In your opinion, how does House of the Dragon stack up against Game of Thrones?

[$erPounce]

Now that the first season of House of the Dragon has ended, I thought to create a separate topic for any comparisons and discussions concerning both TV series.

Edited October 25, 2022 by $erPounce

[Ran]

It looks and feels more like Westeros. Djawadi is a more confident composer. The production values are of course much higher, but I don't rate that very much when considering these things -- just noting it. Against that, I think it's probably true there aren't quite as many characters yet that you're really devoted to -- for the most part people are all about Rhaenyra, Alicent, Daemon, Corlys, Rhaenys, and/or Aemond, and the other characters are very much secondary, whereas the first season of GoT gave you Ned, Bran, Jon, Catelyn, Sansa, Arya, Tyrion, Cersei, Robert, Dany.... it's not really a fair comparison, though, because GoT is much more cohesive in its narrative due to the lack of timejumps.

I would guess that I think season 1 of GoT was a better season overall than season 1 of HotD, but largely due to having an easier job due to having a more traditional narrative. Covering 20 years in a single season will introduce some choppiness. 

[Feologild]

I think House of The Dragon, stacks up to the best seasons of Game of Thrones.

[EggBlue]

in terms of cinematography , production , music and acting , I rate House of the Dragons higher than GoT season 1 . A LOT HIGHER . although I believe this might not be all that fair due to the huge difference between HOTD s01 budget and GOT s01 budget .

in terms of narrative and character writing , I think GoT season 01 did a much much better job . again this might not be a fair comparison since HOTD had to cover a big timespan with numerous characters coming and going, which wasn't the case for GOT that had a clear narrative with scenes already written in the books only in need of complements in the show. however , I can't help but feel this was basically a hole that the showrunners threw themselves into . F&B is just outlines with too many blanks to fill which could be an amazing opportunity for a writer to delve into the story and figure out everything that leads to plot points .

in comparison , I think HOTD is closer to GOT season 6 but a lot better when it comes to characters . 

[$erPounce]

I have posted my opinion on this elsewhere here. Here is the same post:

 

I think House of the Dragon, despite some flaws, does many things better than Game of Thrones. For example:

• How female characters are portrayed: What David and Dan saw as "strong women" are characters who fully embrace "masculine" skills and simply abandon any vaguely feminine trait because they are considered worthless in the series. Less masculine women are seen as weak or stupid. I feel like there is not even room for empathy and emotions in general in D&D's vision. In short, both Rhaenyra and Alicent are handled far better than just about any female character in Game of Thrones.
• The portrayal of the setting, which is clearly closer to Martin's vision than was the case with GOT). HOTD also explores more the workings of feudalism and patriarchy.
• The sex scenes are a lot better.
• House of the Dragon has themes (though the showrunners aren't exactly subtle with them). For that reason, the TV series feels somewhat more cohesive than it did with GOT. They don't just go from plot point to plot point like a checklist you have to tick off: there is a focus on the bigger picture. 

The first season of Game of Thrones did better than HOTD in terms of characters, but that is largely due to the rock-solid material written by George R. R. Martin. Most of the show-exclusive scenes in GOT season 1 were also very good (though I have to admit that those from seasons 2-4 are not as good). For instance, what David and Dan did with some secondary characters like Osha and Viserys III I thought was very well done. The secondary characters in HOTD feel really underdeveloped (perhaps the many deleted scenes for HOTD would have changed that).

I do have to say that the source material that Ryan Condal adapts is not particularly detailed and extensive, so to compare the end result of HOTD with GOT might not be entirely fair. After all, Fire & Blood is little more than an outline in which many characters are pretty much blank slates. So for HOTD, the dialogue and characterisation had to be created almost from scratch, whereas for GOT, they had the opportunity to copy a lot literally from the books with minimal modifications. It is better to compare Ryan Condal's work with the show-exclusive GOT scenes.

The existence of timeskips in HOTD also creates challenges when writing the characters. Especially when doing a time skip of ten years (and later another of six years). That's practically a lifetime in storytelling. It is not easy to ensure that a character's off-screen evolution comes across as believable. GOT did not have these difficulties.

 

I also notice that House of the Dragon has some bad influences from Game of Thrones, such as focusing too much on "spectacle".  Examples include the excessive bloodshed, the plot-armour in the battle on the Stepstones and sticking to the traditional formula that the penultimate episode should end on a shocking twist or a big fight (the latter led to the nonsensical event of Rhaenys in the Dragonpit). That same approach D&D had for GOT was successful in creating hype and media exposure in general, there's no denying that. HBO is counting on these elements in the prequel to match the success of its predecessor. I had hoped that House of the Dragon would take more risks and have more of an identity of its own... But that would also mean that the TV series would be less appealing to the casual watcher.

