Jump to content

Star Wars: Nothing But Star Wars


Myrddin

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Except he isn't unnaturally good at everything to extent Rey is. Rey demonstrates exceptional pilot skills. Fine. But she goes from never having held a lightsaber and thinking Luke Skywalker is a legend to doing Jedi mind tricks and defeating Kylo Ren in a lightaber duel in the same film. that's a bit of stretch given the established internal logic of the franchise.

Yep, this continues to be bullshit. Luke turns off a targeting computer and shoots a proton torpedo into a hole the size of a large dog and that proceeds to take a right turn. In TESB, Luke uses force telekinesis despite never having a single bit of force training or even seeing it once. Luke is able to block laser blasts because Obi-Wan tells him to relax, and is able to do so in a matter of minutes of picking up a saber. Anakin is able to fly a space ship and destroy a major war asset when he's like 9 years old, as well as pilot two jet engines strapped to a go-kart. 

You just don't need montages or heavy training if you're strong in the force or you trust the force. Note the most implausible things that get done in the movies happen when that person surrenders to the force entirely - Luke with the trench run, Rey with the duel. The idea that it takes some kind of different ability or that swordfighting requires physical training but shooting a torpedo only requires instinct is incredibly ass-backwards; if anything, you would think that dueling would be the least requiring training and most relying on the force for flow and behavior. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

Yep, this continues to be bullshit. Luke turns off a targeting computer and shoots a proton torpedo into a hole the size of a large dog and that proceeds to take a right turn.

...Accompanied by a V.O. of a Kenobi's spirit telling him to, "Use the force", which is a callback to the earlier scene on the Falcon, where he received a bit of instruction from Kenobi. That might be thin, but it's a hell of a lot more set up than we got in TFA.

23 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

In TESB, Luke uses force telekinesis despite never having a single bit of force training or even seeing it once. Luke is able to block laser blasts because Obi-Wan tells him to relax, and is able to do so in a matter of minutes of picking up a saber.

Yeah, and the first time he tries both of those things he fails. The first time he goes up against a trained Sith in a lightsaber duel, he fails. Vader would've turned him into Swiss cheese in seconds flat if he wasn't his son.

23 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

Anakin is able to fly a space ship and destroy a major war asset when he's like 9 years old, as well as pilot two jet engines strapped to a go-kart. 

Anakin's piloting skills are explained and demonstrated earlier in the film. And it's pretty clear from the way that whole scenario plays out the it was it was more luck than anything. He never says, "I'm going to go into the ship and blow it up from the inside". He hid in the fighter because Quigon told him to. The fucking autopilot took him to the battle in the first place.

23 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

You just don't need montages or heavy training if you're strong in the force or you trust the force.

I'm not saying it needs that. I'm saying it needs something. Anything. Like how about Rey asking Luke, "How was I able to defeat Kylo Ren in the last movie?" and maybe Luke doesn't even have an answer, but it's acknowledged at the very least. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

...Accompanied by a V.O. of a Kenobi's spirit telling him to, "Use the force", which is a callback to the earlier scene on the Falcon, where he received a bit of instruction from Kenobi. That might be thin, but it's a hell of a lot more set up than we got in TFA. 

It is almost precisely the same as what happened in TFA; the only difference was that Rey was telling herself and remembering what she was told, vs Luke being told "use the force". If that's enough explanation for you I guess that's cool, but I don't think having an alexa reminder is proof that there was a whole lot of training.

Just now, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Yeah, and the first time he tries both of those things he fails. The first time he goes up against a trained Sith in a lightsaber duel, he fails. Vader would've turned him into Swiss cheese in seconds flat if he wasn't his son.

The first part of the fight Rey fights Kylo she gets her ass kicked too. Per your criteria below we had 'established' that Rey was great at hand to hand combat earlier in the movie because she swung a stick. Why is that not enough?

Also it's weird to think this, but consider: Luke needs to lose to Vader at that moment so that he can both find out that Vader is his father and so that he can use Vader to kill the Emperor. That is the Force throughline. If the Force willed that Luke would win, well, he would have won. 

