The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power

[polishgenius]

2 hours ago, Isis said:

 Audiences are obviously free to critique the quality and value of the show once they have actually watched it.

They're free to do it now too, c'mon. The whole point of trailers is to put the best foot forward. If someone thinks that best foot looks unimpressive, it's perfectly normal to say so in, you know, a discussion topic about the upcoming show.

[ASOIAFrelatedusername]

3 hours ago, Isis said:

Anyone commenting with 'it looks awful', 'it's just bad fan fic' 'they don't give a fuck about Tolkien's work' - is being lazy and dishonest. The majority of people haven't even seen any of the show apart from trailers so I don't know how they can tell any of this anyway. Audiences are obviously free to critique the quality and value of the show once they have actually watched it.

Tell that to the hypemongers

[Isis]

2 hours ago, ASOIAFrelatedusername said:

Tell that to the hypemongers

I'm not even sure what this means. 

[DMC]

3 hours ago, polishgenius said:

If someone thinks that best foot looks unimpressive, it's perfectly normal to say so in, you know, a discussion topic about the upcoming show.

If you got problems with the trailer, sure.  But there's a whole hell of a lot of prejudicial assumptions being made in these threads.

[RhaenysBee]

YouTube has played me the new trailer in every single video I opened. Stop trying to make fetch happen. Also, how much have they spent on ads and PR? 
 

Oh yeah, the new trailer is… hopeless. 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

10 hours ago, Isis said:

This type of comment, about not giving a fuck about Tolkien's work is ridiculous.

By all means say that you are not interested in watching a show based on Tolkien's work which will have non-canon events and characters. I totally understand and respect that stance. 

Anyone commenting with 'it looks awful', 'it's just bad fan fic' 'they don't give a fuck about Tolkien's work' - is being lazy and dishonest. The majority of people haven't even seen any of the show apart from trailers so I don't know how they can tell any of this anyway. Audiences are obviously free to critique the quality and value of the show once they have actually watched it.

Having now watched the ROP panel at SDCC, the idea that the creators of the show do not care about Tolkien's work just makes no sense.

If the idea of someone creating something 'new' within Tolkien's world is so offensive, simply do not watch the show when it comes out and do not trouble yourselves to moan about it continuously. 

Did they say anything about whether the timeline is seriously compressed?

[Calibandar]

Some more wide ranging speculation the last days about the identity of the Stranger.

This aricle at Collider, I dont know if the writer or the site has any credibility, but she is outright stating that the Stranger is Annatar and that The Stranger will be guiding Celebrimbor how to make the Rings.

https://collider.com/the-lord-of-the-rings-the-rings-of-power-cast-and-character-guide/

Quote

" Celebrimbor, Noldorin prince of the House of Fëanor, was a ruler of the realm Eregion and a master smith. Under the guidance of The Stranger Annatar, Celebrimor forges the three Elven Rings of Power, Nenya, Vilya, and Narya, which, unbeknownst to the smith, are magically bound to the One Ring, and the wearers could be influenced by Sauron." 

On the other hand, on TORN, a rundown of rumors coming from SDCC itself including some new details about the Stranger, noting:

Quote

1. The fire he emits is magic fire - cold to the touch. The hobbit who approaches him is not burnt (based on fan eyewitness of a scene shown during an SDCC panel). The Stranger is later able to produce that fire again.

2. The Stranger is almost completely mute (confirmed by the actor Daniel Weyman and some cast mates).

3. The Stranger is almost certainly not Sauron as Sauron is strongly rumored to be played by another actor (Boon), and some fans who attended SDCC have said that Sauron does not appear in any of the trailers (though we may have heard his voice at the end “you have been told many lies of Middle Earth…”)

4. He is likely not an Istari, as the showrunners have to adhere to the big events described in canon, and the wizards are not supposed to have arrived until the Third Age (though there’s some ambiguity about the timing of the arrival of the Blue Wizards, so there’s a tiny chance it could be one of them…). But he’s almost certainly a Maiar, as the showrunners have noted - when asked if he was Gandalf - that there are others of Gandalf’s “class” out there. Maiar, essentially.

4.5. According to the actor, he has deep primal urges. And according to some fans at SDCC, he’s a spellcaster. And we see some of that (very briefly) in the trailer.

All of which I can see, however the poster then speculates that the Stranger is actually the Balrog, which just seems very left field and unlikely to me.