Despite Game of Thrones' influences on House of the Dragon, it is also very different. Despite the fact that the TV series often deviates from Fire & Blood, I always have the impression that Ryan Condal succeeds much better than David and Dan in incorporating the spirit and soul of George's works into the show. It is noticeable that Condal is experimenting with concepts that clearly have their basis in the ASOIAF books. Game of Thrones at many points did not feel like a work of George's, probably because David and Dan have a fundamental misunderstanding of what ASOIAF is about.

[King_Tristifer_IV_Mudd]

Peak GoT (Seasons 1-4) is top tier television. 1-4 is probably the greatest show ever. Seasons 5-8 destroyed that.

But to answer your question, HOTD is very good. Easily better than 5-8 of GoT. In terms of quality, it’s what I wished 5-8 could’ve been.

[StarkTullies]

Most of my opinions comparing GOT and HOTD were already stated here, and there is very little I disagree with.

Comparing only Season 1, Game of Thrones is much better, in my opinion.  But I think Season 1 was the best season of Game of Thrones and the easiest season to adapt (a relatively simple plot with relatively few characters, compared to later on).  I think Season 1 will be the hardest season of HOTD to adapt: compressing 20+ years into one season, while the other seasons won't have the time gaps and the number of characters in the source material won't exponentially increase either.

Season 1 of HOTD was about the same level of quality as Seasons 5-6 of GOT, and much better than Seasons 7-8 of GOT.

I'm talking about story and writing quality, not in terms of production.  Obviously HOTD has a bigger budget and it shows.  I want the dragons to look "real" and the backgrounds looking awesome is great too... but that is never what is important to me.  I would rather have ASOIAF and F&B be perfectly adapted exactly according to the books as a low-budget cartoon, but that would never happen because it would never get the ratings that GOT and HOTD got.

And I realize that Fire & Blood requires adaption regardless because of the unreliable historical narrative.  I would have liked them to pick one side of "it could have happened like this or it could have happened like that".  If they change things altogether, at least have it make sense.  Laenor faking his death or Rhaenys murdering hundreds of commoners by bursting through the dragonpit floor to prove how "badass" she was did not make sense.

But HOTD did some things better than GOT.  The gratuitous sex and nudity was a lot less (my least favorite part of GOT Season 1), and what we did have (minus the completely unnecessary and stupid foot fetish scene) actually had a purpose.

I also like ASOIAF much more than F&B, so I expected to like GOT (Seasons 1-4) more.  I intensely dislike the Targaryen legacy, so for me HOTD is more about a narcissistic family self-destructing from their own hate and jealousy and greed.  Which is a great story, but it is also nice to have characters to root for, and I dislike both Team Black and Team Green.

[Dragon in the North]

House of the Dragon was very good (except for two episodes) but it pales in comparison to GOT.

[chrisdaw]

It's better than the series show. Series show was too broad and so moved at too slow a pace, they just went 1 to 1 with the book and never even tried to account for it being a different format. It worked better for binging but week to week it was unsatisfying. Cole is pretty much the only weak actor here whereas GOT was littered with them, including 2 of the big 3, but there's stellar work by the best of both casts. Writing is generally of the same level as the first 3 to 4 seasons minus the sexposition, there's some annoying basic stupidity to both shows (guards only do shit when the script demands it particularly annoys me).

The world looks more wonderful.

This show has offered deeper more well rounded characters than GOT did. D&D's character work was only there because that's how it was in the books, for example, Jaime has this big outpouring on Brienne's shoulder because that's how it was in the book, not because anyone besides Nikolaj gives a fuck about Jaime's arc. Drogo kicking ass scene was because Momoa convinced them it made sense for the character, not because anyone else, like a writer, was thinking about the character. When it came to the characters none of them understood or cared besides an actor here or there, and GRRM obviously who phased out. In HOTD they've taken outlines and had to learn and understand them so that they can flesh them out into characters, it shows that they care about getting them right.

[houseofthedragon]

I think it has quelled my fears after the lackluster finale to Game of Thrones by preceding with elegant grace in its cinematography, direction, and costume design alongside measured wisdom to its superb writing. House of the Dragon has redeemed George R. R. Martin's rich lore world of A Song of Ice and Fire with a visually beautiful, gory action, ruthless betrayal, tender romance, and shocking political maneuvers in the endless Game of Thrones. 

