Star Wars: Nothing But Star Wars

[DMC]

42 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

“When last we met I was the learner now I am the master”?

Well, as predicted by..everybody, Obi-Wan did make a comeback and take him to school one last time there.  Pretty clear Obi-Wan is still the master when he says "goodbye Darth" - which was a good through line to referring to him as Darth in ANH (which otherwise is a weird thing to call somebody, might as well just call him "sith" ..or "dark lord," I guess).

Anyway, I think this was a really good treatment that was, generally in the process of development, poorly executed.  All the beats are there, most everything I'd want at least.  But whether cuz it was stretched too thin or whatever, it didn't quite work.  The Leia relationship was definitely too stretched out and, yeah, fucks with the iconic line.  But that ship sailed at the beginning of the third episode when she clearly knew his name was Obi-Wan.  And yeah, the Vader unmasking ripped off the Ahsoka scene in Rebels, but not sure how else you do that..I guess cut his mask horizontally instead of vertically?

All in all, a pretty solid finale to another meh project.  Episodes 3 and 4 were pretty fucking bad, but other than that it was fine.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Spoiler

Did anyone else want Qui-Gon to say, “So… I asked you to train the boy… not drive him into the waiting arms of a hidden Sith Lord.  You couldn’t find time in ten years to rescue his Mother?  Really?”

 

[sifth]

So is Ben like the strongest Jedi? He beats Vader twice now, the first time when the guy was in his prime.

[Kalbear]

52 minutes ago, sifth said:

So is Ben like the strongest Jedi? He beats Vader twice now, the first time when the guy was in his prime.

He also beat maul. Though got crushed twice by dooku. 

I think he's the most powerful or one of the most powerful when he has a personal connection and taps into his emotion. But outside of that he is merely really good.

[Deadlines? What Deadlines?]

1 hour ago, sifth said:

So is Ben like the strongest Jedi? He beats Vader twice now, the first time when the guy was in his prime.

Captain America went Mano a Mano with Thanos at the end of Infinity War. By some miracle, he didn't end up with his brains and bits of skull sprayed all over the creation. This is Disney. Power levels service the plot. I have made peace with this.

 Nitpicks aside, I really liked this series. It was a bit clunky at times but somewhat better than S2 of Mando and S1 of BoBF. This episode hit me right in the feels. If they really wanted to wreck me, they could have hit me with "A Home For Twins" from the RotS OST.

ETA: For some reason my keyboard wasn't working properly when I posted this.

I'll add that the boss fight was pretty cool. I liked the kids. I liked the Kenobi shade. His final reunion with Leia at the end was nice but somewhat nonsensical from a plot perspective. 

[Werthead]

In terms of raw strength, Anakin is superior to Obi-Wan, but Obi-Wan has superior focus, discipline and control. In every situation where Obi-Wan keeps his shit together and Anakin loses his (which is almost every time), Obi-Wan wins. Interestingly, it's when Vader keeps his cool and lets Luke lose his that Vader wins as well (in ESB).

I do think that Anakin/Vader does have something of a death wish though, especially after he ends up in the suit.

It's also worth remembering that Obi-Wan defeats Maul twice, which is no mean feat either.

[dbunting]

Overall I liked the series. I was a little put off on their dependence on 6 year old Leia, she had to fix the wiring last episode, that was just silly. Third Sister just opening the door with her light saber like a can opener was also silly. Other than that It was pretty good for me.

I liked the last duel between them when we see Obi-Wan attack Vaders life support system, it's an obvious weakness for him. A Jedi should be able to use the force and simply crush it every time rendering Vader harmless. I also think it is completely in line with the Jedi for him to walk away and leave Vader there and not finish him off, but where did the Imperial Cruiser go? Why wasn't it waiting out there to pick off Kenobi?

Finally the Third Sister fight at the farm would have seemed more real had they shown her try to use the force on objects and struggle due to her injury. Otherwise she could've used it and wiped them out easily. Wouldn't be shocked if they do a one season thing on her showing what she does after this, some sort of redemption.

[DaveSumm]

Worth the price of entry just to see half-Vader like in Rebels. That was awesome. Finally seeing Anakin actually connect up to Vader in some way, see how they might be the same person (which Lucas flunked massively in RotS) was so satisfying. 

But overall, a cool scene does not a series make. There’s still nothing of substance here that merits making a season from, and we’re just left with some wonky canon to work with and a fight scene that was better than Episodes III and IV, when it should be the least relevant of those fights.

Even the tidbits of an arc from the first episode, like Kenobi’s loss of faith and struggle to connect with Qui-Gon, are just kinda fixed off screen and he can just beat Vader again, and then Qui-Gon sensationally turns up to … show him the way to his house? Err … great. OK. I had in mind something that showed why he was able to manifest as a force ghost, hinted at teaching Obi-Wan to do the same, and how much power one could achieve through this, more power than any Sith could possibly imagine…

Nope. Oh well. 

[Soylent Brown]

I enjoyed the last episode and thought the final scene between Obi-Wan and Leia was quite touching. The little actress who plays her isn't great at running, but she's nailed most of the acting bits.

[RumHam]

1 hour ago, Deadlines? What Deadlines? said:

This is Disney. Power levels service the plot. I have made peace with this.

Seems unfair to pin this on Disney. I feel like you see this everywhere? Including the Star Wars stuff not made by Disney.

What they should have done with Captain American and Thanos was have him die, and then be inadvertently brought back when Thanos re-winds local time to get Vision's stone. that would have been neat.

