Formula 1 2023

[williamjm]

The last thread is over 20 pages so time for a new one.

That was a bit of a crazy race. I don't think I've seen anything like Zhou's accident on the first start with the car jumping over the barrier, it must have been an alarming moment for the spectators in the stand beyond. It's a relief that nobody was hurt, Zhou might be very grateful for the halo and even though it probably wasn't as high speed a crash as (for example) Verstappen last year it's always a bit worrying when the impacts are at unexpected angles.

The second attempt at the race was also very eventful. Sainz had a weird day, showing good pace at times but making what could have been a crucial mistake to let Max past and then having the humiliation of having to let his team-mate through but he still came out on top. Definitely a bit of luck there, with Verstappen's two passes being negated by first the red flag then his technical issues and Ferrari's questionable strategy leaving Le Clerc on the slower tyres after the safety car. The battle for the podium positions in the last few laps was very entertaining with all the switches of position. I think this is also the first time this year Mercedes have really looked like challenging for a victory, although ultimately Hamilton couldn't quite live with the pace of Perez's Red Bull.

Edited March 4 by williamjm

[polishgenius]

1 minute ago, williamjm said:

Zhou might be very grateful for the halo

Given what happened in the F2 race earlier on, the halo's quite likely saved two lives in one day. How the fuck did we ever get by without it.
 

 

[Tywin et al.]

Rewatching the crash it's amazing Zhou isn't dead. 

[Werthead]

Ferrari's ability to sabotage themselves is amazing. Sainz blowing up and refusing the team orders was absolutely the right call because they were nonsensical gibberish: on new, soft tyres behind Leclerc on old hards, with Perez and Hamilton also on brand new softs, Sainz had zero chance to keep them behind him and Leclerc. His call to get by Leclerc and let Leclerc try to slow them down to give Sainz a chance at the win was absolute the right call. Otherwise Ferrari would have come home 3-4 rather than 1-4.

When your supposed second driver is making better strategy calls from the cockpit rather than the battery of people on the pit wall and a second battery of people back home at the factory, something has gone badly wrong somewhere. Ferrari need to completely rehaul their strategy system because it's been awful all season and peaked in this race.

2 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Rewatching the crash it's amazing Zhou isn't dead. 

The halo and safety cell are required to take loads equivalent to being hit by a main battle tank, so it's not surprising it survived. I was more concerned about whiplash and neck injuries from that way the car snapped against the fence at the end.

Instead he's apparently fine and is expected to take part in the next race in just a week's time. In fact, apparently Albon took more G forces from his (apparently) less serious series of shunts.

[Tywin et al.]

24 minutes ago, Werthead said:

The halo and safety cell are required to take loads equivalent to being hit by a main battle tank, so it's not surprising it survived. I was more concerned about whiplash and neck injuries from that way the car snapped against the fence at the end.

Instead he's apparently fine and is expected to take part in the next race in just a week's time. In fact, apparently Albon took more G forces from his (apparently) less serious series of shunts.

Still it's pretty incredible. I've been watching some old races from the 70's and 80's and a number of drivers died from crashes that on first watch looked far less serious. Modern advancements have saved so many lives. 

[Werthead]

1 minute ago, Tywin et al. said:

Still it's pretty incredible. I've been watching some old races from the 70's and 80's and a number of drivers died from crashes that on first watch looked far less serious. Modern advancements have saved so many lives. 

Yup. On the current grid, Alonso and Hamilton would either be dead or possibly paraplegics without the halo, possibly Leclerc as well.

Edited July 3, 2022 by Werthead

[Tywin et al.]

14 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Yup. On the current grid, Alonso and Hamilton would either be dead or possibly paraplegics without the halo, possibly Leclerc as well.

Which is chilling considering his godfather died racing less than a decade ago.

[polishgenius]

11 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Which is chilling considering his godfather died racing less than a decade ago.

And his best friend in 2019. Which is why he was so shaken up by Grosjean's fireball. 

 

 

In this instance it looks to me like the halo might be stopping the car flipping back over sooner, since it kinda bounces back and forth as it goes sideways over the gravel, though it'd need far better analysts than me to say that with any confidence- and in any case rolling over and over at that speed would probably have been worse. It might also have prevented the hoop from digging into the gravel though, and that would have been nasty if it had. So whatever the hypotheticals I'm glad it was there. 

[Wilbur]

The racing at Silverstone was by far, far the best so far this season.  However, I feel like any poster in this thread could go and make Ferrari's race strategy calls without any noticeable reduction in effectiveness, and with a strong likelihood of improvement.

That F2 crash is chilling to watch, with that second car riding up like Eddie Sachs' fatality at the Speedway.  As mentioned above, the halo saved another life there.

