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Your Opinions 5: Is GRRM a "bad writer?"


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2 hours ago, frenin said:

Word, it doesn't help that he's still deluding himself into thinking he can finish the books and thus leaving juicier plots he could inish with ease because he doesn't wanna spoiler the books.

We'll never get F&B II

 

He certainly seemed so, Jon isn't Ned's heir and future ruler, Jon shouldn't be privy to those sentiments, Robb should.

Cat and Ned shared everything but Jon's parentage ofc and Ned talked about everything with her.

 

 

Eh, he's only ever in a position to do so because Robb's trusts him and gave him half of his army... 

At least, I’d like to know the outcomes of the Battle of Meereen, Dany’s encounter with the Dothraki, Jon’s death, Margaery’s trial, the Battle of Ice, along with Jamie’s fate, and Sansa’s.

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17 minutes ago, SeanF said:

At least, I’d like to know the outcomes of the Battle of Meereen, Dany’s encounter with the Dothraki, Jon’s death, Margaery’s trial, the Battle of Ice, along with Jamie’s fate, and Sansa’s.

Sansa’s been sitting on Littlefinger’s lap for 11 years. It’s infuriating.

 

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Well if we are talking world building. I wish GRRM had done his research about certain things or contacted people who would know. The man simply does not do science of any kind, whether that's human biology, chemistry, scale/size etc.. He probably should have avoided writing a patriarchy on steroids where 90% of the male population are pedos. Why exactly do the Boltons or Iron Islands (specifically the Greyjoys) still exist? Why are there not more languages in the 7 Kingdoms? A guy 'hanging out' in the female after sex is not romantic GRRM...it's UTI. Has this man ever even seen a child/teenager? Maybe he should have thought of the basics of his fictional world before he ever wrote anything (best example...Stark household that goes to KL is about 100 but the reality is thousands later on, see Tyrells or Martells)? A woman is not going to have romantic thoughts about her unsupported breasts swinging free and chafing against her vest...they are thinking BRA.

There is so much more that can be mentioned.

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5 hours ago, Daeron the Daring said:

I'm not sure why you're defending bad writing if you admit it is.But if u want to make sense of it, Sansa initially wanted complete independence from the 7K, and she ultimately achieved it. That she claimed total independence from Bran as well suggests that she would've wanted it from Jon as well, even more so, if anything, altough there wasnt anything to gain from it.

Sansa was one of my fav characters btw before s8, but she acted like a mother-in-law towards Daenerys. One that wanted his sweet only son not to have anything to do with her.

I think they made Sansa petulant and dumb, I just don’t agree with the notion that she was trying to usurp Jon.

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13 hours ago, frenin said:

We'll never get F&B II

We should be so lucky 

13 hours ago, frenin said:

He certainly seemed so

Nah, Wyman.

13 hours ago, frenin said:

Jon isn't Ned's heir

No, he is not.

13 hours ago, frenin said:

and future ruler

Um...

13 hours ago, frenin said:

Jon shouldn't be privy to those sentiments

Can't hurt 

13 hours ago, frenin said:

Robb should.

Well, Ned was a terrible ruler, father and human being so I think it's more practical to pick one of those options then suggesting the author wrote an impossibility 

13 hours ago, frenin said:

Cat and Ned shared everything but Jon's parentage ofc and Ned talked about everything with her.

Like Ashara? The stories of Brandon Stark? The regifting by Benjin? There's lots Cats in the dark about.

13 hours ago, frenin said:

Eh, he's only ever in a position to do so because Robb's trusts him and gave him half of his army... 

I don't see the correlation, Roose murdered Robb with his own hand, not with half of Robbs army

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16 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I’m surprised that ASOIAF/GOT didn’t inspire a slew of new fantasy/YA novels about dragon queens. Other major book series inspired tons of copy cats, but for whatever reason, publishers failed to capitalize on this pop culture moment.

There are copy cats, although not necessarily YA. Books about different thrones, or just the word "throne" in the title became more common. Also, the Raven's Shadow series by Anthony Ryan had only one POV character for the first two books, but his publisher forced him to have multiple POV's for the third one, which didn't work out very well. This was at the hight of GoT's popularity.

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9 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I think they made Sansa petulant and dumb, I just don’t agree with the notion that she was trying to usurp Jon.