Just now, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Anakin's piloting skills are explained and demonstrated earlier in the film. And it's pretty clear from the way that whole scenario plays out the it was it was more luck than anything. He never says, "I'm going to go into the ship and blow it up from the inside". He hid in the ship because Quigon told him to. The fucking autopilot took him to the battle in the first place.

Anakin's piloting skills are explained by a 9 year old being able to fly jets at breakneck speed? That's not an 'explanation'. That's saying he's amazing at it to start with. 

The explanation is that piloting is as much force-powered as anything else. We see this with Luke, with Vader, with Anakin, with other Jedi pilots having their own craft. 

Just now, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

I'm not saying it needs that. I'm saying it needs something. Anything. Like how about Rey asking Luke, "How was I able to defeat Kylo Ren in the last movie?" and maybe Luke doesn't even have an answer, but it's acknowledged at the very least. 

I don't think it needs that, because TFA literally answers this. Rey even answers this. You see her getting her ass kicked, then she trusts in the force, and then she wins. Luke is shown to have problems with his computer, then he's told to trust in the force, then he wins. 

For some reason using absurdly force-powered physical skills is implausible for people but using absurdly force-powered skills to fly a technologically advanced military starcraft is entirely reasonable. I don't get it. 

Now, if you want to get into the weirdness of Rey being able to jedi mind trick someone without seeing it - yeah, I agree! That one is super weird. I think it's about as weird as Luke grabbing his lightsaber with the force; neither should have any idea that that's what the force lets you do. But it's still pretty odd! I wonder why you're not upset that Luke didn't ask Yoda 'hey, I was able to grab a lightsaber from a distance, what's up with that?' though. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Except he isn't unnaturally good at everything to extent Rey is. Rey demonstrates exceptional pilot skills. Fine. But she goes from never having held a lightsaber and thinking Luke Skywalker is a legend to doing Jedi mind tricks and defeating Kylo Ren in a lightaber duel in the same film. that's a bit of stretch given the established internal logic of the franchise.

Supposedly, the "diad in the force" thing allowed Rey to download Kylos abilities or something. That would have been great if it was ever mentioned in any of the films. 

 

There is a gradual difference there, and lots of bad writing in the ST which makes it worse, but there is no fundamental difference between little Ani, womp rat Luke, and wonder Rey - they are more or less the same character.

ANH does it best, by giving Luke a proper background and some instruction in the Force and Ben's guiding spirit helping in the end ... something that's almost completely absent from TPM and TFA - Rey has never seen a Jedi prior to meeting Luke, and Anakin was specifically *not trained* by Qui-Gon in TPM.

I mean, it is utter silliness to have Rey bond with fucking Han - who has no clue about the Force. It would have been so much better if it had beein either Leia or Luke.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

It is almost precisely the same as what happened in TFA; the only difference was that Rey was telling herself and remembering what she was told, vs Luke being told "use the force". If that's enough explanation for you I guess that's cool, but I don't think having an alexa reminder is proof that there was a whole lot of training.

Told what by who? Who gave her the *slightest* bit of mentoring in the ways of the force before that moment? 

Luke on the other hand, is applying the lesson he learned earlier on the falcon. Without his targeting computer his lack of awareness is analogous to fighting the remote with a blast shield obscuring his vision. I don't know if you'd call that a Chekov's gun, but it's similar. Again, it might thin, but it's something

20 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

The first part of the fight Rey fights Kylo she gets her ass kicked too. Per your criteria below we had 'established' that Rey was great at hand to hand combat earlier in the movie because she swung a stick. Why is that not enough?

Because you can't cut yourself in half if you swing a stick wrong. Because, unlike a stick, there is an established canon, from multiple films and television shows, that a lightsaber is a unique weapon and requires, like, practice and skill to wield properly. The kind of practice and force abilities her opponent in that fight had. It's not like she was sparring with an amateur and it's not like she was David Carradine with that stick anyway. 