I surprised myself by watching this first instead of Ms. Marvel or Dr. Strange 2. I have a pretty low opinion of the show, but it must be doing something right.

[Werthead]

39 minutes ago, dbunting said:

Overall I liked the series. I was a little put off on their dependence on 6 year old Leia, she had to fix the wiring last episode, that was just silly. Third Sister just opening the door with her light saber like a can opener was also silly. Other than that It was pretty good for me.

Leia is supposed to be 10 at this point and I think the actress is as well. It is interesting how Hollywood casts older than normal, so we get used to seeing 12-13 year olds playing 9 or 10, or 21 year olds playing 17, so when we see an actor who is the right age, they look "too young."

Quote

I liked the last duel between them when we see Obi-Wan attack Vaders life support system, it's an obvious weakness for him. A Jedi should be able to use the force and simply crush it every time rendering Vader harmless. I also think it is completely in line with the Jedi for him to walk away and leave Vader there and not finish him off, but where did the Imperial Cruiser go? Why wasn't it waiting out there to pick off Kenobi?

I think the idea is that Vader is partially using the Force all the time to keep himself alive, and can use the Force for defence (to protect and reinforce his armour) as well for offence. Obi-Wan probably couldn't hurt him or his suit until he'd gained the upper hand in combat.

I think the disappearing Star Destroyer might have been a rare moment of sanity in Star Wars physics. Fly around the planet and take off from the opposite hemisphere and a ship in orbit will need to circle around before it can get after you. One ship being able to somehow blockade an entire planet, as has been implied happening before, is just silly. There's also a good chance that Vader had either called for a rescue team from the ship or was slowly and painfully making his own way back, preventing the destroyer from also chasing Obi-Wan.

[Poobah]

One thin that particularly stood out to me was that after being left to die on the other planet last episode did Reeva just walk to Tatoween or what?

[mormont]

6 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

How do we explain the line from “A New Hope”… “When last we met I was the learner now I am the master”?  It seems really out of joint now.

Same way we explain everything in this series. It was a really long fever dream Obi-Wan had when he drank some expired blue milk.

[Darryk]

I admit I really enjoyed the duel between Vader and Obi-Wan, and the part where Vader is unmasked and speaks with both Vader and Anakin's voice gave me chills.

But other than that, the usual dumb really. No real explanation for why Obi-Wan going from having his ass kicked by Vader to kicking Vader's ass in one day. 

Reva got stabbed as a kid and as an adult and survived both. They don't make lightsabers like they used to.

The closeness of Obi-Wan and Leia doesn't make sense at all because, aside form her message addressing him as a friend of her father's, she doesn't care at all when he dies in ANH.

[sifth]

6 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

How do we explain the line from “A New Hope”… “When last we met I was the learner now I am the master”?  It seems really out of joint now.

To be fair, that line didn't make sense before this show either. Anakin was not a "learner" when he and Ben last met in episode 3. He was a full on Jedi Knight, with his own apprentice, if we're counting the Clone Wars cartoon. It's clear as day, that line was written, back when Anakin and Vader were two separate characters.

[DaveSumm]

23 minutes ago, Darryk said:

The closeness of Obi-Wan and Leia doesn't make sense at all because, aside form her message addressing him as a friend of her father's, she doesn't care at all when he dies in ANH.

Don’t forget, when it comes to setting your barometer for how Leia reacts to stuff, she was pretty chill about her home planet exploding. She’s all “aren’t you a little short to be a stormtrooper?” within a few hours.

[SpaceChampion]

1 hour ago, Werthead said:

Leia is supposed to be 10 at this point and I think the actress is as well.

I think at the time of filming she was 9, perhaps even 8.  Which is good if they do another series with her (Kenobi or something else) soon, she likely won't look like she's 13 when Leia is aged 11.  And Leia is short, so getting a younger actress helps.

Edit, yep, she was 8.  b-day is June 2, so she's 10 now.

[DaveSumm]

I guess Mr ‘I’m just getting started (at leadership)’ will be in Andor?

[Caligula_K3]

So, as most people have said, that was pretty mediocre all around. Some good ideas, some bad ideas, some great acting from Ewan, some bad acting from Flea, and a 10 year old Leia plot that should have never existed - or at the least ended in episode 3 at the latest. There was a good idea for a show in here, but it got buried beneath everything else.

But what can you do? I've realized since watching this and the Mandalorian that these Star Wars shows aren't really for me. They're for me if I was still a 12 year old. Back then I gobbled up Star Wars books no matter how shitty they were. It didn't matter if the empire was building a Death Star but it blew up SUNS or if the Hutts were building their own Death Star for some reason or if there was a twentieth Palpatine clone or if Han was competing with some douchebag for Leia's hand in marriage or if the Solo twins were off on some stupid adventure - I read it and I loved it.

Nothing in the TV shows has been as bad as some of that (though I haven't bothered watching Book of Boba Fett), and I'm sure for some 12 year olds out there, these shows are a fun way to explore more of the Star Wars universe. But I think as an adult who has plenty of good or great TV to catch up on... I'm out.

[Underfoot]

Call me an Ashoka Tano fangirl but I'm annoyed they ripped off her fight scene with Vader/Anakin in rebels, with the cutting away of the mask and Anakin's voice coming through.

Maybe I wasn't paying attention enough throughout the series, but Obi-Wan's comeback in terms of general strength felt pretty unearned. Some thoughtful expressions in the span of two episodes doesn't cut it for me.

Anyways, this was probably the best episode of the season due entirely to the fight scene, but that's about all I can say. Disappointed, and now very worried about the quality of Ashoka coming up, if they couldn't get this right.