[williamjm]

3 hours ago, polishgenius said:

Given what happened in the F2 race earlier on, the halo's quite likely saved two lives in one day. How the fuck did we ever get by without it.
 

 

That is a horrible looking accident.

3 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Rewatching the crash it's amazing Zhou isn't dead. 

In the commentary I think it was Mark Webber who made the point that the impact wasn't really that big by F1 standards so the important thing was the car remaining intact and the driver's head being protected. Webber is something of an expert when it comes to flipping racing cars.

 

2 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Which is chilling considering his godfather died racing less than a decade ago.

And the Halo was brought in partly because of Bianchi's accident.

[Iskaral Pust]

Very exciting race towards the end.  It would be great to only use actual racing tracks where overtaking is possible.

Veratappen had no luck at all in the race — both the red flag and then the damage — but that opened up the race and made it more competitive.  Sainz’ aggressive defense on the second start looked a bit too aggressive to me — I’m surprised that didn’t attract some scrutiny from stewards but perhaps I’m just too long out of F1 and have lost a sense for what’s OK.  Ferrari still aren’t great at race strategy — how hard can it be?

With Mercedes looking more competitive on pace now, there could be some wild races ahead and jockeying for position.

[TheLastWolf]

Hamilton seems to be making an effort and with results too, flashes of brilliance (past) in that comeback

[lmanion]

On 7/4/2022 at 8:23 AM, williamjm said:

That is a horrible looking accident.

In the commentary I think it was Mark Webber who made the point that the impact wasn't really that big by F1 standards so the important thing was the car remaining intact and the driver's head being protected. Webber is something of an expert when it comes to flipping racing cars.

 

And the Halo was brought in partly because of Bianchi's accident.

Webber also flipped the Merc at Le Mans

[williamjm]

Youtube was recommending me this footage of Spa in 1966 (according to the description filmed for the Grand Prix film). It is like a different world in terms of safety with telegraph poles at the side of the road and very occasionally a straw bale and spectators wandering onto the track during the race.

 

[Werthead]

Helmut Marko is such an odious shit. He disclosed one of his drivers is having mental health problems, is "a problem child" and they have hired a psychologist to try to resolve their issues.

Great, but you don't need to share that with the world and make them feel even worse about the situation.

[Iskaral Pust]

Great sprint in Austria with plenty of entertaining racing.  The Haas DRS train was working pretty well until KMag left Schumacher isolated.  Sainz was showing some more attacking aggression after his race win.  Verstappen won it pretty well but he had to defend some pressure for a while.

[Iskaral Pust]

Another very good race and a well deserved win by Leclerc.  Sainz was unlucky with his engine fire, although Perez was even more unlucky because Russell put him out of the race and a five second penalty is not much of a deterrent.  Ferrari seemed to have superior speed in this race (was Max struggling a bit on the hard tires?) even if Leclerc had to manage that throttle problem toward the end.

Mick Schumacher seems to be finding his groove lately but let’s see if he can sustain that.

[polishgenius]

If I understood it right that Leclerc was dealing with the throttle problem by manually lifting it from underneath with his foot, that is madness. He's quite lucky the stewards didn't haul him in on safety grounds once that message went out. 

Also: insane amount of track infringement notices in this one. 

[Werthead]

Weird weekend. Vettel and Alonso apparently tore into the FIA for poor and inconsistent application of the rules, and when the FIA reps defended themselves, Vettel stormed out of the room and got a suspended fine.

Solid if not spectacular race, good drive from Hamilton and Leclerc drove an excellent race to victory. He needed a race like that. Red Bull seemed a bit perplexed because usually Austria is (almost literally) tailor-made for them but they just couldn't get into the right operating window. Whether that's a Ferrari upgrade or a Red Bull upgrade not working, or something track-specific remains to be seen.

Ferrari might be feeling more bullish now but they need to see how track-specific their success was. They also need to repeat the good strategy calls they made this weekend. I think they also need to settle on Leclerc as their lead driver. Sainz closed down the gap to 12 points, where it becomes a little tough to argue that he has to give way to Leclerc automatically etc. Not that gap is up to 37 points, I think Ferrari can argue for committing fully to Leclerc and Sainz playing a supporting role. Red Bull were never in any real danger of being in the same position, but Perez falling way behind also I think closes down any arguments there.

[williamjm]

6 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

Mick Schumacher seems to be finding his groove lately but let’s see if he can sustain that.

At the start of the season Mick did seem to be outpace by Magnussen but it's been much more competitive in recent races.

It was a good race, with Verstappen leading early on I wondered if he might just stay out front as he did in the sprint race but both Le Clerc and Sainz seemed able to overtake him without too much difficulty, he must have gotten a bit tired of the sight of the Ferraris passing him. It's a pity that Sainz's engine blew up just as he was about to pass Verstappen again, just when his season felt like it was really starting to come together.