[ASOIAFrelatedusername]

15 hours ago, Isis said:

I'm not even sure what this means. 

You are telling people who dislike what they are seeing to shut up and wait until the show is out. Please be consistent and say the same thing to the people already praising the show.

[Isis]

11 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Did they say anything about whether the timeline is seriously compressed?

I don't recall any specific questions on this, or at least no specific answers.

We know the storylines the show will cover are:

-The forging of the Rings

-The rise of Sauron

-The rise and fall of Numenor

-The last alliance of Elves and Men

 

That's almost 2000 years of the second age. Some characters are around for all of that time (Sauron and the key Elf characters). But Ar-Pharazon is alive for 200 years towards the end of that time period and he's going to be in the first season... How will they cover the forging of the Rings (II, 1500) and the fall of Numenor (3319)? I don't know the answer to that. I'll wait and see.

[Werthead]

Confirmation that "Young Aragorn" was one of the ideas Amazon was looking at when the Second Age idea was pitched, as well as a Gimli spinoff!

I'm not even sure what that'd be about. Gimli and Legolas as buddy cops setting things to right across Middle-earth?

[Ser Drewy]

50 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Confirmation that "Young Aragorn" was one of the ideas Amazon was looking at when the Second Age idea was pitched, as well as a Gimli spinoff!

I'm not even sure what that'd be about. Gimli and Legolas as buddy cops setting things to right across Middle-earth?

Both of those sound hilariously bad. Second Age is probably the better option, though what Payne & McKay will do with it remains to be seen. So far it's looking like a mixed bag. 

Something I'm wondering: what exactly is the Rights situation? So far the promotional material has suggested they've got some rights to Unfinished Tales/Silmarillion - yet they only ever speak of having LOTR/Hobbit/Appendices. So is this really First Age Material they're using (e.g the possible Oath of Feanor shot) or are they just dressing up their own new ideas with First Age evocations (the 'Hill of Slain' type shot in the newest trailer suggests this)?

[Corvinus85]

15 hours ago, Calibandar said:

On the other hand, on TORN, a rundown of rumors coming from SDCC itself including some new details about the Stranger, noting:

4. He is likely not an Istari, as the showrunners have to adhere to the big events described in canon, and the wizards are not supposed to have arrived until the Third Age (though there’s some ambiguity about the timing of the arrival of the Blue Wizards, so there’s a tiny chance it could be one of them…). But he’s almost certainly a Maiar, as the showrunners have noted - when asked if he was Gandalf - that there are others of Gandalf’s “class” out there. Maiar, essentially.

All of which I can see, however the poster then speculates that the Stranger is actually the Balrog, which just seems very left field and unlikely to me.

No, it's not Gandalf, it's Olórin. 

And I don't recall balrogs being shapeshifters. Melkor's corruption twisted the Maia that were once balrogs into those forms.

[Corvinus85]

57 minutes ago, Ser Drewy said:

Something I'm wondering: what exactly is the Rights situation? So far the promotional material has suggested they've got some rights to Unfinished Tales/Silmarillion - yet they only ever speak of having LOTR/Hobbit/Appendices. So is this really First Age Material they're using (e.g the possible Oath of Feanor shot) or are they just dressing up their own new ideas with First Age evocations (the 'Hill of Slain' type shot in the newest trailer suggests this)?

In a previous interview, the showrunners said that rights to the Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales are on a case by case basis. I think this means that the Tolkien Estate is more heavily involved, rather than simply selling rights and cashing in.

[Werthead]

Just now, Corvinus85 said:

In a previous interview, the showrunners said that rights to the Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales are on a case by case basis. I think this means that the Tolkien Estate is more heavily involved, rather than simply selling rights and cashing in.

I think that's fan speculation. The showrunners have only said they have access to LotR.

It's odd because they're using maps of Numenor and names and terms that only appear in The Sil and UT, so clearly they have more options than what they've admitted to so far.

[ASOIAFrelatedusername]

2 hours ago, Werthead said:

I think that's fan speculation. The showrunners have only said they have access to LotR.

It's odd because they're using maps of Numenor and names and terms that only appear in The Sil and UT, so clearly they have more options than what they've admitted to so far.

I do not think that it is odd. The Tolkien Estate probably only sold the rights to Lotr because the "damage" there was done. The have no control over the movie rights, so giving up the TV rights is not that big of a sacrifice, especially with that price tag.

