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[Spoilers] Episode 108 Discussion


Ran
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Well, that was quite the snoozer. Not without its charms though.

This may have been the first episode where I kind of liked Daemon, which was an accomplishment on its own. The passion seems to have largely gone out of his relationship with Rhaenyra already, which is fitting, I think. I'm glad there are consequences for Laenor's grand escape. Rhaenys believes they killed him, and she should. Rhaenyra's selfishness is finally catching up with her.

Corlys has been at war in the Stepstones for six years? And this is after he and Rhaenys lost both of their children in a weekend? Guess he's not a great husband after all.

Aemond looks like Daemon's mini me, right down to the nasally, high-pitched voice. They seem to be characterizing him as both a shit-stirrer and a dutiful son--I thought it was telling how he was the other one aside from Alicent who remained solemn during the prayer before dinner. (I think he was also telling Aegon that he drinks too much at one point). That said, he really does look like a forty-year-old man, to the point where it's comical.

I don't like how they've downplayed the role of the Faith of the Seven among the Targaryens. That's a huge break from the lore. Jaehaerys' Hand was a septon, for crying out loud. Even Rhaenyra made her sons swear upon a bible at one point in the books.

I don't know whether I cared for Vaemond's performance, it felt very theatrical (he was funny during the Inside the Episode though!) His death felt like a jump scare, and I think it reverts back to the showrunners' reliance on random acts of excessive violence to keep things interesting. 

Aegon remains the closest thing this show has to comedic relief. That said, by turning him into a rapist (and not in the she-likes-me-but-she-also-can't-say-no way, but in the I-physically-overpowered-her-and-left-her-in-hysterics way), especially with what looks like a teenage girl, the writers have assured that he will be seen as a villain forevermore. It's also a shame that he's lost whatever goodwill he had towards his nephews.

Really pleased with Jace. He seems like a mix of Jon, Robb, and Tommen, but with a little bit of young Rhaenyra's fire thrown in. Very charismatic, and him making that speech and then dancing with Helaena showed quite a bit of cunning on his part. (He also has a much deeper voice than Aegon and Aemond, which I'm sure annoys them haha). And luckily the wig looked better than it did in the stills.

I guess Luke has been clued in about his true parentage.

Viserys' deterioration was too exaggerated (and dare I say, tiresome). There's no way he should have held out until now, not with medieval medical care. Although it wasn't lost on me that this is what Aegon will look like soon--scarred all over and hooked on milk of the poppy.

Great performances from both Emma and Olivia. The make-up artists managed to make them look older, and for once they were both fairly likable at the same time. The way Alicent treated the serving girl shows just how different she is from Cersei.

Helaena feels underdeveloped, but I thought there was some strong subtext in her dance with Jace. Alicent clearly regrets marrying her daughter to Aegon, and I'm sure seeing how well Jace treated Helaena only compacted that.

There is one huge red flag: still no mention of Daeron. He definitely should have come up by now.

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1 minute ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

A peace undone by asshole kids and a King addled by Milk of the Poppy.

I thought it was an interesting juxtaposition that just as the mothers are nearing towards a peace - mayhaps, granted, just for a dying man's sake - the animus they have imbued unto their children (well, sons) demonstrates it's just not possible anymore.

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8 minutes ago, Winterfell is Burning said:

 

I agree, there's a clear disconnect between these two versions (Emily Carey's was the most sympathetic character in the show probably, Cooke's much less so, even unhinged at times), and also between the two versions of Rhaenyra, though a smaller one.

It's not that the performances aren't great on their own, but feel at times different characters.

Exactly. I wonder whether it would have been better if they did it like in "The Crown". Giving Alcock and Carey first season and then introducing Cooke and D'Arcy in the second. I feel like all these time jumps not only affected our emotional bonds which are practically non-existant. You can't form a bond with a character in the course of one or two scenes. Separating versions by seasons would also work better with different versions of the characters. But then again, I feel like this Alicent and Alicent from two episodes ago are two characters, let alone comparing it with the one Carey played.

1 minute ago, Corvinus85 said:

She said she wasn't involved.

In the murder. Which she wasn't as that murder never happened. 

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3 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

She said she wasn't involved.

I mean, her lie is that Laenor is, presumably, still alive.  I don't disagree with the fake death decision, but I think if they were gonna do it, it'd make sense for Rhaenyra - and Laenor for that matter - to clue Rhaenys and Corlys in.  At least eventually.

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3 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

She said she wasn't involved.

She said she “wasn’t involved in his death”.  That is absolutely true.  Laenor isn’t dead.  He fled with his lover as Ser Cristan asked Rhaenyra to do.

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For the first time, I don't know how to feel about an episode. Except to say that Paddy Considine  may be one of the finest actors in the world. I never expected to be so moved by his characterization. That walk into the throne room. A king until the end and a man who loves his family. But that scene with Alicent? Are we expected to believe the Dance starts because of a misinterpretation of Viserys' last words to his wife? 

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Just now, Sand11751 said:

For the first time, I don't know how to feel about an episode. Except to say that Paddy Considine  may be one of the finest actors in the world. I never expected to be so moved by his characterization. That walk into the throne room. A king until the end and a man who loves his family. But that scene with Alicent? Are we expected to believe the Dance starts because of a misinterpretation of Viserys' last words to his wife? 

Paddy Consindine is killing it.  His Viserys is a man desperately trying to control a situation but unwilling to really assert control over those who undermine his rule.  He believes deeply in the purpose we learn that Aegon set for the Targaryens but doesn’t want to embrace the ruthlessness required to protect and foster that power.  

He reminds me of myself.  Or at least how I see myself.

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6 minutes ago, Sand11751 said:

That walk into the throne room. A king until the end and a man who loves his family. But that scene with Alicent? Are we expected to believe the Dance starts because of a misinterpretation of Viserys' last words to his wife? 

Yeah I continue to dislike them trying to shoehorn "asoiaf" into this, as silly as that may sound.  It just doesn't feel right, and is certainly unnecessary.

As others have said, Viserys' scene entering the throne room is fantastic television/cinema.  Daemon helping him to the throne is just about the only way you're ever going to get me to like Matt Smith.  Quite a scene.

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1 minute ago, DMC said:

Yeah I continue to dislike them trying to shoehorn "asoiaf" into this, as silly as that may sound.  It just doesn't feel right, and is certainly unnecessary.

It doesn't help that GOT completely dropped the ball on the prophecy.  

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Just now, Minsc said:

It doesn't help that GOT completely dropped the ball on the prophecy.  

Very true.

Also, I have to say I'm wondering about the ages of the younger kids now.  Like, Aegon the Younger is supposed to be about 9 when the Dance starts.  And..seems like the Dance is about to start - you didn't even need to watch this episode to know that, just look at the title of next episode.  Are they gonna make the war last much longer than it actually did?  I dunno, seems like the logistics for the kids don't quite work right now.

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3 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Do you mean how the show ended?  Or the fact that the prophecy appears not to have been received by the Targaryen heirs in GOT?

I mean how Jon ended up doing nothing but scream at a dragon when Arya took out the Night King.

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