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[Spoilers] Rings of Power: Adar, can you hear me?


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9 hours ago, Werthead said:
Calling people who see positives in the show shills for Amazon is, without any doubt, the stupidest, laziest, knee-jerk route of criticism absolutely possible, and far below the standards of debate I'd expect from here.

Yeah, all of us, who actually like the show, must be working for Amazon, no? There is just no other way. If only they were actually paying me! What did I do wrong, Jeff? Did I forget to give you my bank account number?

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1 hour ago, RhaenysBee said:

So a friend sent me some clips of scenes last night. The accents… :lol: I admire the cast and the voice coaches because speaking in a foreign accent must be hard work. It’s always a joy to watch in films and shows and one marvels at the voice acting talent of some actors. But anyway, that was… a choice. That Dwarves will have a Scottish accent and Harfoots an Irish one. 

There’s a lot of chatter around the choice of accents and I get why there might be some offence. The problem is the stereotypes within the UK regions is pretty well established and I’m not sure you can get away from that.

You are always going to have soft southerners and gruff tough northerners. We all think like that already. Like if we think of farmers then we do a Cornish or Somerset accent. So posh English elves and Northern or Scottish dwarves makes sense.

There is an issue with Irish hobbits, I understand the choice if you view Irish as more Celtic and associate it with original peoples. But yeah it does open you up to criticism.

No idea why they didn’t just go with the same accent as the movies. Would have saved them a lot of trouble 

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11 hours ago, Arakan said:

What overdramatic nonsense. The user you replied to was mildly criticizing the series, nothing more. Perfectly fine. Deal with it.

I don’t know if you work for Amazon or not but here is the thing: I don’t give two shits how close it is to Tolkien lore or not. I do care though about good story writing, character development, plot development, acting. And this show is at best mediocre in absolute terms which makes it a joke in relative terms: given the available resources. 

Maybe the first season is all set up and it will get better S2+ but sofar it’s not even close to „being good“. 

Yes, I work for Amazon and so does every single person in the world who is enjoying the show. 

Evidently your only contribution to the discussion here is parrotting the same soundbites that you've copied from the people who make money slagging off various fantasy films and shows on youtube.

It's not even close to being interesting and I'm going to mute you now. Deal with it.

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7 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

There’s a lot of chatter around the choice of accents and I get why there might be some offence. The problem is the stereotypes within the UK regions is pretty well established and I’m not sure you can get away from that.

You are always going to have soft southerners and gruff tough northerners. We all think like that already. Like if we think of farmers then we do a Cornish or Somerset accent. So posh English elves and Northern or Scottish dwarves makes sense.

There is an issue with Irish hobbits, I understand the choice if you view Irish as more Celtic and associate it with original peoples. But yeah it does open you up to criticism.

No idea why they didn’t just go with the same accent as the movies. Would have saved them a lot of trouble 

Yeah, I saw that there were articles about this too. I wonder if there’s any aspect of this show that doesn’t spark emotion-fueled socio-political articles.

As someone who isn’t even a native English speaker, it doesn’t bother me beyond the “why are dwarves suddenly Scottish when they haven’t been for 6 films” extent. But I understand the complaint, and it’s definitely another hole Amazon dug for themselves.

 

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21 minutes ago, RhaenysBee said:

Yeah, I saw that there were articles about this too. I wonder if there’s any aspect of this show that doesn’t spark emotion-fueled socio-political articles.

As someone who isn’t even a native English speaker, it doesn’t bother me beyond the “why are dwarves suddenly Scottish when they haven’t been for 6 films” extent. But I understand the complaint, and it’s definitely another hole Amazon dug for themselves.

 

Gimli is some sort of weird Scottish accent though isn’t he? I can’t remember what they were in the Hobbit but I thought Scottish was the default 

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8 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

Gimli is some sort of weird Scottish accent though isn’t he? I can’t remember what they were in the Hobbit but I thought Scottish was the default 

For above mentioned reasons I don’t have the sharpest ear for accents but they didn’t sound Scottish to me before. Maybe some had a Scottish accent just a less exaggerated one so I wouldn’t recognize it? Google says John Rhys Davis used is native Welsh accent for Gimli. I don’t know. 

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1 hour ago, 3CityApache said:

Yeah, all of us, who actually like the show, must be working for Amazon, no? There is just no other way. If only they were actually paying me! What did I do wrong, Jeff? Did I forget to give you my bank account number?

I absolutely love the show. Love it. Love it. Love it.

Right, where is all my lovely moolah?

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1 hour ago, RhaenysBee said:

For above mentioned reasons I don’t have the sharpest ear for accents but they didn’t sound Scottish to me before. Maybe some had a Scottish accent just a less exaggerated one so I wouldn’t recognize it? Google says John Rhys Davis used is native Welsh accent for Gimli. I don’t know. 

No, John Rhys Davis definitely used a Scottish accent for Gimli.

Welsh was one of the primary inspirations for Quenya and Morfydd Clarke, who is Welsh, is using a slight Welsh lilt for both Quenya and Westron, particularly noticeable in the rolling Rs.

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Just now, Werthead said:

No, John Rhys Davis definitely used a Scottish accent for Gimli.

Welsh was one of the primary inspirations for Quenya and Morfydd Clarke, who is Welsh, is using a slight Welsh lilt for both Quenya and Westron, particularly noticeable in the rolling Rs.

