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The Maesters Poisoned the Kings


Finley McLeod

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There was a conspiracy coming from the citadel but it was not all of the maesters.  The leaders who choose the Grand Maesters were in on it.  The Hightower lords probably knew but Ser Gerold was as loyal a KG to Aerys as a man could possibly be.  It's not every maester but a few in powerful positions.  It is not the Hightower family but some among them who were guilty of the conspiracy.  Maybe that black stone beneath the building is affecting their minds. 

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20 hours ago, Rondo said:

It was a battle for influence.  The magic and might of the Targaryens versus the religion of the maesters, the Seven.  There was little in the way of separation of the church and the state.  There was even less separation between "science" and religion.  Unity of Westeros under the rulership of a Targaryen monarch is the salvation.  So that would make treasons against the Targaryens an act of villainy and a threat to all of the living.  

What's up with this thread?  Sounds like you guys are working on a grand unified theory of weirdness. 

If the Seven is the religion of the maesters and the maesters are working with The Others does that make The Seven the faith of The Others?  Why would the maesters be engaged in acts threatening all the living, aren't they living too?

On second thoughts, don't answer.....

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Marwyn's claims don't actually make much sense at all to me when I think about it. If they are so anti-magic, why do they even give people the option of studying the Higher Mysteries? Why is Marwyn an Arch-Maester if they don't trust him? Why is he allowed to go wherever he wants if they don't trust him? He's already met Mirri, if they didn't trust him then why was he allowed to travel hundreds of miles away to study whatever? Why is he now being allowed to run off and aid Daenerys? If they had such a problem with Aemon, why was he even allowed to live? Become a full-fledged Maester? And the Maesters being responsible for the death of Dragons doesn't really seem to line up either. Most of the Dragons were either killed by other Dragons or killed in the Storming of the Dragonpit. The only dragon deaths where it sounds like they may have been involved were the deaths of the very last few dragons, which were small and deformed.

Also, why would they want to kill the dragons (Targaryens)? A unified Westeros seems to me like it is beneficial for the Citadel. Less fighting, more opportunity for the sharing of ideas, for knowledge to spread, and so on. They have more influence.

The only variant of the 'Maesters killed the Dragons' theory that makes sense to me is if after witnessing all the destruction the dragons caused during the Dance, the Maesters decided to kill the few remaining dragons to ensure it could never happen again. In which case I don't think it's some big evil conspiracy at all, but rather quite sympathetic to be honest.

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On 10/23/2022 at 12:35 AM, Finley McLeod said:

Archmaester Marwyn told Samwell that the maesters had been poisoning the "dragons."  I think he meant the maesters were poisoning the Targaryens.  The Dragon Lords of Valyria, including the Targaryens, were not suffering from mental health issues.  They could not have controlled their dragons if they were. 

They were also inducing miscarriage on the Targaryen queens.  

On 10/23/2022 at 12:35 AM, Finley McLeod said:

The maesters do not trust Marwyn's family.  He could be a Targ bastard, Blackfyre,  Velaryon, or Celtigar.  The maesters are ignorant and do not know about the White Walkers.  If they did they would know the importance of the dragons.  Perhaps they know and are serving the White Walkers. 

Marwyn is too old to come from Aerys.  A half-brother is more apropos.  

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6 hours ago, Craving Peaches said:

Marwyn's claims don't actually make much sense at all to me when I think about it.   

I'll try to answer some of these questions.  My tablet is not very good at editing, so excuse me for not using a lot of quote boxes.

If they are so anti-magic, why do they even give people the option of studying the Higher Mysteries?

The Citadel is very old; it was founded long before the Andals came to Westeros.  I'll guess that at one time, the higher mysteries were a more serious field of study.  But the Andals, following the Faith of the Seven, were anti-magic, similarly to how some present-day Christians feel that any sort of psychic or paranormal abilities are the work of the devil.  As the Faith became more dominant, the study of magic became unpopular, and could arouse the wrath of the septons.  So the Maesters de-emphasized it, but kept it around as a historical subject, rather than a practical one.

Why is Marwyn an Arch-Maester if they don't trust him? Why is he allowed to go wherever he wants if they don't trust him?  He's already met Mirri, if they didn't trust him then why was he allowed to travel hundreds of miles away to study whatever? Why is he now being allowed to run off and aid Daenerys?

As I wrote before, saying "I'm not trustworthy" is not the same as saying "the maesters don't trust me."  I think Marwyn is keeping his activities secret, known only to a few students who are assisting him.  Around the other maesters, he follows the same advice he gave Sam, to "say nothing of prophecies or dragons."  He may even have done or said things to give the impression that he's a harmless eccentric.  They think his travels are just for historical research, for purposes such as writing his Book of Lost Books.  

After hearing Sam's story, Marwyn immediately decided to head for the docks.  He was probably long gone before the other maesters knew that he had left.

If they had such a problem with Aemon, why was he even allowed to live? Become a full-fledged Maester? 

If a member of the royal family wants to study at your academy, it's probably risky to turn him down, much less kill him.  Sending him to the Wall probably seemed like the best option.

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History as taught in Westeros were written by the maesters.  The low rates of literacy meant they could write what they want and most will not know any better.  Ten thousand years and very little progress has been made.  These teachers are not very good at their jobs, ignorant, purposely retarding progress, or all of the above.  All they have done has the effect of keeping the West backwards and undeveloped.  Keeping knowledge to themselves give them power over all of Westeros.  I do not think their motives are benevolent.  But say it is for the sake of our entertainment.  They retard progress, keep people ignorant and weak because it protects the secret of the White Walkers.  Human progress is a threat to the White Walkers. 

I think they were sabotaging the Targaryen dynasty to keep the kingdom weak and easy to break.  They really are sheep and the Shepherds are the White Walkers.  Something will upset the balance and I think it will be the Starks.  One of the Starks will invite the White Walkers in. 

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10 hours ago, Aebram said:

As I wrote before, saying "I'm not trustworthy" is not the same as saying "the maesters don't trust me."  I think Marwyn is keeping his activities secret, known only to a few students who are assisting him.  Around the other maesters, he follows the same advice he gave Sam, to "say nothing of prophecies or dragons."  He may even have done or said things to give the impression that he's a harmless eccentric.  They think his travels are just for historical research, for purposes such as writing his Book of Lost Books.  

He's known as Marwyn the Mage though.  And studying lost knowledge they consider dangerous is obviously dangerous in itself.  As well as out in the open.  Doesn't sound secret. 

12 hours ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

They were also inducing miscarriage on the Targaryen queens.  

Marwyn is too old to come from Aerys.  A half-brother is more apropos.  

Why do you think he is a secret Targaryen?

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On 10/27/2022 at 8:17 PM, Bowen 747 said:

Maybe that black stone beneath the building is affecting their minds. 

It is theoretically possible that the Maesters are not really scientists but a religious cult.  The very same who started praying to the Black Stone and betrayed the ruling family of The Great Empire of the Dawn. 

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  • 4 weeks later...

They went nuts because of what they knew.  The end of the world is coming and only they have the power to stop it.  No one will believe.  They have to keep this a secret while somehow getting ready.  The dragons are gone.  They've no clue how to prepare.  The emotional strain of this knowledge is enough to cause a nervous breakdown in most folk.  It's sheer terror.  They were given a peek at hell.  The living can't handle to look inside hell.  No Xanax, Lexapro, or effective medications were available.  Brain bleaching isn't possible and would only make it worse.   

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