New Peek at House of the Dragon

[Ran]

If you just punch up the contrast a bit in VLC, it honestly just looks better for the most part. They over-did it the darkness for me. I even pulled it into Premiere and messed with grading a bit and just a little bump in saturation, a stop of added exposure, and a touch of contrast does wonders. Still dark, but there's more separation of figures and you see more detail. 

It really could just be a trailer thing, though. They could easily have graded the whole thing to look similar throughout because, well, it's a trailer. 

[Lord Varys]

I must say the writing also does not seem that great - this kind of talk about history remembering names sounds generic and unimaginative ... hopefully that's just a trailer voiceover and not Daemon's actual show dialogue.

Viserys I doesn't look like a party king at all. That guy should be played with a smile and laugh all the time, a happy benevolent face ... he shouldn't look like Stannis when he is about the face Selyse in the marriage bed.

Don't like dragon eggs in braziers, either. We already had that ... and it doesn't happen in that era. Please no weirdo show writer fan fiction about the Targaryens hatching their dragon eggs in their kitchen braziers.

And, man, does the Velaryon funeral look silly. They dump a stone sacophagus into the sea? What kind of nonsense is this? We get the description of Corlys Velaryon's own funeral in FaB. Use that as template. But if this is truly Laena's or Laenor's funeral then ... why not give them a Targaryen funeral? They are both dragonriders, after all - royalty beyond any doubt,

What I actually did like is the indication that they will really show how Daemon is pissed about Rhaenyra being named Heir Apparent. Strangely enough, I also liked Otto Hightower - he seems to be played as the methodical and thoughtful man he seems to be.

I hope they don't play up the drama queen aspects of 'the Westerosi don't want female rulers' (I liked the Rhaenys actress there, but not necessarily what she said - nobody wants to destroy everything just to stop a woman from ascending the throne - they are not that mad). They rejected Rhaenys ... but this doesn't mean they have to reject Rhaenyra as well. After all, it is quite a different thing to be the only child of a king and his chosen heir, and the granddaughter of a king who also happens to have living sons and grandsons.

You also get this kind of the over-the-top violence and hysteria with Alicent blatant and open attempt to either murder/mutilate/disfigure Rhaenyra or (one of) her sons. Things like that border on the unintentional funny because the characters involved can only lose. Viserys I couldn't allow something like that to stand ... unless he is a completely weak and inefficent king. If Cersei had tried to personally stab Ned or Arya in the wake of the Mycah affair in front of the court this would have had consequences, too. Aside from that, it takes away subtlety and intrigue and turns something that could have been festering poison into an overly explicit show of force/violence. We will get there during the Dance, but even then Alicent Hightower is more the subtle poisoner/schemer, not the manwoman trying to stab women or children.

A kind of underlying issue I find interesting and potentially intriguing is that the show might portray Daemon and Rhaenyra as secret co-conspirators whose eventual marriage is not going to be an accident. They seem to forge a blood pact on the beach, indicating that at least they both feel their enemies fucked them hard earlier.

Is it Laenor who is dumped in front of somebody?

And what do you think is in that weirdo chest they carry into the throne room?

Is evil beating guy with Jon Snow vibes Criston Cole?

[Lord Varys]

4 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

OMG I can’t believe they have Alicent trying to stab Rhaenyra in the face with a dagger 

Speaking of Alicent, she really does look neurotic in every shot of her. It looks like they might frame her marriage to Viserys as pimping by her father, which would make her more sympathetic. Speaking of which, how much do you want to bet that she’ll have an affair with Criston Cole on the show? (It also looks like we’re getting that scene of   Criston beating the living crap out of Joffrey).

I interpreted Otto's lines as Alicent being able and wanting to go through with their plan. But, of course, daddy would have prepared her for that role from the start.

Criston Cole and Alicent having an affair is certainly something that superficially there in the text as well. They are very close after Rhaenyra dumped Criston, especially during the detailed account of the beginning of the Dance. This is something that could have happened but the two were discreet enough so that contemporaries and historians never picked up on it.

If they do something like that, they should portray it as a, well, sexual relationship among co-conspirators/allies (or even sex and (feigned) affection as means to control close allies) not as an actual romance on both parts.

I think the Alicent character wouldn't benefit from the addition of a genuine romance in her life. Rather she should be a character whose revolves completely around her political agenda ... especially after she has her children.

