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Depp and Heard Trial Result


Fragile Bird

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8 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

I was never interested in this trial and I dislike celebrity news generally.  But as someone who watches a fair bit of Youtube (history and gaming stuff), I was constantly getting recommendations for "Amber Heard DESTROYED" or "Heard Lawyer could be disbarred!" or some such nonsense.  And it wasn't just Youtube, this case was everywhere - it felt very much like a coordinated campaign (which I suspect came from Depp's team) to destroy his ex-wife.  Which is...very abusive.  The case felt like another way for an angry man seeking to destroy his ex's life.  And it was extremely successful, because I suspect Heard's career is basically over.

So I have no idea if Heard was lying because as I didn't watch any of the trial.  But even without watching anything, it gave a strong impression that Depp is indeed abusive.  Perhaps not physically (I have no idea) but definitely emotionally.

Isn't that exactly what Heard already previously did to Depp?

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57 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

That audio gave me the most pause.  

That said I agree with Mormont I don’t think Depp is without stain in this.  It seems to me they brought out the worst in each other and I’d hate the result of this case to be that women who are abused are suddenly presumed to be lying.

Yeah, I would agree that Depp is not without a stain. But, I am not sure about many of her allegations. Her lawyers seem to have been throwing sexual, physical and psychological abuse at the jury using these terms synonymously.

I repeat, it was a "hail, Mary" attempt by Amber's lawyers to make this trial into a #MeToo referendum. They played extremely dangerous game, knowing full well that her client's testimonies, both of them, didn't sit well with the jury. They asked them to send the message. And they did. 5M dollars in punitive damages? I think that fact itself speaks volumes, regardless of being capped to 350K.

I mean, we are all very careful about the impact this trial might have, but I find it even more problematic that many people started narrative "no one will believe you because they didn't believe Amber". The problem here is that the world believed Amber, cancelled Depp and destroyed his career (let's not kid ourselves - the man lost two franchise roles because of this). And then she was proved wrong. She testified and lied. So, her lack of credibility should never be taken as some sort of shoe that will fit every female abuse victim. 

The greatest irony... "Tell the world, Johnny..." proved that in fact someone will listen.

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12 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

I was never interested in this trial and I dislike celebrity news generally.  But as someone who watches a fair bit of Youtube (history and gaming stuff), I was constantly getting recommendations for "Amber Heard DESTROYED" or "Heard Lawyer could be disbarred!" or some such nonsense.  And it wasn't just Youtube, this case was everywhere - it felt very much like a coordinated campaign (which I suspect came from Depp's team) to destroy his ex-wife.  Which is...very abusive.  The case felt like another way for an angry man seeking to destroy his ex's life.  And it was extremely successful, because I suspect Heard's career is basically over.

So I have no idea if Heard was lying because as I didn't watch any of the trial.  But even without watching anything, it gave a strong impression that Depp is indeed abusive.  Perhaps not physically (I have no idea) but definitely emotionally.

As someone who paid very little attention to all this but did see the constant recs, it felt more to me that the various "men's rights" folks latched on to Depp as their cause of the day. He also, probably because there's a lot of overlap here, started getting MAGA supporters (which is ironic considering he half-jokingly suggested killing Trump in 2017). It is possible that Depp's team started activating and encouraging those people, which would be incredibly scummy. But it's also possible that Depp's team had nothing to do with it; that it was simply a high profile case between a man and a woman and these people decided it was important that the man win. Which is incredibly gross of course, but just because bad people are rooting you on doesn't automatically mean that you're in the wrong.

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47 minutes ago, LynnS said:

I heard someone shat the bed and that was enough for me.  Now I hear it's over. 

Same. I've not been following the trial, at all, but some of it has been impossible to avoid.

The bed shitting, of course. Also, her allegedly taking cocaine whilst on the stand. And the quality of the witnesses her legal team called - specifically the gurning psychologist who based his opinion on Depp's state of mind on the actor's performance in Willy Wonka.

 

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8 minutes ago, Fez said:

Which is incredibly gross of course, but just because bad people are rooting you on doesn't automatically mean that you're in the wrong.

Can you think of an example where bad people were conducting a nasty, mean-spirited, misogynistic campaign in support of someone that is in the right? Why wouldn't that person, particularly a public/celebrity figure, have some self doubt or at least responsibility there?

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15 minutes ago, Gorn said:

Isn't that exactly what Heard already previously did to Depp?

Did she?  I don't follow celebrity news closely, but I never heard Depp's name tarnished the way lots of guys in Hollywood have been the past few years like Spacey or Louis CK.  If this trial hadn't happened, I doubt I would have ever heard about it.

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13 minutes ago, Fez said:

As someone who paid very little attention to all this but did see the constant recs, it felt more to me that the various "men's rights" folks latched on to Depp as their cause of the day. He also, probably because there's a lot of overlap here, started getting MAGA supporters (which is ironic considering he half-jokingly suggested killing Trump in 2017). It is possible that Depp's team started activating and encouraging those people, which would be incredibly scummy. But it's also possible that Depp's team had nothing to do with it; that it was simply a high profile case between a man and a woman and these people decided it was important that the man win. Which is incredibly gross of course, but just because bad people are rooting you on doesn't automatically mean that you're in the wrong.

He certainly activated them in one way, because he's the one who brought the trial.  If this case were Heard suing Depp for emotional damages, I would have a great deal less sympathy for her position. 