It should also be noted, the only times Luke goes "Saber to Saber" with anyone in the OT, it's against someone who isn't actually trying to cut him to ribbons. It's perfectly plausible that if he went up against say, Darth Maul in RotJ, he'd have died. 

29 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

Anakin's piloting skills are explained by a 9 year old being able to fly jets at breakneck speed? That's not an 'explanation'. That's saying he's amazing at it to start with. 

No he's amazing to start with because he's the only human who can pilot a pod racer in anger. He can do this because he's strong with the force. Being strong with the force allows him, on some level, to perceive events just before they happen, making him appear to have superhuman reflexes.  This is exposition that's actually in the film. It's compatible with the established lore and it's all that's needed. It might be "magic" but even magic has rules.

44 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

The explanation is that piloting is as much force-powered as anything else. We see this with Luke, with Vader, with Anakin, with other Jedi pilots having their own craft. 

Piloting well is. Luke and Anakin both have experience. Rey presumably does too. That said, there's still a spectrum. Kenobi, from what I understand, was a middling pilot by Jedi standards. 

54 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

Now, if you want to get into the weirdness of Rey being able to jedi mind trick someone without seeing it - yeah, I agree! That one is super weird. I think it's about as weird as Luke grabbing his lightsaber with the force; neither should have any idea that that's what the force lets you do. But it's still pretty odd! I wonder why you're not upset that Luke didn't ask Yoda 'hey, I was able to grab a lightsaber from a distance, what's up with that?' though. 

Not really. There's a considerable interval that passed since the Death Star's destruction and the battle on Hoth and we know Luke has been communicating with Kenobi's spirit. And we only saw part of the lesson on the Falcon from Han Solo's POV. At some point Kenobi tells Luke to travel to Degobah. That conversation is never shown but we know it happened.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

The first part of the fight Rey fights Kylo she gets her ass kicked too. Per your criteria below we had 'established' that Rey was great at hand to hand combat earlier in the movie because she swung a stick. Why is that not enough?

Because Kylo has far more training than her and equal inherent strength in the Force that should nullify any advantage it might have given her against a non-Force-sensitive opponent? And it comes after several previous examples of the movie doing badly at introducing her abilities, eg she's introduced as an impoverished and isolated junk scavenger, so the revelation she knows how to pilot the Falcon comes out of left field. If she'd been introduced as Unkar Plutt's assistant, it would seem much more natural that she has piloting experience.

44 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

Also it's weird to think this, but consider: Luke needs to lose to Vader at that moment so that he can both find out that Vader is his father and so that he can use Vader to kill the Emperor. That is the Force throughline. If the Force willed that Luke would win, well, he would have won. 

Personally I don't interpret the Force as consciously manipulating large scale events like that. It's an energy field that responds to people with the ability to tap into it, it doesn't have a plan.

44 minutes ago, KalVsWade said:

Now, if you want to get into the weirdness of Rey being able to jedi mind trick someone without seeing it - yeah, I agree! That one is super weird. I think it's about as weird as Luke grabbing his lightsaber with the force; neither should have any idea that that's what the force lets you do. But it's still pretty odd! I wonder why you're not upset that Luke didn't ask Yoda 'hey, I was able to grab a lightsaber from a distance, what's up with that?' though. 

Luke had a couple of years of private study between movies to get to that point. Rey had a couple of hours. Then a day or two with Luke before facing Snoke.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Why should this even be a concern? It's perfectly reasonble to assume that as spacecraft technology matures, there's going to be a degree of standardization and convention that naturally creeps in. I drive a Ford. I'm also quite proficient at driving Hondas, Toyotas, Audis, Mercedes's. Chryslers...

I must say that is likely one of the best takes on things in this world I've ever read. Well done.

In this context one must also add that the folks in this world are all 'more enlightened beings' than we are - they have elected queens who are in their early teens, children can be pod-racing champions, human folks somehow can easily enough learn to understand Shyriwook, etc.

In context, it is not surprising that somebody who would just a backwater peasant in our reality would have the potential to be more. You don't really need the Force for all that. These people work consistently a tidbit different than real people.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guys, in context of silly lightsaber duels - when the Force guides your hand, you win. The better you are with the Force, the better you should be ... but if the Force wanted to favor me and I was born with the potential even I could wipe the floor with Dooku, Yoda, and Palpatine.