4 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

There’s a shot of Daemon and Rhaenyra’s wedding with them both looking happy, so maybe Rhaenyra will be in love with Daemon as a teen in this version. In addition to Rhaenyra not speaking a word, we don’t see any of the kids or elder Strongs. Who was the guy they were throwing down on the ground?

If you mean the guy who is dumped in front of somebody else he looked like a Velaryon, so perhaps Laenor? No idea about the context there, though.

4 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

And dear LORD does Rhaenys’ wig look bad. I’m interested in seeing how her line about men not allowing women to ascend the Iron Throne goes over with Dany stans. I think that’s still an open wound.

In relation to Rhaenys I think they completely dropped the ball by giving her the silly fake Valyrian hair. George himself corrected that mistake, so why not have one black-haired Targaryen if there can be dark-skinned Velaryons? It would have been even a nice nod to the strong Baratheon seed. They could even give us a veiled reference to Ned reading the book - which actually was a pretty nice scene in GoT.

[Sotan]

31 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

Is it Laenor who is dumped in front of somebody?

And what do you think is in that weirdo chest they carry into the throne room?

I don't think its Laenor, the guy has straight hair. Could be Daemon (he has short hair in the Laenor/Rhaenyra wedding fast scene), or Aegon II. 

The chest looks to be carried in by robed men in what looks like Harrenhall, probably GC votes. 

[IFR]

2 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

Maybe I’m just getting to be too cynical, but this teaser seems to be getting a lot of praise on social media and I’m. . . kind of suspicious? It didn’t reveal all that much more than the first teaser, and there was a lot of negativity around that one.

Probably because competition in filling the "Game of Thrones vacuum" is so lacking. You get misfires like the Wheel of Time, laughably mediocre stuff like The Witcher, generic stuff like Shadow and Bone, etc.

This teaser had a bit too much CG for my taste, and the wigs look absurd, but it seemed like there was something approaching what could be a good story there. Compare that to the Lord of the Rings teaser, which was just a random ejaculation of underwhelming computer generated imagery.

Edit: I haven't been keeping up with this show, and I haven't read the source material. Is there an in world explanation for why there's a black Targaryen?

[Lord Varys]

2 minutes ago, Sotan said:

I don't think its Laenor, the guy has straight hair. Could be Daemon (he has short hair in the Laenor/Rhaenyra wedding fast scene), or Aegon II.

Yes, you are right. Just thought the guy was also dark-skinned, but the Velaryon all seem to have their 'Valyrian locks'.

I guess then chances are good that it is either Aegon or Aemond - the latter perhaps in the wake of Vhagar incident.

2 minutes ago, Sotan said:

The chest looks to be carried in by robed men in what looks like Harrenhall, probably GC votes. 

Yes, that might be it.

Can anybody believe that this Viserys is in love with Alicent, by the way? The scene where she kisses him on the cheek seems to depict a couple that is everything but in love. Yet one of the crucial parts of Viserys-Alicent would be to depict especially him as a man who is very much in love with his wife - to the point that he defied his family and the Realm to a point when he chose to marry her. Things between them can certainly change later in life but if you think about the defining quality of their relationship it would be Viserys' love for Alicent.

Must say despite the fact that Emma D'Arcy doesn't say (or do) anything of note in the trailer, Rhaenyra certainly seems to be the core character in the show. If she works as a character, this thing will work - and despite not having heard a single word from D'Arcy so far I really hope that's going to be the role for.

[Ran]

19 minutes ago, IFR said:

Is there an in world explanation for why there's a black Targaryen?

That's Corlys Velaryon, who is of Valyrian descent. We don't know what the explanation is in the show. 

I noticed a number of other pale-haired black performers in the scene with Alicent and the knife, and I think all evidence points to the whole Velaryon extended family being black. This suggests that rather than the fan theory that Corlys's mother was a Summer Islander or from the Basilisks, that the family is basically just black as far back as living memory shows. This probably suggests that they are largely intermarrying among themselves (and with other black Valyrians who migrated to Dragonstone?).

 

I do think this trailer conveys a much more consistent sense of drama than similar trailers (The Witcher, Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power) have done. It feels like there's a real story to be told. Combine with quality cinematography and production values, and yeah, some dragons, and people who were turned off by the GoT finale or final seasons may be feeling a pang of recognition.

