NBA - The upside down

[DMC]

2 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Nothing about this incident looks good for Rivers. Bamba did come off the bench though and threw punches. That's going to get you more (and you guys did benefit from what happened in game, so don't be too mad). Only an additional game is pretty fair since no one got hurt. Suggs, I mean personally I would have left it with the ejection, but I expected he'd catch a game too just because optics. Glad no one else got clipped. Frankly I wish they'd formally change the leaving the bench rule and relax the shit out of them. 

LOL.  You're acting like it's "fair" because of the bench rule while admitting two sentences later the bench rule needs to be changed.  Acting like Bamba deserves more because of the bench rule defies the logic of what actually happened.  Bamba only "left" the bench after Rivers initiated the confrontation by going over to the bench while the game was going on.

And please stop saying Orlando benefitted from what happened in the game.  It's simply not true and just you whining about the fact the Magic won that game and were clearly the better team that night.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

8 minutes ago, DMC said:

LOL.  You're acting like it's "fair" because of the bench rule while admitting two sentences later the bench rule needs to be changed.  Acting like Bamba deserves more because of the bench rule defies the logic of what actually happened.  Bamba only "left" the bench after Rivers initiated the confrontation by going over to the bench while the game was going on.

Dude, the video pretty clearly shows Bamba threw the first punch, or at least the first of significance. Idk what happened right before then or what was said before, but the fight explodes with Rivers getting hit and Bamba keeps punching him. So yeah, only one game more is fair at best.

My comment about bench suspensions is that I think they're dumb unless a player does something egregious. Simply stepping on the court when an incident happens shouldn't cost players anything if they don't do anything else. Hence why I said I'm happy they NBA showed some restraint when adjudicating this. 

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And please stop saying Orlando benefitted from what happened in the game.  It's simply not true and just you whining about the fact the Magic won that game and were clearly the better team that night.

It's true if you understand the situation. The team was already missing multiple key players including arguably their best one and then lost three more. They had to play two guys who I'm not sure I've ever heard of and a few more I have that you never want to see on the court for your team. And again, our primary ballhandler for the last month or so got hurt five minutes into the game. Given how depleted the team is it's surprising they actually made a late run in the game.

[Rhom]

Kyrie to the Mavs.

Well, good luck with that Luka.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

46 minutes ago, Rhom said:

Kyrie to the Mavs.

Well, good luck with that Luka.

That seems like a bad fit. The return isn't terrible for the Nets though. Curious to see if they trade KD as well (and Simmons seems like a lost cause at this point). 

[BigFatCoward]

1 hour ago, Rhom said:

Kyrie to the Mavs.

Well, good luck with that Luka.

'Give me the ball you fucking wanksplat, I'm much better than you at this' Luka for the rest of 2023. 

[Maithanet]

I don't know how kyrie could possibly command that kind of return.  Dinwiddie doesn't suck, and an unprotected first rounder way in the future is always a valuable lottery ticket (although if Luka is still there, the Mavs will not be drafting high).

[Calibandar]

I think its a lot to give up for the Mavericks considering Finney Smith has been a solid starter for several seasons and Dinwiddie has been good as well. This seems to create a gap at the small forward position but perhaps the idea is now to start Luka-Irving-Bullock and 2 others, of which Wood should be one.

On the other hand you can see why the Mavs need to do this, they need to be able to give Luka a breather now and then and Kyrie can handle a lot of scoring and ballhandling and given his play this year, is still a notable upgrade over Dinwiddie at the position.

ESPN is saying the Nets want to make more moves to strengthen their team around Durant this week , undoubtedly they are mighty fearful of another trade request coming. If it doesnt, I expect Durant just decided to play out the season and then try to leave again in the summer, I cannot see him staying there long term.

 

[DireWolfSpirit]

Kyrie irritates me as much as anyone. Still im semi intrigued with what he and Doncic can do in tandem. They said Doncic signed off on this move so he probably sees some possible potential.

[DMC]

7 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Dude, the video pretty clearly shows Bamba threw the first punch, or at least the first of significance. Idk what happened right before then or what was said before, but the fight explodes with Rivers getting hit and Bamba keeps punching him. So yeah, only one game more is fair at best.

DUDE, the video clearly shows Rivers instigating a physical altercation.  On the opponent's bench.  While the game was going on.  He's the one who started shit, if you can't get that I can't help you.  Clearly, Rivers was lying during his post-game presser when he said he was just going over there to "talk" to Bamba.  And indeed, his defense during that presser - that he just reacted and defended himself - is a far more credible excuse for Bamba than it is for Rivers.

7 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

It's true if you understand the situation.

LOL, no, it's you that is willfully failing to understand the situation.  Of the five players that were ejected, Suggs and Bamba were the two most productive and impactful during that game.  Rivers' box score to that point was 10 minutes, 1 assist, 1 foul, and zero points on 0-2 shooting.  Losing him meant nothing. 

As for having to use replacement players - yeah, so did the Magic.  Suggs was replaced by Kevon Harris for the next 8 minutes, and he's literally a G-League player.  And again, whining about losing Anderson is mitigated by Orlando losing Carter - who was replaced by Bamba, who then obviously they lost as well.  Not to mention you're eliding the fact Orlando was up by 10 with 13.5 minutes left in the game when the incident happened.