In the end, skill means nothing if you are kissed by the Force.

The OT pretty much hammers home that fact with Luke in TESB and ROTJ. People seem to make a big deal about there being ten years between TPM and AOTC - but that's just so that Anakin is a proper man and his romance with Padmé no longer bordering on child abuse. This was not necessary so that Anakin could be 'a great swordfighter'.

By the logic of those movies little Ani could have wiped the floor with Maul - just as Yoda wiped the floor with Dooku.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, KalVsWade said:

Yep, this continues to be bullshit. Luke turns off a targeting computer and shoots a proton torpedo into a hole the size of a large dog and that proceeds to take a right turn. In TESB, Luke uses force telekinesis despite never having a single bit of force training or even seeing it once. Luke is able to block laser blasts because Obi-Wan tells him to relax, and is able to do so in a matter of minutes of picking up a saber. Anakin is able to fly a space ship and destroy a major war asset when he's like 9 years old, as well as pilot two jet engines strapped to a go-kart. 

You just don't need montages or heavy training if you're strong in the force or you trust the force. Note the most implausible things that get done in the movies happen when that person surrenders to the force entirely - Luke with the trench run, Rey with the duel. The idea that it takes some kind of different ability or that swordfighting requires physical training but shooting a torpedo only requires instinct is incredibly ass-backwards; if anything, you would think that dueling would be the least requiring training and most relying on the force for flow and behavior. 

 

The difference is Luke actually loses fights and gets help from others; heck you can make a drinking game out of how many times someone needs to save him in ANH. All Rey ever does is win, win and win some more. It was like it was a stipulation on Disney's part, that their new lead, wasn't allowed any moments of weakness. The closet we ever get is Ben putting her to sleep with his mind and Snoke hold her in place, with the force.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Told what by who? Who gave her the *slightest* bit of mentoring in the ways of the force before that moment? 

Like, all the Jedi that she saw in her vision? 

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Luke on the other hand, is applying the lesson he learned earlier on the falcon. Without his targeting computer his lack of awareness is analogous to fighting the remote with a blast shield obscuring his vision. I don't know if you'd call that a Chekov's gun, but it's similar. Again, it might thin, but it's something

Again, if that's really what is acceptable to you as far as it goes that's fine, but I don't think that your rationalizations are particularly persuasive or objectively valid. 

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Because you can't cut yourself in half if you swing a stick wrong. Because, unlike a stick, there is an established canon, from multiple films and television shows, that a lightsaber is a unique weapon and requires, like, practice and skill to wield properly.

No, there really isn't. The one bit of canonical movie training has Luke able to block lasers after a 5 minute session of encouragement. We see zero lightsaber training with Luke and Yoda. We see zero lightsaber training with Anakin. The only other training session we see is younglings getting shot by drones. 

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

The kind of practice and force abilities her opponent in that fight had. It's not like she was sparring with an amateur and it's not like she was David Carradine with that stick anyway. 

Again, she actually lost! Heck, she ends up losing TWICE - once on Takodana when she gets captured and again in the fight with Kylo Ren. 

But again, it's super convenient for you to gloss over the actual canon when it doesn't suit you, and then fanwank it when it does. 

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

No he's amazing to start with because he's the only human who can pilot a pod racer in anger. He can do this because he's strong with the force. Being strong with the force allows him, on some level, to perceive events just before they happen, making him appear to have superhuman reflexes.  This is exposition that's actually in the film. It's compatible with the established lore and it's all that's needed. It might be "magic" but even magic has rules. 

Sorry - are you saying that perceiving things before they  happen is a useful skill in piloting something at mach 3, but is somehow not actually useful when fighting people with a laser sword? 

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

Not really. There's a considerable interval that passed since the Death Star's destruction and the battle on Hoth and we know Luke has been communicating with Kenobi's spirit.

