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What’s a popular theory you fervently hope doesn’t come true?


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On 6/17/2022 at 5:00 PM, sifth said:

Victarion's entire mission is just to die and get killed in Essos. I hate pointless stories that go nowhere. Quentyn Martell's was bad enough, I hope we don't get a second one.

 

On 6/17/2022 at 5:05 PM, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

To be honest, there's nowhere else to go with Victarion. Personally, I don't mind him going to Essos and dying there, but I hate that he has to be a POV character for it. It just takes up valuable page space.

What makes you think their arcs are pointless? Both Quentyn and Victarion have had a lot of influence on the plot, and the former might not even be dead. Victarion obviously still has a big role to play in the coming battle, there's a reason his holds are filled with pork. 

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On 7/1/2022 at 4:21 AM, sifth said:

I'd also prefer Dany to not turn into a supervillain like she does on the tv show, but odds are that's going to happen, since GRRM told D&D how this whole story is suppose to end.

I believe Elio & Linda all but confirmed Mad Queen was going to happen, but that it would be more gradual, and make more sense. 

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1 hour ago, Jekse said:

 

What makes you think their arcs are pointless? Both Quentyn and Victarion have had a lot of influence on the plot, and the former might not even be dead. Victarion obviously still has a big role to play in the coming battle, there's a reason his holds are filled with pork. 

What has Quentyn's POV shown us, that was important to the story. At the end of the day, all it shows us, is how he gets himself killed. Like Oberyn, his story could have been told, without the character needing POV chapters.

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1 hour ago, sifth said:

What has Quentyn's POV shown us, that was important to the story. At the end of the day, all it shows us, is how he gets himself killed. Like Oberyn, his story could have been told, without the character needing POV chapters.

A POV's purpose is not exclusive to telling a story, the Quentyn quest offers a lot of background on Doran, the Yronwoods, conspiracies in Meereen, along with a strong anti war message, which is basically the point of the series. Quentyn is also basically a stand in for GRRM himself. The two look incredibly alike. 

Oh, and he also released the fucking dragons. 

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Rereading my last post it sounds a bit mean, but you pose an interesting question; what is the point of having the Quentyn POV in an already long and convoluted book if he just dies at the end? And I think the answer is he doesn't. I believe Quentyn will return home with severe PTSD, in a parallel to Vietnam, which GRRM is obsessed with. 

And an addendum, if you believe that dragons are a stand in for nuclear weapons, then Quentyn is responsible for its proliferation. 

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1 hour ago, Jekse said:

A POV's purpose is not exclusive to telling a story, the Quentyn quest offers a lot of background on Doran, the Yronwoods, conspiracies in Meereen, along with a strong anti war message, which is basically the point of the series. Quentyn is also basically a stand in for GRRM himself. The two look incredibly alike. 

Oh, and he also released the fucking dragons. 

You know those dragons could have been released in a chapter not told from his POV. Just picture for a second how awesome a chapter it would have been if Ser. Barry had taken over the city, only for him to have to fight his way to the dragon pit, to find out what happened there. 

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42 minutes ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

Quentyn is basically the female version of Sansa, so the point of his story is to show that "life is not a song". 

Quentyn is a female now, jk

I get what you’re saying, but the guy just seems like such a throwaway character. All of the info we got from him was either pointless or stuff we could have gotten from another character.

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1 hour ago, Jekse said:

Rereading my last post it sounds a bit mean, but you pose an interesting question; what is the point of having the Quentyn POV in an already long and convoluted book if he just dies at the end? And I think the answer is he doesn't. I believe Quentyn will return home with severe PTSD, in a parallel to Vietnam, which GRRM is obsessed with. 

And an addendum, if you believe that dragons are a stand in for nuclear weapons, then Quentyn is responsible for its proliferation. 

We were in the guys head when he was burned alive and we saw him die in bed in a Ser Barry chapter. The guy is gone as gone gets, unless he’s brought back to life by a red priest. 

Edited by sifth
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11 minutes ago, sifth said:

You know those dragons could have been released in a chapter not told from his POV. Just picture for a second how awesome a chapter it would have been if Ser. Barry had taken over the city, only for him to have to fight his way to the dragon pit, to find out what happened there. 

You didn't think the Dragontamer chapter was awesome? Bro
 

5 minutes ago, sifth said:

We were in the guys head when he was burned alive and we saw him die in bed in a Ser Barry chapter. The guy is gone as gone gets, unless he’s brought back to life by a red priest. 