This boils down to you just whining about the Wolves not having KAT.  Which, ok, but that's been the case for two months and was entirely expected.  It didn't have any more "situational" or "contextual" effect on the game than the fact Jonathan Isaac is on a minutes limit.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

35 minutes ago, DMC said:

DUDE, the video clearly shows Rivers instigating a physical altercation. 

Yes we all agree on this, as I've said. Rivers clearly started it. But the video shown afterwards is Bamba repeatedly punching him. I have not seen a clear shot of what started things after Rivers ran up to their bench, but there are pretty clear ones afterwards and it's Mo mostly throwing the punches. Him getting more games should shock exactly no one.

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This boils down to you just whining about the Wolves not having KAT.  Which, ok, but that's been the case for two months and was entirely expected.  It didn't have any more "situational" or "contextual" effect on the game than the fact Jonathan Isaac is on a minutes limit.

No, we're also missing a few key rotational players and then lost four in the game, three to ejection and two of them were BS. I said at that point we're basically fucked because almost any other team would be too. 

[DMC]

1 minute ago, Tywin et al. said:

No, we're also missing a few key rotational players and then lost four in the game

Who?  As far as I can tell other than KAT the only Wolves player that didn't either play in that game or was a DNP-CD is Jordan McLaughlin.  Really sounds like you're making this shit up.

6 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

I said at that point we're basically fucked because almost any other team would be too.

LOL the Magic dealt with more injury adversity than what the Wolves were left with at the end of the game up until about three weeks ago.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

34 minutes ago, DMC said:

Who?  As far as I can tell other than KAT the only Wolves player that didn't either play in that game or was a DNP-CD is Jordan McLaughlin.  Really sounds like you're making this shit up.

Well Ant, to start, who has been injured for a month and has had to miss a few games and leave others early due to some hip thing. Same with Gobert who was just returning after missing some games. 

The Wolves have had bad injury luck this year. It happens. And when a hobbled team loses four players in a single game, yeah, they're probably fucked, like I said at the time.

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LOL the Magic dealt with more injury adversity than what the Wolves were left with at the end of the game up until about three weeks ago.

Three weeks ago? Cool story, it doesn't matter in a game a few days ago.

[Wilbur]

The Mavs are doing some out-of-the-box thinking to give up draft capital for Kyrie.

I give pretty low odds on a successful partnership lasting more than six weeks between him and Doncic before the sparks begin to fly.

[DMC]

2 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Well Ant, to start, who has been injured for a month and has had to miss a few games and leave others early due to some hip thing. Same with Gobert who was just returning after missing some games. 

So they "few key rotational players" you said were supposedly missing were Edwards and Gobert?  Who played a combined 64 minutes IN THE GAME.  In other words, you blatantly lied.

[Arakasi]

It’s debatable whether missing Towns actually hurts them. Certainly not this year. He’s the unenviable superstar that doesn’t seem to swing the teams record when he plays. I want to root for the guy considering his personal story but he doesn’t really do much to move the needle for that team.

[BigFatCoward]

did an all star ever move from one conference to the other after selection in the past, and did that affect which team they played for?

[Relic]

I know the Mavs are desperate to get some hall handling help for Luka, to avoid running him straight into the ground, and as far as that goes its hard to envision someone better for the task than Kyrie. When he plays. If he plays. Huge gamble, but would be interesting to watch IF Kyrie tried hard. And played. and shut the fuck up. and did his job. And wasnt the most annoying NBA player maybe ever. And yeah, played. 

[Proudfeet]

I'd have gotten Luka a player who can defend and just be able to finish on offense instead of someone sharing the ball less capably, but if Harden can play with Chris Paul then Luka can probably play with Kyrie. 

I'm not sure about giving up Finney-Smith though. The Mavs are already short on wings/guards, Kyrie is an upgrade on Dimwiddie, assuming he actually plays, sure, but who is taking Finney-Smith's minutes? Morris? Ew. 

1 hour ago, BigFatCoward said:

did an all star ever move from one conference to the other after selection in the past, and did that affect which team they played for?

I assume they'd play for their original conference but its captains picks now anyway.

[BigFatCoward]

1 minute ago, Proudfeet said:

 

I assume they'd play for their original conference but its captains picks now anyway.

Its a shame Lebron and Durant aren't the 2 captains, Kyrie would definitely be getting picked last. 

[Maithanet]

If that is the only big trade the Mavs make this year, I don't see how them as realistic contenders.  Maybe if things go incredibly well they could come out of the west, which is super weak this year.  But in a 7 game series against Boston or Milwaukee?  Hard to see that going well. 

Even winning the West is a really long shot. 

3 hours ago, Proudfeet said:

I'm not sure about giving up Finney-Smith though. The Mavs are already short on wings/guards, Kyrie is an upgrade on Dimwiddie, assuming he actually plays, sure, but who is taking Finney-Smith's minutes? Morris? Ew.

Agree completely.  The Mavs were a flawed team prior to the trade, and now they are just as flawed, but in different (and frankly, much more volatile) ways.  Luka and Irving are both below average defenders.  Building a team around two stars who are both negative defenders is really hard.  The only way to make it work is to stuff the rest of the team with defense first, team players.  But that is really not the team the Mavs have right now. 

I think this is gonna fail miserably.  I'm worried for the Mavs long term.