in the power of the greatest army on the continent. So what happens when is all within Dothraki control and you just gave them the weapon that will grow to overcome their only marital weakness, besieging heavily fortified cities with ports. What happened to Drogo AND subsequently Dany gaining and maintaining her freedom and control of the dragons took so many extremely unlikely events that only a prophet or madman would have foretold it. Otherwise you’re ~ giving nukes to the Mongols who operate next door. 

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1 hour ago, Springwatch said:

Could be Qartheen,

Lol

1 hour ago, Springwatch said:

Could be Qartheen, but it's a fair point anyway - the Stallion mounts the world. Doesn't rule out Drogo though, because in the event the Stallion actually arrived, his early career would look much like Drogo's.

Drogos dad was a famous khal too, his mom must have ate a horse heart at a strip club too. There were no prophecies of baby Drogo then, I mean if there was then idk why the widows were so gassed when looking at Dany

50 minutes ago, Evolett said:

I searched all five books. "Aegon the Dragonlord" appears only once. He is otherwise always spoken of as Aegon the Conqueror

Nah that's Aegon the dragon. (I think it sounds cooler.) It's not as common as conquerer, but it's pretty common

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Tut-tut, says my son, don't you want your sweetling to be queen? You Starks were kings once, the Arryns and the Lannisters as well, and even the Baratheons through the female line, but the Tyrells were no more than stewards until Aegon the Dragon came along and cooked the rightful King of the Reach on the Field of Fire.

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"There are ghosts here," Bran said. Hodor had heard all the stories before, but Jojen might not have. "Old ghosts, from before the Old King, even before Aegon the Dragon, seventy-nine deserters who went south to be outlaws.

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"If Daenerys is no more than a sweet young girl, the Iron Throne will cut her into sweet young pieces."

"Fear not, my little friend. The blood of Aegon the Dragon flows in her veins."

 

 

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