[Areisius]

GoT was a much larger world whereas this is more confined to a particular area but it worked out great for this type of story.

[Ser Arthurs Dawn]

On 12/26/2022 at 7:32 AM, EggBlue said:

in terms of cinematography , production , music and acting , I rate House of the Dragons higher than GoT season 1 . A LOT HIGHER . although I believe this might not be all that fair due to the huge difference between HOTD s01 budget and GOT s01 budget .

in terms of narrative and character writing , I think GoT season 01 did a much much better job . again this might not be a fair comparison since HOTD had to cover a big timespan with numerous characters coming and going, which wasn't the case for GOT that had a clear narrative with scenes already written in the books only in need of complements in the show. however , I can't help but feel this was basically a hole that the showrunners threw themselves into . F&B is just outlines with too many blanks to fill which could be an amazing opportunity for a writer to delve into the story and figure out everything that leads to plot points .

in comparison , I think HOTD is closer to GOT season 6 but a lot better when it comes to characters . 

And the costumes. HOTD wigs are horrific, we all know that.  The costumes though..some of them looked cheap (mainly young Rhaenyra's) but I'm obsessed with the designs. And I was so happy they included jewelry. Side note, they need to let Olivia's Alicent wear a different color. We know she's a TeamGeen gal, they don't need to make her entire wardrobe one color to remind us of that.

My biggest pet peeve with HOTD are some inconsistencies with Rhaenyra and Alicent (and I'm talking older gals). One moment they're ruthless, decisive, and/or ambitious, and the next they're totally passive. But I did like the decision to change their relationship for the show though. And I hate what they've done to Criston, my lawd.

I know the books are unclear about certain events that take place, but it would have been nice if the showrunners had been more decisive on how far certain characters will go for their own motives. It seemed like they were shy about ruthless or harmful actions being carried out by main characters, so they would immediately try to redeem the perpetrator so viewers could once again sympathize with them. But that's just the vibe I was getting. Also, there were certain scenes that I felt were clumsy, unnecessary, or perhaps even out of place.

• Rhea Royce's death. Did the showrunners want us to believe Daemon killed her or not? Perhaps it was meant to be ambiguous and up for the viewer to decide, but all it did was get the Daemon fans to praise him for "mercy killing" her. Because I guess he went all that way just to stare at her for a few minutes.
• Criston murdering Joffrey in front of everyone with zero consequences. (Wish I could pull something like that off.)
• Rhaenys bursting through the floor of the dragonpit.
• Laenor's fake death.
• Rhaenyra's passiveness whilst Vaemond calls her a whore in court. Maybe so Daemon could have another cool moment.
• Alicent crowning Aegon based off a misunderstanding.
• Aemond accidentally killing Luke. (This one actually doesn't bother me that much, I just wanted a bloodthirsty Aemond.)
• NO SUNFYRE???????? Aegon II and Sunfyre have an insanely strong connection and I'll be disappointed if they don't explore that.
• Rape incident

All in all, I wasn't crazy about the 1st season of HOTD, but I feel positive about future seasons. For now, I prefer the first 4 seasons of GoT over s1 of HOTD.

On 12/31/2022 at 10:10 AM, StarkTullies said:

But HOTD did some things better than GOT.  The gratuitous sex and nudity was a lot less (my least favorite part of GOT Season 1), and what we did have (minus the completely unnecessary and stupid foot fetish scene) actually had a purpose.

This 10000000%. One of my friends wanted to watch GoT with me, but she didn't want to see the nudity and sex scenes so we used VidAngel. We were missing too many scenes with vital information so we gave up..

Edited August 31, 2023 by Ser Arthurs Dawn

[Areisius]

On 8/31/2023 at 9:21 AM, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

And the costumes. HOTD wigs are horrific, we all know that.  The costumes though..some of them looked cheap (mainly young Rhaenyra's) but I'm obsessed with the designs. And I was so happy they included jewelry. Side note, they need to let Olivia's Alicent wear a different color. We know she's a TeamGeen gal, they don't need to make her entire wardrobe one color to remind us of that.

My biggest pet peeve with HOTD are some inconsistencies with Rhaenyra and Alicent (and I'm talking older gals). One moment they're ruthless, decisive, and/or ambitious, and the next they're totally passive. But I did like the decision to change their relationship for the show though. And I hate what they've done to Criston, my lawd.