Well then google was wrong :dunno: I believe you, I can only ever recognize the most exaggerated and strong accents. Anything else I won’t notice or just perceive as slightly different than someone else speaking a different accent. 

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1 hour ago, RhaenysBee said:

Well then google was wrong :dunno: I believe you, I can only ever recognize the most exaggerated and strong accents. Anything else I won’t notice or just perceive as slightly different than someone else speaking a different accent. 

To be fair, it’s not a good Scottish accent, so I would forgive anyone for not recognising it. It’s all a bit panto and exaggerated for effect. I was never really a fan of Gimli in the movies, and it’s a bit of a shame that the Hobbit movies and this show seem to have taken  a lot of cues from that performance and dialled it up a notch. Sometimes it works and sometimes it feels over the top. But then this show has a very odd tone that I cannot get to grips with.

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7 hours ago, DaveSumm said:

Possibly being stupid here but … it didn’t occur to me that anyone needs to be Sauron? Is there some lore that establishes he was masquerading as someone else around now?  I figured he was just off being evil somewhere. I mean Halbrand? Never got vibes from the Dark Lord that he might follow Galadriel around and put on a northern accent and give her some sass, meanwhile stealing people’s jewellery…

Yes there is lore, but the timeline is so compressed it's unclear how everything will unfold.

Spoiler

Sauron spends about a third of the Second Age hiding from the Valar, then when he realizes they are not looking for him he quietly moves into Mordor and starts building his power base. If Tolkien ever thought of having some sort of hunt for Sauron story, I don't believe he put any ideas about it on paper.

After securing Mordor, he disguises himself as Annatar (Lord of Gifts) presenting himself as a beautiful, elf-looking being that is a messenger from the Valar and tries to ingratiate himself to various Elf lords. He succeeds with one.

So I suppose if the show is trying to follow this sequence of events, we are at the phase of him securing Mordor, as we see the Orcs stealthily take over the 'Southlands'. But Galadriel's obsessive hunt is definitely a show creation.

 

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9 hours ago, Heartofice said:

There’s a lot of chatter around the choice of accents and I get why there might be some offence. The problem is the stereotypes within the UK regions is pretty well established and I’m not sure you can get away from that.

You are always going to have soft southerners and gruff tough northerners. We all think like that already. Like if we think of farmers then we do a Cornish or Somerset accent. So posh English elves and Northern or Scottish dwarves makes sense.

There is an issue with Irish hobbits, I understand the choice if you view Irish as more Celtic and associate it with original peoples. But yeah it does open you up to criticism.

No idea why they didn’t just go with the same accent as the movies. Would have saved them a lot of trouble 

Only a marginal section of the global audience can pick these things out, like most people around the world who watch this show would not be able to tell an Irish accent from a Scottish one. Being informed enough to connect the accents to real world political issues is really a stretch. It should be a non-issue, but most medieval fantasy stories are plagued by these concerns, if only because of the time period of the story. 

Look, it is a deeply flawed show. One that pulverizes the source material. I did not like LOTR too, because they skipped Bombadil, Ghan-Bhuri-Ghan, Fatty Bolger and others. In this show, Galadriel is just meme material, there are a lot of plot holes, the new characters are incongruent, but that does not stop me from appreciating what they are showing on screen, such as Numenor, the Dwarves and Gil-Galad who looks so ordinary in the BTS but so epic on screen. This is the show we are going to get, and have decided to enjoy it no matter what lol, so I am going to try and post only positive aspects instead of nitpicking endlessly and highlighting what I do not like. I would rather just spend time and energy focusing on the good things as against harping on what was not well done. So just because we are gushing, celebrating and generally behaving like fans, does not mean we do not see where the series falls short. 

Edited by slant
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17 hours ago, Werthead said:

Calling people who see positives in the show shills for Amazon is, without any doubt, the stupidest, laziest, knee-jerk route of criticism absolutely possible, and far below the standards of debate I'd expect from here. Doing that to someone who has posted regularly on this board for over 15 years and is well-known for their Tolkien fandom credentials is really silly.

I didn’t do what you wrote: calling people who like the show as Amazon shills. I was addressing a specific person and her very aggressive and unwarranted tone towards someone who dares criticize the show. 

Let’s leave it at that. 

As I said I don’t care how close the show is to Tolkien. I consider it so far as mediocre in all technical aspects except cinematography and score. 

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On 9/19/2022 at 11:48 AM, DaveSumm said:

Is it possible the Amazon thing was sarcasm? Possibly? Maybe?

It's what I already said it was: copying sound bites from the extreme right wing dudes who make money from slagging off various fandoms on their you tube channels. Those people (and their followers) have been telling anyone who says they like the show that they are an Amazon shill. It's been happening for weeks on multiple different platforms.

Moving on - what are people's thoughts on whether Annatar is already at work, 'influencing', in Eregion? 

As we are halfway through season one now, what do we think might be the closing shot of this season? Mystics? Eruption of Mount Doom? Sauron/Annatar reveal? The Stranger remembers who he is? First ring gets forged?

 

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6 hours ago, fionwe1987 said:

I believe Annatar will be shown coming to Eregion, and be none of the suspects introduced so far. 

I like the forging of the first (lesser) Ring of Power as a final shot, but it may not be that. 

Ooof maybe, this would be good. 

 

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