[The Dragon Demands]

Curious…while the English subtitles say “Rickard Stark”, other language subtitles such as Portuguese and Polish say “Rickon Stark”.

Either the English subtitles are in error…or, no one told the non English subtitlers.

[Sotan]

Interesting that its Corlys who begins and ends the voice over talking about legacy and leaving behind a name. Considering what he puts up with in pursuit of that, pretty on the mark. 

[The Young Maester]

I do hope the first season isnt all dark and serious with everyone on edge and walking around with straight faces.

[The Bard of Banefort]

37 minutes ago, The Dragon Demands said:

Curious…while the English subtitles say “Rickard Stark”, other language subtitles such as Portuguese and Polish say “Rickon Stark”.

Either the English subtitles are in error…or, no one told the non English subtitlers.

Does HBO delete negative comments on their posts? This seems like the sort of thing you would know 

[Sotan]

2 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Can anybody believe that this Viserys is in love with Alicent, by the way? The scene where she kisses him on the cheek seems to depict a couple that is everything but in love.

The scene where she kisses him looks to be at Laenor and Rhaenyra's wedding feast. She would've had Aegon and Aemond by then and her father is no longer HOTK for pushing for Aegon's succession over Rhaenyra. Makes sense that Rhaenyra's wedding and the future ascension of the Velaryons would be a tense time. 

[The Bard of Banefort]

1 minute ago, Sotan said:

The scene where she kisses him looks to be at Laenor and Rhaenyra's wedding feast. She would've had Aegon and Aemond by then and her father is no longer HOTK for pushing for Aegon's succession over Rhaenyra. Makes sense that Rhaenyra's wedding and the future ascension of the Velaryons would be a tense time. 

I don’t think so. That looked like young Alicent.

[Sotan]

28 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I don’t think so. That looked like young Alicent.

They're going to have young Alicent marry Viserys and have kids with him. It'll be creepy, but that's where they are going. Aegon and Aemond are toddlers when Rhaenyra and Laenor marry.  With young Alicent as a very young mother it explains how older Alicent could be a grandmother in the main timeline. 

Edit: They might make Aegon and Aemond babies, but I definitely believe it'll be young Alicent who will marry Viserys. 

[Colonel Green]

5 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

I must say the writing also does not seem that great - this kind of talk about history remembering names sounds generic and unimaginative ... hopefully that's just a trailer voiceover and not Daemon's actual show dialogue.

That's not Daemon, that's Corlys.

5 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

Viserys I doesn't look like a party king at all. That guy should be played with a smile and laugh all the time, a happy benevolent face ... he shouldn't look like Stannis when he is about the face Selyse in the marriage bed.

He has plenty of things to not smile about in the course of this show.

5 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

And, man, does the Velaryon funeral look silly. They dump a stone sacophagus into the sea? What kind of nonsense is this?

Seems a plausible enough funereal rite.

5 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

I hope they don't play up the drama queen aspects of 'the Westerosi don't want female rulers' (I liked the Rhaenys actress there, but not necessarily what she said - nobody wants to destroy everything just to stop a woman from ascending the throne - they are not that mad).

Large sections of Westerosi society not wanting a female ruler is one of the central dynamics of this story. There's a reason that women have virtually never held any throne outside of Dorne.

[Lord Varys]

12 minutes ago, Colonel Green said:

That's not Daemon, that's Corlys.

Didn't bother with the subtitles which identify speakers earlier. But did anyone actually recognize the guy's voice? Still, though, it is kind of generic although I have to admit Corlys has somewhat more motivation to say something like that.

12 minutes ago, Colonel Green said:

He has plenty of things to not smile about in the course of this show.

He would ... if he cared about acknowledging that his family grow to loathe each other. But he doesn't - that's his crucial character trait. The other is that a he is a very generous, very happy people person.

Both Rhaenyra's investiture as Heir Apparent and her wedding should be fun and joyful occasions - feasts the king actually enjoys, even if some of his subjects do not (one could show Rhaenyra and Criston not being happy with her marriage, say, but everybody else would be). One could depict some malcontents in the background, but in this time and age they would not complain or scowl to the king's face. Not even Daemon would do that.

Instead the show seems to portray things as if Viserys was the king of a bunch of ambitious sharks he has to keep in line with being the toughest shark himself - but that's not who he is. He is fun guy, a man who rules with charisma and generosity if he rules at all.