I know the books are unclear about certain events that take place, but it would have been nice if the showrunners had been more decisive on how far certain characters will go for their own motives. It seemed like they were shy about ruthless or harmful actions being carried out by main characters, so they would immediately try to redeem the perpetrator so viewers could once again sympathize with them. But that's just the vibe I was getting. Also, there were certain scenes that I felt were clumsy, unnecessary, or perhaps even out of place.

• Rhea Royce's death. Did the showrunners want us to believe Daemon killed her or not? Perhaps it was meant to be ambiguous and up for the viewer to decide, but all it did was get the Daemon fans to praise him for "mercy killing" her. Because I guess he went all that way just to stare at her for a few minutes.
• Criston murdering Joffrey in front of everyone with zero consequences. (Wish I could pull something like that off.)
• Rhaenys bursting through the floor of the dragonpit.
• Laenor's fake death.
• Rhaenyra's passiveness whilst Vaemond calls her a whore in court. Maybe so Daemon could have another cool moment.
• Alicent crowning Aegon based off a misunderstanding.
• Aemond accidentally killing Luke. (This one actually doesn't bother me that much, I just wanted a bloodthirsty Aemond.)
• NO SUNFYRE???????? Aegon II and Sunfyre have an insanely strong connection and I'll be disappointed if they don't explore that.
• Rape incident

All in all, I wasn't crazy about the 1st season of HOTD, but I feel positive about future seasons. For now, I prefer the first 4 seasons of GoT over s1 of HOTD.

This 10000000%. One of my friends wanted to watch GoT with me, but she didn't want to see the nudity and sex scenes so we used VidAngel. We were missing too many scenes with vital information so we gave up..

I'm assuming your friend is an adult so you should've just told her to grow up.

[Ser Arthurs Dawn]

6 hours ago, Areisius said:

I'm assuming your friend is an adult so you should've just told her to grow up.

Or I can respect her life choices, since she respects mine. But I should clarify, I was the one who asked her to give it a try since she originally had no interest in watching it, so I suggested using VidAngel for her own comfort. So she watched the show for my sake, and I used a "modesty blocker" for hers.  I guess you could say we compromised.

Edited September 4, 2023 by Ser Arthurs Dawn

[Dragon in the North]

I mostly liked House of the Dragon, except for two episodes, but I didn’t love it. While it’s my favorite of the new fantasy shows, it still doesn’t hold a candle to GOT. I suppose that could change, but reducing the second season to eight episodes is worrying. I feel like they still need to take time to develop the characters.

[The Grey Wolf Strikes Back]

Better than the latter seasons but not as good as the earlier ones. (Truth be told, I don't think there was ever any chance of HOTD S1 measuring up to GOT S1-4, not without taking more time to establish the lead-up to the Dance as opposed to cramming multiple time-skips into just 10 episodes.)

[EggBlue]

On 8/31/2023 at 5:51 PM, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

And the costumes. HOTD wigs are horrific, we all know that.  The costumes though..some of them looked cheap (mainly young Rhaenyra's) but I'm obsessed with the designs. And I was so happy they included jewelry. Side note, they need to let Olivia's Alicent wear a different color. We know she's a TeamGeen gal, they don't need to make her entire wardrobe one color to remind us of that.

My biggest pet peeve with HOTD are some inconsistencies with Rhaenyra and Alicent (and I'm talking older gals). One moment they're ruthless, decisive, and/or ambitious, and the next they're totally passive. But I did like the decision to change their relationship for the show though. And I hate what they've done to Criston, my lawd.

I know the books are unclear about certain events that take place, but it would have been nice if the showrunners had been more decisive on how far certain characters will go for their own motives. It seemed like they were shy about ruthless or harmful actions being carried out by main characters, so they would immediately try to redeem the perpetrator so viewers could once again sympathize with them. But that's just the vibe I was getting. Also, there were certain scenes that I felt were clumsy, unnecessary, or perhaps even out of place.

