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NBA Finals - The Problem with Steph Curry


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3 hours ago, Proudfeet said:

I think the Nets getting DeAndre Jordan was stupid but still just barely defensible considering that Jordan managed to con the Lakers and the Sixers into doing the same after being played out of the rotation at each of his previous stops.

 

Its a bad signing for the Nuggets and incomprehensible. They did however also get Bruce Brown and Kentavious Caldwell Pope so overall...

4 hours ago, Maithanet said:

I think that KD deserves a harsh interpretation of his career. 

He didn't destroy OKC, but he definitely screwed them over.  They were very close to winning the 2016 WCF and then boom, he's gone in free agency for free.  If he wanted to be a "team player" he could have done a sign-and-trade so OKC wasn't left emptyhanded, but he didn't want that because he only wanted to go to the Warriors and he didn't want the Warriors to have to trade away anything in order to get him. 

He didn't destroy the Warriors, but they would have resigned him and continued to be a championship contender in 2021-onward if that had been Durant's preference.  Instead he wanted to play with Kyrie instead of Steph (BTW haha what a downgrade) so the Warriors looked elsewhere and won another championship without him. 

He did destroy the Nets.  I mean, he wanted them to sign an over the hill Deandre Jordan, so they did.  He wanted them to mortgage the future for Harden, so they did.  Harden and Durant didn't get along so Harden got shipped out.  He had a lot of leverage over the Nets and he used it.  And now, even though he's signed for 4 more years, he expects them not just to trade him, but to trade him to a preferred contender.  Does he have a no-trade clause?  Because if not, I would seriously be shopping him to any team willing to make an offer.  If the Kings offer 5 1sts, ship him over, those things are gonna be gold in the years Durant gets hurt (and after he demands a trade again). 

EDIT:  I checked, he does not have a no-trade clause.  Give Sacramento a call!

He could indeed have done OKC a solid at the time, and it was a huge bummer why he left. Why there was no sign and trade, when later he would grant one to GSW, we have not really learned the reasons for why that is I believe.

In any case, overlooking his tenure at OKC as a whole, you'd have to say he was a huge, huge positive overall.

Durant at Golden State, well, he helped them win 2 titles. Then he left, and gave them a sign and trade which they are still massively feasting on to this day. He wanted to leave, and that seems like a bad decision now, but I dont think his effect on GS as a whole can be described as negative considering what he did for them.

The Nets..thats terrible. But again, youre saying Harden left because him and Durant didnt get along...we dont know if thats what did it. The most mentioned reason for Harden giving up on the team was Kyrie's absence. Though perhaps Harden was also annoyed by how KD is always standing by Kyrie.

I hope he gets traded to a contender anyways.

 

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Its a very interesting trade. It immediately begs the question, what happens with Mitchell as this, alongside yesterday's trading away of O' Neal, strongly suggests a complete rebuild.

Do I love this trade for the T-Wolves? Mixed feelings. It means Towns plays the 4, is that a good thing? Again, I dont know. And what a massive haul of picks this decade.

It does strengthen this team defensively. The players they gave up are all replaceable too, Beasley, Beverly, Vanderbilt and some dudes.

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8 minutes ago, Calibandar said:

Its a very interesting trade. It immediately begs the question, what happens with Mitchell as this, alongside yesterday's trading away of O' Neal, strongly suggests a complete rebuild.

Do I love this trade for the T-Wolves? Mixed feelings. It means Towns plays the 4, is that a good thing? Again, I dont know. And what a massive haul of picks this decade.

It does strengthen this team defensively. The players they gave up are all replaceable too, Beasley, Beverly, Vanderbilt and some dudes.

The players traded is not the problem.  It's the unprotected 2025 and 2027 picks that should really worry TWolves fans.  You can project that next year they'll be at least decent, but three years from now?  Who knows?  2027? Even more so. 

It is quite fair to question whether Gobert is really worth that.  I think that his playoff struggles are a bit overblown.  He was holding together a Jazz team with a bunch of weak defenders, and once the playoff starts people found ways to exploit it.  If Gobert was surrounded by some other capable defenders, he could focus on just doing his job and still be an effective defender.  But "still an effective defender" is damning with faint praise when we're talking about a guy with very little offense and no range at all.  I don't think he's worth what Minnesota paid for him. 