We saw an unrecognizable burnt body die and the action cuts off right before we can actually get a clear idea of Quentyn's fate.  Note that the Meereen story in Dance opens with Daenarys thinking ''burnt bones prove nothing'', and that's not the only thing. Gerris acts completely out of character when talking to Barry, the action cuts away from Quentyn right before he dies, and his burns are mild as fuck compared to other instances in the story where dragonfire occurs. With the other instances the bodies combust instantly, whereas Quentyn has time to see the fire go from his whip, then his hands, then himself. 

That's neither here nor there of course, and I do think GRRM left the possibility open intentionally, if he decides to go back and change it, like he often does. 

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19 minutes ago, sifth said:

I get what you’re saying, but the guy just seems like such a throwaway character. All of the info we got from him was either pointless or stuff we could have gotten from another character.

He is important in the sense that his death will make Dorne side with Aegon, but I agree that he didn't need to be a POV character.

Edited by Takiedevushkikakzvezdy
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46 minutes ago, Jekse said:

You didn't think the Dragontamer chapter was awesome? Bro
 

We saw an unrecognizable burnt body die and the action cuts off right before we can actually get a clear idea of Quentyn's fate.  Note that the Meereen story in Dance opens with Daenarys thinking ''burnt bones prove nothing'', and that's not the only thing. Gerris acts completely out of character when talking to Barry, the action cuts away from Quentyn right before he dies, and his burns are mild as fuck compared to other instances in the story where dragonfire occurs. With the other instances the bodies combust instantly, whereas Quentyn has time to see the fire go from his whip, then his hands, then himself. 

That's neither here nor there of course, and I do think GRRM left the possibility open intentionally, if he decides to go back and change it, like he often does. 

Sorry, but I just didn’t like any of his chapters. They felt like a waste of book space, and contributed to us not getting better stuff, such as possibly one of the major battles, GRRM planned to end the book with. 
 

I don’t believe he’s alive. The reactions from his two friends just seem to real and plus I can’t think of a logical reason for the character to want to fake his death, while letting his two best friends get captured in his place. 

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On 7/29/2022 at 2:16 PM, sifth said:

Sorry, but I just didn’t like any of his chapters. They felt like a waste of book space, and contributed to us not getting better stuff, such as possibly one of the major battles, GRRM planned to end the book with. 
 

I don’t believe he’s alive. The reactions from his two friends just seem to real and plus I can’t think of a logical reason for the character to want to fake his death, while letting his two best friends get captured in his place. 

Well, it does serve a purpose: subverting expectations for the plucky underdog hero (a prince yes, but completely average in looks, fighting ability) sent to woo a princess/queen. Turns out his journey is unpleasant from the outset (the first line of his POV is "Adventure stank"), he wasted time getting there so he's too late to stop her marrying someone else, he has nothing to persuade her otherwise, and gets roasted by trying to fulfill a sunk-cost fallacy.

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3 minutes ago, LongRider said:

Sansa :wub: Boromir for the win!

:commie:

Well, put it this way; she's betrothed to Joffrey, Willas Tyrell is dangled around as a possibility by the Tyrells, she marries Tyrion as the "Key to the North" and he has designs on her, Lysa suggests marrying her to Sweetrobin, Littlefinger betroths her to Harry Hardying. And that's the political stuff. Theon wanted to marry her, Littlefinger wants to have his way with her, Marillion tried to rape her, The Hound wanted to rape her. Sansa ships herself with The Hound... after he tried to rape or kill her, take your pick. And that's just in-universe.

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3 hours ago, Takiedevushkikakzvezdy said:

Yeah, I'm no expert on human behavior, but that one seems strang to me, to put it mildly.

Well, I'm no fan of this one to be perfectly honest with you. I think it serves to show how broken Sansa is, what with the whole "No one will marry me for love" and making up good memories with someone who tried to rape/kill you (not to mention belittles you almost every time you're in the same room).

Edited by Angel Eyes
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9 hours ago, Angel Eyes said:

Well, I'm no fan of this one to be perfectly honest with you. I think it serves to show how broken Sansa is, what with the whole "No one will marry me for love" and making up good memories with someone who tried to rape/kill you (not to mention belittles you almost every time you're in the same room).

If you are referring to what the Hound said to Arya he probably said it to force Arya to kill Jim, he didn't really mean it.

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