• Rhea Royce's death. Did the showrunners want us to believe Daemon killed her or not? Perhaps it was meant to be ambiguous and up for the viewer to decide, but all it did was get the Daemon fans to praise him for "mercy killing" her. Because I guess he went all that way just to stare at her for a few minutes.
• Criston murdering Joffrey in front of everyone with zero consequences. (Wish I could pull something like that off.)
• Rhaenys bursting through the floor of the dragonpit.
• Laenor's fake death.
• Rhaenyra's passiveness whilst Vaemond calls her a whore in court. Maybe so Daemon could have another cool moment.
• Alicent crowning Aegon based off a misunderstanding.
• Aemond accidentally killing Luke. (This one actually doesn't bother me that much, I just wanted a bloodthirsty Aemond.)
• NO SUNFYRE???????? Aegon II and Sunfyre have an insanely strong connection and I'll be disappointed if they don't explore that.
• Rape incident

All in all, I wasn't crazy about the 1st season of HOTD, but I feel positive about future seasons. For now, I prefer the first 4 seasons of GoT over s1 of HOTD.

I think the issue that irks me (and perhaps the others) about HOTD , isn't necessarily what they changed or their character choices that might differ from my interpretation of the book or the set-in-stone canon facts; rather it's that they're never bold about their choices in the show imo. which honestly leaves a confused vibe to the show and makes it more mediocre.

there are deliberate "bomb"s in the show that lack the impact due to repetition. for example, Joffrey's death scene or Rhaenys's thing in Ep9. these surprises are completely pointless. They don't add to the story. they are not Ned's death that leaves the whole GoT the show as the consequence! they're not the battle of Blackwater that leaves Stannis weak and ready to delve further into sorcery! they're not the Red Wedding! they are just the crazy thing of the week! they are only as good as the Supernatural's monster of the week! this really sucks because it's obvious that they have tried to make something memorable...then there's the bigger issue. that's the lack of boldness in writing, specifically regarding characters. there's this trend in shows today that they shy away from making a character unlikeable. they're trying to avoid backlash(this one is also on the our social media culture). Alicent's character comes to mind about that. I don't mind how they have changed her age. although that puts her in a more favorable position from the get-go as she is not an adult having a feud with a 7-14-year-old! but her actions during ep 8-10 are a bit odd. She is not consistent, and worse, she comes off as stupid, which couldn't be further from the truth given the power she's gotten herself as a queen consort when the king has a fully grown heir. then there's Viserys's marked hesitation in marrying Laena because of her age. which is pretty good and in character at that (even in the book twenty-something yr old Viserys did not want to marry a 12 yr old. he wanted to marry a woman, and any woman. a woman he's chosen) . but the show completely ignores that about what they emphasised about the character two scenes ago by having him wed Alicent , a 14-15 yr old and his daughter's friend at that. all while he looks 40 at the very least. 

On 8/31/2023 at 5:51 PM, Ser Arthurs Dawn said:

This 10000000%. One of my friends wanted to watch GoT with me, but she didn't want to see the nudity and sex scenes so we used VidAngel. We were missing too many scenes with vital information so we gave up..

VidAngel??????? is that some sort of voluntarily censorship?!!

[BlackLightning]

My only problem is that I feel like HotD needed two more episodes to tell the story

[Him of Many Faces]

Game of Thrones - we must stop fighting amongst ourselves and unite against the common enemy from the north

House of Dragon - we must stop fighting amongst ourselves and unite against the common enemy that is prophesized to eventually come from the north.

 

Both shows essentially tell the same story, only GoT told it in a more complex way with much more characters while HotD recycles the same plot with smaller cast, more dragons, less breasts and worse characters due to bad pacing and timejumps. Also HotD is not a story with its own purpose and meaning but content to give HBO (and George) a chance to compete with the other cinematic universes that are so popular nowadays.  

Rhaenys killing smallfolk during Aegon's crowing is on par with GoT's later season idiotic writing (Arya's bleeding aerobics in Braavos, Bad Pussy etc) so HotD is already at best as enjoyable as the final seasons of GoT - well made scenes and spectacle, but no cohesion in the narrative and occasional insults to the viewer's intelligence.  

 

Of course there's a chance season 2 will be a big improvement since they won't have to jump in time or invent "shocking" scenes since the material has plenty of them. I still remain skeptical.

 

 

 

 

[Ser Arthurs Dawn]

20 hours ago, Him of Many Faces said:

House of Dragon - we must stop fighting amongst ourselves and unite against the common enemy that is prophesized to eventually come from the north.

And this one is wild to me, because as of now, only Rhaenyra and Daemon know about it. "Guys, please! We have to work together for the greater good!"  "..Why?"  "Well, I can't tell you, it's a secret."

I do wonder why they show writers included the prophecy. Was it for ironic reasons? Did they want to replace Rhaenyra's ambition with some sort of "weight of responsibility"?