No, we don't. We have absolutely no indication he's been talking with Obi Wan other than the scene in the blizzard, and he appears to be incredibly surprised. Obi-Wan sends him to train there because he needs training and Obi-Wan can't apparently do it. You can extrapolate that he's been training, but there's nothing canonical that says he is and nothing that happens other than that TK pull indicates he is. If he has been training he's kind of super shitty at it. 

2 hours ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

And we only saw part of the lesson on the Falcon from Han Solo's POV. At some point Kenobi tells Luke to travel to Degobah. That conversation is never shown but we know it happened.  

We literally see the part where Kenobi tells Luke to go to Dagobah.

 

2 hours ago, felice said:

Because Kylo has far more training than her and equal inherent strength in the Force that should nullify any advantage it might have given her against a non-Force-sensitive opponent?

The force does what it wants, and Rey is clearly stronger in the force than Kylo Ren is. That is actually canonical too. 

2 hours ago, felice said:

And it comes after several previous examples of the movie doing badly at introducing her abilities, eg she's introduced as an impoverished and isolated junk scavenger, so the revelation she knows how to pilot the Falcon comes out of left field. If she'd been introduced as Unkar Plutt's assistant, it would seem much more natural that she has piloting experience. 

In the movie she's telling us she's been getting it ready to go and has been working on it for months. 

2 hours ago, felice said:

Personally I don't interpret the Force as consciously manipulating large scale events like that. It's an energy field that responds to people with the ability to tap into it, it doesn't have a plan. 

That is literally not what Kenobi tells Luke when he introduces Luke to the Force.

2 hours ago, felice said:

Luke had a couple of years of private study between movies to get to that point. Rey had a couple of hours. Then a day or two with Luke before facing Snoke.

So on that - she utterly gets her ass kicked  by Snoke. The notion that Rey wins always and Luke loses always is another example of just ignoring the parts that don't work the theory. In TFA she gets captured and knocked out by Kylo Ren, then she starts getting her ass kicked by Kylo Ren before literally submitting to the Force and letting it guide her actions. In TLJ she is shown over and over to be fairly incompetent by Luke before getting herself captured by Snoke and being thrown around the room easily and painfully. She also needs Kylo to save her from the guards in that scene. 

And then she loses to Kylo Ren AGAIN in TRoS on the water, relying on Leia distracting Kylo Ren to win.

But also - what does 'private study' help you with? 

1 hour ago, sifth said:

The difference is Luke actually loses fights and gets help from others; heck you can make a drinking game out of how many times someone needs to save him in ANH. All Rey ever does is win, win and win some more. It was like it was a stipulation on Disney's part, that their new lead, wasn't allowed any moments of weakness. The closet we ever get is Ben putting her to sleep with his mind and Snoke hold her in place, with the force.

Again, see above. Rey loses a bunch of fights and needs a ton of help from all sorts of people. Including the two parts you mention, where she is, ya know, losing. So yes, I agree - she wins all the fights except for the ones she loses. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

What vision? In Maz's basement? The random jumble of visions she had no idea how to interpret?

Yep! If you're going to randomly decide that 3 minutes of training and Obi Wan helpfully reminding Luke to use the force during his mindfulness app is enough, I'll say a crazy montage of tons of force wielders is enough for her to know about how to do various powers and stuff. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ugh…how did Maz gets Anakin’s lightsaber again?  I wonder if that pit in Cloud City empties outside into space, or it has a physical bottom?

Wait…did someone in an earlier post refer to me as a prequel and Disney defender?  Yeah, that ain’t the case.  Here are my thoughts on the movies.

Episode 1 - Good, if you can get over Jar Jar (who I didn’t mind)

Episode 2 - I hated this movie.  Not just a bad Star Wars movie.  One of the worst movies ever made.

Episode 3 - This one is my guilty pleasure.  Sets up lots of plot inconsistencies with OT, but overall it has a great pace to it.  The atmosphere feels just right.

Episode 4 - Classic.

Episode 5 - My all time favourite movie.