The way to do the first season of this show is give the impression that life was a gigantic, never-ending party. As the story progresses there could be signs that things aren't that great after all. But the imagery of that show basically sends the message life is hard and sucks for everyone and we all are just waiting for the big war. That's not the age of Viserys I.

12 minutes ago, Colonel Green said:

Seems a plausible enough funereal rite.

To me it looks like dumping a stone into the bay ... like garbage, basically. In part that's because the stone sarcophagus doesn't fall in a pleasant manner ... but in general this is just ridiculous if you consider Targaryen funeral rites (and thus, presumably, Valyrian funeral rites in general - the Targaryens wouldn't be the only Valyrian family who cremated their dead). Building a marble sarcophagus usually means you want the body to be preserved after death in some fashion. You don't dump it into the ocean nor do you burn it. If the Targaryens burn their dead, the Velaryons should not try to preserve theirs under the sea. Their customs should be quite similar ... as they are in the books.

12 minutes ago, Colonel Green said:

Large sections of Westerosi society not wanting a female ruler is one of the central dynamics of this story. There's a reason that women have virtually never held any throne outside of Dorne.

Yes, yes, I don't argue with the principal conflict so much as the language used there. It is just nonsense that people would rather torch everything than see a woman on the Iron Throne. The majority opinion is that women shouldn't rule ... but that's because it is a patriarchal society. And quite frankly, because it is a patriarchal society folks could actually swallow one exception - they would know that one female monarch means they are going to make sure it will be long, long time if they get one of them again (just wait and see when there is going to be another female chancellor over here in Germany). The way Rhaenys presents it is that folks would fight with everything they got against the idea of a Queen Regnant. And that's just not how it is. Folks voted against Rhaenys and her son, they didn't attack her, and half of Westeros ended up supporting Rhaenyra ... while the other only fought for Aegon II because his mother and grandfather crowned him first. If there hadn't been strife in the royal family the people would have fallen in line.

This kind of language is overly dramatic, bordering on sensationalism - just like Alicent mad attack on Rhaenyra/the boys. They have to cautious there to not end up in PJ Denethor territory there.

[IFR]

@Lord Varys

Out of curiosity, could you provide an example of what you view is a good trailer for a genre show (fantasy or horror)?

I ask because there are loads of fantasy shows out right now, and this one in my view has a trailer easily superior to any trailer I've seen for the other shows. If you find that you are entirely unsatisfied with the fantasy genre in television then that is understandable, but if you feel that there is something better out there, I would be interested to see it.

[Takiedevushkikakzvezdy]

16 hours ago, Ran said:

The show is its own thing. The Targaryen dragon has two legs in the books.

Didn't it have two legs on GoT as well?

[Ran]

15 minutes ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

Didn't it have two legs on GoT as well?

Yes and no. They had 4 legs on a banner in the pilot, but that was caught and they mostly stuck to two legs, outside I think of a couple S1 jewelry or costume pieces. But then in S6 or S7, it was suddenly just 4 legged banners everywhere. The assumption is that there was an error in asset management.

[Lord Varys]

8 hours ago, IFR said:

@Lord Varys

Out of curiosity, could you provide an example of what you view is a good trailer for a genre show (fantasy or horror)?

I ask because there are loads of fantasy shows out right now, and this one in my view has a trailer easily superior to any trailer I've seen for the other shows. If you find that you are entirely unsatisfied with the fantasy genre in television then that is understandable, but if you feel that there is something better out there, I would be interested to see it.

Well, I never said it was a bad trailer insofar as trailers are concerned, or did I? I have certain issues with what that trailer implies for the show, but I'd not say that it was a bad trailer for a (generic) fantasy show.

But since you are asking: Actually giving Rhaenyra Targaryen some lines might have made it better since it would have introduced and established one of the central characters in a better way. There might be another trailer yet, of course, but since the show is due in three months I guess one can demand something like that without it being viewed as silly.

It wouldn't have been that bad to give us at least one prominent look at Aegon the Elder and Aemond and perhaps even Rhaenyra's sons (if they don't want to show the Velaryon boys they could have given us Aegon the Younger and Viserys) or Daemon's daughters.

Considering what we know about the setting, it might also have been interesting to show more dragons, possibly even so that the audience realizes who is a dragonrider and who isn't.