They are also not going to to terminate their sweet deal because the show uses minor things from non-Lotr material. With the big things, like Galadriel's backstory, the showrunners might need explicit permission so that this stuff stays minimal (and that they can still sell the rights separately later).

[Calibandar]

3 hours ago, Corvinus85 said:

No, it's not Gandalf, it's Olórin. 

And I don't recall balrogs being shapeshifters. Melkor's corruption twisted the Maia that were once balrogs into those forms.

Yeah, him being a Balrog makes no sense. Thats where the speculation goes off the rails. The other details about him being a spellcaster and a near mute, with deep primal urges, is interesting. This might be an invented character entirely.

Certainly him being near mute seems to go against the idea that this is Annatar about to teach the Elves all sorts of stuff.

[Calibandar]

Report from the exclusive video content shown at SDCC:

Quote

Nori appears at the top of the burning crater and looks down to see the ‘Stranger’ curled up in a fetal position unconscious. Her friend Poppy comes up from behind and tells her to get away from the edge, it’s dangerous. Nori says that they should help the man below, and Poppy says that they can’t, he’s a giant and it isn’t safe. 

At that moment, the edge of the crater collapses and Nori falls into the crater, landing amongst the flames. As she scrambles to regain her feet, she realizes the flames don’t burn, they aren’t hot. This gives her enough courage to approach the figure at the center of the flaming crater. 

She slowly reaches out to touch him, while Poppy pleads for her to stop. Nori pokes his face and nothing happens, and again Poppy pleads for her to come back. Nori says that we can’t leave him here, not for the wolves to get, and then suddenly he wakes enough to reach out and grab her arm. 

Nori turns back to him, stunned and surprised, he looks just as perplexed and starts to cry out, the camera cuts back and forth between them, while the cries of surprise or pain or confusion escalate, the fire goes out. And then, Nori is able to pull away, and the Stranger falls unconscious again, and the flames return. 

Poppy urges Nori to get out as fast as she can, and Nori says we have to help him, and Poppy retorts ‘how are we to carry a giant’, but Nori says that they can, that this is who they are, and Poppy reminds her ‘no, this is who you are’. 

This last interchange between Nori and Poppy is very much like the Shire we know, where most of the Hobbits never go anywhere and never have any adventures, and then there are the Bagginses and Tooks, who do go places and have adventures. 

Thus ends the Dispatches from Hall H at San Diego Comic Con, at least as far as the exclusive video content goes.

Also this tidbit:

 

Quote

But then we push in closer to see the Trees better, and they are fading. As the light begins to dim, and the leaves fall, there is a giant shadowy figure of Morgoth in the sky. We are then transported to a realm of burning ground that seems to be disintegrating, and the Ring Verse appears in a golden circle on a black background. 

 

[Ser Drewy]

Someone has uploaded Total Film's article on the show

[Derfel Cadarn]

On 7/25/2022 at 7:08 PM, ASOIAFrelatedusername said:

I do not think that it is odd. The Tolkien Estate probably only sold the rights to Lotr because the "damage" there was done. The have no control over the movie rights, so giving up the TV rights is not that big of a sacrifice, especially with that price tag.

They are also not going to to terminate their sweet deal because the show uses minor things from non-Lotr material. With the big things, like Galadriel's backstory, the showrunners might need explicit permission so that this stuff stays minimal (and that they can still sell the rights separately later).

The Estate can’t sell the rights to Lotr/Hobbit - they don’t own them. 
From a legal standpoint Insuspect their lawyers are very protective lver Silmarillion righta”s, and would sue any unauthorised useage. And would win. They can argue the unauthorised useage compromises any future deal.

[ASOIAFrelatedusername]

3 hours ago, Ser Drewy said:

Someone has uploaded Total Film's article on the show

The Intro again shows that the time compression is a horrible idea.

28 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

The Estate can’t sell the rights to Lotr/Hobbit - they don’t own them. 

The film and merchandise rights. As I understand the rights Tolkien sold to United Artists back in the day did NOT include the rights to make a TV series, so the Estate was able to make the deal with Amazon.

28 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

From a legal standpoint Insuspect their lawyers are very protective lver Silmarillion righta”s, and would sue any unauthorised useage. And would win. They can argue the unauthorised useage compromises any future deal.

They would probably get a technical win in court, yes. However that win would get them very little and it is just not worth it to jeopardize the current and future deals over peanuts.