The goal wasn't to usurp Jon. The goal was keeping the North separate from the Iron Throne. Her focus wasn't on Jon or Daenerys, they happened to had been oh her way to her own goal. Not to get the North for herself, or undermine Jon or Daenerys. But to keep the North separate. At least the ending hints heavily towards that. 

And I think the writers tought of it this way as well. They need someone to undermine (ultimately) Daenerys, and Sansa is very fond of northern independence, which creates a conflict. A very dumb one, but that's what they had in themselves. Dumbness. And her intentions don't matter as long as she doesn't pay attention about who she runs over en route. Which she did to multiple people. Multiple times.

Edited by Daeron the Daring
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39 minutes ago, Daeron the Daring said:

The goal wasn't to usurp Jon. The goal was keeping the North separate from the Iron Throne. Her focus wasn't on Jon or Daenerys, they happened to had been oh her way to her own goal. Not to get the North for herself, or undermine Jon or Daenerys. But to keep the North separate. At least the ending hints heavily towards that. 

And I think the writers tought of it this way as well. They need someone to undermine (ultimately) Daenerys, and Sansa is very fond of northern independence, which creates a conflict. A very dumb one, but that's what they had in themselves. Dumbness. And her intentions don't matter as long as she doesn't pay attention about who she runs over en route. Which she did to multiple people. Multiple times.

I wouldn’t say the goal was to usurp Jon, but with him on the Iron Throne, she gets to be Queen of an independent North, or failing that,  Princess of Dragonstone and Wardeness. And that mattered more to her than defeating the Others and Cersei.

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15 hours ago, Mystical said:

Well if we are talking world building. I wish GRRM had done his research about certain things or contacted people who would know. The man simply does not do science of any kind, whether that's human biology, chemistry, scale/size etc.. He probably should have avoided writing a patriarchy on steroids where 90% of the male population are pedos. Why exactly do the Boltons or Iron Islands (specifically the Greyjoys) still exist? Why are there not more languages in the 7 Kingdoms? A guy 'hanging out' in the female after sex is not romantic GRRM...it's UTI. Has this man ever even seen a child/teenager? Maybe he should have thought of the basics of his fictional world before he ever wrote anything (best example...Stark household that goes to KL is about 100 but the reality is thousands later on, see Tyrells or Martells)? A woman is not going to have romantic thoughts about her unsupported breasts swinging free and chafing against her vest...they are thinking BRA.

There is so much more that can be mentioned.

I would have expected a bit more variation by region with the Faith. For example, given the influx of Rhoynar culture in Dorne, would practices be different there than in the rest of Westeros?

Edited by Angel Eyes
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5 hours ago, Hugorfonics said:

Well, Ned was a terrible ruler, father and human being so I think it's more practical to pick one of those options then suggesting the author wrote an impossibility 

I know you dislike Ned but even you know that he's not viewed like that in or out universe and that the writer purposefully made him the paragon of virtue.

 

 

5 hours ago, Hugorfonics said:

Like Ashara? The stories of Brandon Stark? The regifting by Benjin? There's lots Cats in the dark about.

The first he himself refused to, the rest what? 

 

 

5 hours ago, Hugorfonics said:

don't see the correlation, Roose murdered Robb with his own hand, not with half of Robbs army

He got to be in that position because Robb trusted him as one his top advisors and generals.

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One thing I always wondered about George's worldbuilding is the common tongue. I suppose I understand making all Westeros have a single language (easier to write certain things that way), but I wonder why there weren't distinct dialects in various parts of Westeros.  With how large Westeros is and considering it's history, there should have been common tongue dialects in North or Dorne at least. 

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When I first suggested that George just retcon the characters’ ages, I said that it’s not as impossible as it once was, seeing as we live in a world where the Snyder Cut is real and a show called Cobra Kai was nominated for an Emmy. Well, now we live in a world where HBO may be making a “Jon Snow sequel” that will essentially be season 9.

Retcon the ages, George. Crazier things have happened in your own series.

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I don't think character ages have anything to do with the hold up. George has never indicated it's a problem with the progress of the story. 

Seems like a head canon thing. As with this "Jon Snow sequel = Season 9". If it were "Season 9", Benioff and Weiss would be involved, so... yeah, no.

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Just now, Ran said:

I don't think character ages have anything to do with the hold up. George has never indicated it's a problem with the progress of the story. 

Seems like a head canon thing. As with this "Jon Snow sequel = Season 9". If it were "Season 9", Benioff and Weiss would be involved, so... yeah, no.

A horrible thought.

Like Dracula, returning from the grave. 

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