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5 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

Did she?  I don't follow celebrity news closely, but I never heard Depp's name tarnished the way lots of guys in Hollywood have been the past few years like Spacey or Louis CK.  If this trial hadn't happened, I doubt I would have ever heard about it.

She wrote a column in Washington Post, which the court has now found to be libelous. Depp's career has been pretty much dead since then.

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2 minutes ago, Week said:

Can you think of an example where bad people were conducting a nasty, mean-spirited, misogynistic campaign in support of someone that is in the right? Why wouldn't that person, particularly a public/celebrity figure, have some self doubt or at least responsibility there?

Off the top of my head:

The MAGA folks were rooting on Sanders in 2020 and calling on him to oppose the DNC's "corruption".

All the men's rights folks supported Asiz Ansari.

Some of the far right supported James Gunn when Disney fired him; which was ironic since others on the far right got him fired.

The Star Wars assholes rooted on Mark Hamil when he said he said he didn't understand the direction Luke's character took in The Last Jedi.

Some extraordinarily far-right Israeli political parties joined the coalition to bring down Netanyahu. Likewise, a party one step away from neo-Nazis joined the United party against Orban in Hungry.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Maithanet said:

He certainly activated them in one way, because he's the one who brought the trial.  If this case were Heard suing Depp for emotional damages, I would have a great deal less sympathy for her position. 

It is entirely unreasonable to ask people to consider the macro-political implications of their personal lives.

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You aren't really engaging with my full point which is the nature of the support nor that, in most of those incidents, the recipient of the support would denounce and villify those voices from bad actors.

Anyhow, engaged more on this than I care to already.

I also found this to be a pretty fair overview:

https://www.vox.com/culture/23043519/johnny-depp-amber-heard-defamation-trial-fairfax-county-domestic-abuse-violence-me-too

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30 minutes ago, Week said:

Can you think of an example where bad people were conducting a nasty, mean-spirited, misogynistic campaign in support of someone that is in the right? Why wouldn't that person, particularly a public/celebrity figure, have some self doubt or at least responsibility there?

This is a gross misrepresentation of the support Depp got. (Not saying there is no misogyny there, there most certainly is, but to put entire Depp support into far-right corner would be, IMO, really wrong.)

And practically this argument is what is wrong with American society these days. You all think in extremes. Either you are far-left or far-right. There is no middle ground anymore. We have seen numerous Hollywood women like Jennifer Aniston, Penelope Cruz, Eva Green, Selma Hayek supporting Depp - are they mean-spirited and misogynistic?

Instead of using this moment to reexamine the cancel culture Hollywood has based MeToo on and admit some mistakes, we see leftist being closed to any idea of wrongdoing by anyone surrounding Amber. And they immediately started firing: "No one will ever believe women because of this." As far as I am concerned, both extremes here are wrong.

I feel like the common sense has been lost here. I do believe that one can believe in  MeToo movement and still believe AH lied. I believe someone can sympathize with Depp and still hold him accountable for some actions. What I don't believe is this strawman argument American media played since last night. 

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Where did I say "all supporters"? 

(I didn't)

Eta- Appreciate the attempt l, however a lot more editing is required to correct. None of the post really makes sense without that linchpin.

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Just now, Week said:

Where did I say "all supporters"? 

(I didn't)

I edited that part. I apologize for it. From my perspective, here in Europe, this entire case is once again clashing of far-left and far-right. And somehow I think the point is lost here...

 

@polishgenius, thanks. I really didn't know. 

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33 minutes ago, Mladen said:

Instead of using this moment to reexamine the cancel culture Hollywood has based MeToo on and admit some mistakes, we see leftist being closed to any idea of wrongdoing by anyone surrounding Amber.

I can't speak for what coverage you're consuming, but this certainly doesn't reflect the thread I'm reading.  Essentially everybody has acknowledged Heard shares some culpability/lacks credibility.  Meanwhile, there's a significant portion that want to emphasize Heard is the "primary" abuser and come very close to suggesting Depp holds no culpability and is purely a victim.  Which of course is possible, but I find it quite amusing so many here are so sure of themselves based on following a hollywood show trial.

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2 minutes ago, DMC said:

I can't speak for what coverage you're consuming, but this certainly doesn't reflect the thread I'm reading.  Essentially everybody has acknowledged Heard shares some culpability/lacks credibility.  Meanwhile, there's a significant portion that want to emphasize Heard is the "primary" abuser and come very close to suggesting Depp holds no culpability and is purely a victim.  Which of course is possible, but I find it quite amusing so many here are so sure of themselves based on following a hollywood show trial.

Given that you have responded to me, I really doubt I show any sort of certainty regarding this case. :D Well, the regulars - LA Times, Variety, Washington Post, etc. What I find on Google Search from American and British media. My impression and it can be wrong is that although they recognize Heard's lack of credibility, it is like "it doesn't matter because he is a powerful man". It's just my impression. And many of liberal commentators are doing the same. Again, just my impression, not a state of fact.

 

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3 minutes ago, Mladen said:

Given that you have responded to me, I really doubt I show any sort of certainty regarding this case.

I wasn't referring to you, no.

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Maybe the 'imperfect victim' here isn't Amber Heard, but Johnny Depp.  A rich, famous, drug addled, immature, bratty individual used to getting his own way and prone to throwing objects around is hardly inherently sympathetic.  And yet, he's the one with documented injuries.  He is the one who is taunted and belittled by his partner, who admits to starting fights and hitting him.  He is the one who repeatedly tried to walk away to stop the conflict.  

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