Although I will say that they are stylistically different from the other teams out west with Towns + Gobert, and I'll be interested to see how it works. 

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Calibandar said:

Its a very interesting trade. It immediately begs the question, what happens with Mitchell as this, alongside yesterday's trading away of O' Neal, strongly suggests a complete rebuild.

Rumor is that Mitchell is on his way to Miami.

Edit: Apparently Woj says the Jazz are going to retool around Mitchell.

 

 

Edited by briantw
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1 hour ago, DanteGabriel said:

Wow, this is unexpected. Celtics acquire Malcolm Brogdon for a handful of magic beans.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/34180437/boston-celtics-acquire-malcolm-brogdon-trade-indiana-pacers-sources-say

Lol, I came here to say I think this move makes the Celtics the favorites next year and then damn…..

Fit wise I get what the Wolves are doing. They badly need a true rim protector and they’re plenty stacked on offense. Gobert will make a real impact and the Wolves should make a leap. But damn that’s a lot to give up. They gave up four picks and three solid rotation players. What does that make KD cost, because the Wolves were a team some thought would be a good fit for him and I expected to have to paying something like this for him? How many firsts can a team trade at once if they only have their own?

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46 minutes ago, DMC said:

Seven.  Teams can only trade draft picks up to seven years in the future.

So that means four then, plus the rookies in your most recent draft. Ugh that means we paid five firsts for him.

 

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5 hours ago, Calibandar said:

Its a bad signing for the Nuggets and incomprehensible. They did however also get Bruce Brown and Kentavious Caldwell Pope so overall...

Wait, what? The Nuggets signed DeAndre Jordan? 

4 hours ago, Maithanet said:

It is quite fair to question whether Gobert is really worth that.

The problem with Gobert is that he is very good at what he does but shockingly bad at what he doesn't.

I think he definitely isn't worth it, especially with the salary he has, unless you think that you have a perfect fit for him where you play to his strengths and cover his weaknesses. Maybe if he was paid 20 million less with four to five years to go, but five first rounders (including this year's) feels too much. Maybe three firsts and two seconds will be fair?

Turning it around, who would you expect to get for that kind of return, teams and fit aside? An MVP candidate? KD? Lillard? Ayton? Mitchell?

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, Proudfeet said:

Turning it around, who would you expect to get for that kind of return, teams and fit aside? An MVP candidate? KD? Lillard? Ayton? Mitchell?

And this is why I brought up the asking price for other players. The Wolves clearly were ready to make a splash, they called other teams to inquire what they wanted and thought this was either their best or only move to make a serious upgrade. Not saying it's smart, but I'm guessing Mitchell and KD are commanding a good deal more than what the Wolves gave up. If not I'm going to be pissed.

That said, a starting lineup of Russell/Ant/McDaniels/KAT/Gobert is pretty interesting, and before making the trade we locked up multiple wing bench guys that were good for us so hopefully we have some depth. But at the end of the day everything relies on Ant making that next step and becoming the team's best player.

Edited by Tywin et al.
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Rumors today that the Jazz might trade Mitchell after all, that Miami is very interested if they cannot get Durant.

And that the Raptors are in the Durant race.

 

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3 hours ago, Calibandar said:

Rumors today that the Jazz might trade Mitchell after all, that Miami is very interested if they cannot get Durant.

And that the Raptors are in the Durant race.

 

The nets should be wanting scottie Barnes or Evan Mobley in a trade for Durant plus other stuff. I dont know why they would trade him to say Phoenix unless they are getting booker. The problem with the rumors about the raptors are though is that they are fake. They might (and should) want to trade for Durant but the insiders get nothing from the front office ever.

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28 minutes ago, BigFatCoward said:

Zion getting paid for being a lazy fucker, he will never not be able to afford deep fried battered chocolate cake. 

It's a completely insane contract. They should have traded him to the Knicks for control of their next seven picks. Or maybe a European model can be adopted and teams can just start selling players for picks and >$50m.

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25 minutes ago, briantw said:

Darius Garland got a well deserved max contract today.  Kid really made the leap last year. 

Not a knock on him but why is there so little difference between superstars and 'quite good' in salary in the nba? 

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