Episode 6 - I hate Jabba’s palace. Great space battle, and the stuff between Luke/Vader/The Emperor is so good

Episode 7 - Obviously writers play it safe by copying most of Episode 4.  I still enjoy it.

Episode 8 - I may actually hate this movie more than Episode 2.  Nothing in this movie works for me (some of the Kylo and Rey stuff okay, but so much bad).

Episode 9 - I can’t get over Palpatine back.  It’s makes ROTJ has less dramatic meaning.  The movie felt like 2 movies jammed into 1.

Rogue One - Nothing about this movie stands out to me.  Characters are all so bland.  CGI Tarkin creeps me out.

Solo - I thought it was fun.  Not sure why people hated it so much.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, KalVsWade said:

Again, if that's really what is acceptable to you as far as it goes that's fine, but I don't think that your rationalizations are particularly persuasive or objectively valid. 

As opposed to "fuck all", yes it's acceptable. And all he did was aim an pull a trigger. He didn't go toe-to-toe with Kylo Ren.

4 hours ago, KalVsWade said:

No, there really isn't. The one bit of canonical movie training has Luke able to block lasers after a 5 minute session of encouragement. We see zero lightsaber training with Luke and Yoda. We see zero lightsaber training with Anakin. The only other training session we see is younglings getting shot by drones. 

So, there wasn't any lightsaber training except where there was? Good to know. And that little low-power droid on the Falcon was totally as formidable as Kylo Ren in combat. Who can say it wasn't?

What is depicted is an academy of Monk wizards who spend decades honing their skills but, "Lightsaber combat"? Training in "The Weapon of a Jedi Knight"? Gee I don't know about that one. But hey, I'm the one glossing over canon, right?

4 hours ago, KalVsWade said:

Sorry - are you saying that perceiving things before they  happen is a useful skill in piloting something at mach 3, but is somehow not actually useful when fighting people with a laser sword? 

Kylo Ren has the same powers she does and training and skill with the weapon. She never even held one before that day. What are you not getting about this?

3 hours ago, KalVsWade said:

Yep! If you're going to randomly decide that 3 minutes of training and Obi Wan helpfully reminding Luke to use the force during his mindfulness app is enough, I'll say a crazy montage of tons of force wielders is enough for her to know about how to do various powers and stuff. 

And what does Ben say to him? "You've taken your first step into a larger world." Which totally translates as, "Within 24 hours you'll be ready to fight a Sith Lord and hand him his ass in combat." Thank you for perfectly illustrating my original point. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Rubicante said:

Ugh…how did Maz gets Anakin’s lightsaber again?  I wonder if that pit in Cloud City empties outside into space, or it has a physical bottom?

I could be wrong but think this was a relic of the earliest episode VII scripts. Like they would find luke's hand and want to return his sabre.

I'm not defending it, I'm just saying I think they did have an idea as to how the lightsaber got back into circulation.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Rubicante said:

Episode 1 - Good, if you can get over Jar Jar

This is objectively false.

Quote

Episode 2 - I hated this movie.  Not just a bad Star Wars movie.  One of the worst movies ever made.

 

Quote

Episode 3 - This one is my guilty pleasure.  Sets up lots of plot inconsistencies with OT, but overall it has a great pace to it.  The atmosphere feels just right.

....

Quote

Episode 4 - Classic.

Quote

Episode 5 - My all time favourite movie.

Watch more movies. There are worse movies than The Clone Wars. and uh yeah the opposite as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, RumHam said:

This is objectively false.

 

....

Watch more movies. There are worse movies than The Clone Wars. and uh yeah the opposite as well.

Yep.  It’s called The Last Jedi.  Also, Leprechaun in Space is pretty bad.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Rubicante said:

Yep.  It’s called The Last Jedi.  Also, Leprechaun in Space is pretty bad.

 

Lets not say things we can't take back. Leprechaun 4: In space is _awesome._ This is a movie where a space marine contracts the leprechaun as an std and then tried to pee him out only to die in the process.

But getting back on topic, I dunno. If you legitimately think The Last Jedi is worse than Rise of Skywalker....I just don't think we're going to be friends.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...